TimberXX
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Feb 4, 2005
- Messages
- 830
- Location
- Bergen County, NJ
- Tractor
- BCS 770 Italian 2 Wheel Tractor, Grillo 107d, BCS 853, Deere x350, Deere x730
Thanks for keeping this thread going. Very interesting.
Bcs 740 powersafe first run-in
- Thread starter Gatonakos
- Start date
- Views: 24574
Hi again 
Recently I passed 400 working hours on my BCS 740, which meant that it was again time for a bit of maintenance. According to the BCS manual, the transmission oil, including the filter, should be changed every 100 hours, and the magnetic oil cap should be cleaned as well.
The Honda owner’s manual also recommends an engine oil change every 100 hours, as well as cleaning the air filter.
I always remove the engine protection bar for better access to the 2 engine drain plugs, and while the oil drains, I remove the recoil starter and cleans it and the area behind it from debris.
This is how the magnetic oil cap looked this time:
Compared to the photo in post #20, there are perhaps slightly less metal particles this time, but I’m still puzzled that it is this much
Best regards
Jens
Recently I passed 400 working hours on my BCS 740, which meant that it was again time for a bit of maintenance. According to the BCS manual, the transmission oil, including the filter, should be changed every 100 hours, and the magnetic oil cap should be cleaned as well.
The Honda owner’s manual also recommends an engine oil change every 100 hours, as well as cleaning the air filter.
I always remove the engine protection bar for better access to the 2 engine drain plugs, and while the oil drains, I remove the recoil starter and cleans it and the area behind it from debris.
This is how the magnetic oil cap looked this time:
Compared to the photo in post #20, there are perhaps slightly less metal particles this time, but I’m still puzzled that it is this much
Best regards
Jens
NibbanaFarm
Silver Member
Jens, I changed the gear oil on my 739 last fall. I never did get an hour meter so don't know how many hours. But I think I remember changing it and the filter not too long after I bought the thing and thought it was probably time again. I had an empty filter box on the shelf that I kept for the part number and thought there was a filter in it so I didn't end up changing the filter since the box was empty.
Anyway, I was surprised to see a decent size chunk of what appeared to be the end of a gear tooth stuck to the magnet. Along with some fine splinters like you have there. Maybe a 5mm diameter piece of metal. Not round at all though really. I don't know where that came from other than me grinding some gears too hard. I think I do remember accidentally reversing under load. And I tried a couple times to "feather" in the pto engagement with the clutch.
If there's any metal in the hydraulic clutch pack, that could be where the fine stuff is coming from. That clutch must be under an unbelievable load instantly engaging and disengaging with the brake and all. I'm surprised it can even handle that abuse. Other than that, I think what you're seeing is perfectly normal. Every magnetic plug I take out of every component on every piece of equipment I work on always has fine metal particles on it. It's simply normal wear of machinery.
A BCS is completely rebuildable. All the parts are available AFAIK. If something catastrophic happens it can be fixed. No problem. Come to think of it I can't remember ever hearing about a BCS ever failing except for the motor. And the cone clutch seizing up. Have you ever heard of one braking?
Despite the piece of metal, mine still runs and operates as it should. I use mine all the time, some of the best money I ever spent. I couldn't get by without it. It will be interesting to see if any of us can wear one of these things out. Looks like prices have practically doubled due to inflation.
Anyway, I was surprised to see a decent size chunk of what appeared to be the end of a gear tooth stuck to the magnet. Along with some fine splinters like you have there. Maybe a 5mm diameter piece of metal. Not round at all though really. I don't know where that came from other than me grinding some gears too hard. I think I do remember accidentally reversing under load. And I tried a couple times to "feather" in the pto engagement with the clutch.
If there's any metal in the hydraulic clutch pack, that could be where the fine stuff is coming from. That clutch must be under an unbelievable load instantly engaging and disengaging with the brake and all. I'm surprised it can even handle that abuse. Other than that, I think what you're seeing is perfectly normal. Every magnetic plug I take out of every component on every piece of equipment I work on always has fine metal particles on it. It's simply normal wear of machinery.
A BCS is completely rebuildable. All the parts are available AFAIK. If something catastrophic happens it can be fixed. No problem. Come to think of it I can't remember ever hearing about a BCS ever failing except for the motor. And the cone clutch seizing up. Have you ever heard of one braking?
Despite the piece of metal, mine still runs and operates as it should. I use mine all the time, some of the best money I ever spent. I couldn't get by without it. It will be interesting to see if any of us can wear one of these things out. Looks like prices have practically doubled due to inflation.
Hi Nibbana
You are probably right, that the fine splinters on the magnet are what one has to accept as part of the normal wear of the tractor
At the first oil change I wasn’t that surprised, as I took the material on the magnet as part of the normal run-in procedure, but that it is still this much, surprises me a little - but OK. I can’t help to think if there are also some metal particles in the oil filter? Like you, I try to be as gentle to the gearbox as possible, but due to the simple sliding mesh gearbox that our tractors have, it takes quite a lot of experience and skill to avoid grinding the gears and PTO once in a while
That you have found a 5 mm piece of metal on the magnet doesn’t sound right to me. I would also guess that it is the tip of a gear wheel, either from the gearbox or from the PTO-mechanism.
One of the disadvantages of this type of gearbox, is that it is almost impossible to engage or change gear while moving. As my tractor was new, I did try to practice changing gear while on the move, but it takes a lot of skill and practice, so I decided to do all gear changes, all engagements of the PTO, and all changes of direction from a standstill. This hasn’t eliminated the occasional „grinding“, but it has reduced it a lot.
Sadly I have not been able to find anyone in my area that has a BCS tractor, so I only have the information in this great forum to compare with. These tractors are very well build, and to brake one will take a lot of malicious abuse, I imagine. If used as intended, your grandchildren will also be able to enjoy your tractor.
Looking at my BCS 740 sitting in a dry and warm garage after 13 years and 400 working hours, it still looks and runs like new. I feel confident that it will easily outlive me, and probably the next few owners as well
Best regards
Jens
You are probably right, that the fine splinters on the magnet are what one has to accept as part of the normal wear of the tractor
At the first oil change I wasn’t that surprised, as I took the material on the magnet as part of the normal run-in procedure, but that it is still this much, surprises me a little - but OK. I can’t help to think if there are also some metal particles in the oil filter? Like you, I try to be as gentle to the gearbox as possible, but due to the simple sliding mesh gearbox that our tractors have, it takes quite a lot of experience and skill to avoid grinding the gears and PTO once in a while
That you have found a 5 mm piece of metal on the magnet doesn’t sound right to me. I would also guess that it is the tip of a gear wheel, either from the gearbox or from the PTO-mechanism.
One of the disadvantages of this type of gearbox, is that it is almost impossible to engage or change gear while moving. As my tractor was new, I did try to practice changing gear while on the move, but it takes a lot of skill and practice, so I decided to do all gear changes, all engagements of the PTO, and all changes of direction from a standstill. This hasn’t eliminated the occasional „grinding“, but it has reduced it a lot.
Sadly I have not been able to find anyone in my area that has a BCS tractor, so I only have the information in this great forum to compare with. These tractors are very well build, and to brake one will take a lot of malicious abuse, I imagine. If used as intended, your grandchildren will also be able to enjoy your tractor.
Looking at my BCS 740 sitting in a dry and warm garage after 13 years and 400 working hours, it still looks and runs like new. I feel confident that it will easily outlive me, and probably the next few owners as well
Best regards
Jens
NibbanaFarm
Silver Member
Jens,
I do think that piece of metal I found was probably the corner of a gear tooth. Thinking about it, when I first got the tractor I didn't know how to properly engage the pto and would sometimes try to "feather" it in with the clutch. (Have since learned the correct way from Earthtools videos.) You just can't "feather" these hydraulic clutches. And a couple/few times it did go in hard. Another time I was mowing an all too steep slope next to the pond with the sickle bar. I was going down toward the water and the thing started to get away from me. Had to keep my footing pretty square just to keep me and the machine from going head over heels down the slope and into the water. Well I sort of lost my footing and started to stumble and temporarily losing my presence of mind I guess I just instinctively grabbed for the reversing lever and shifted from forward to reverse without the clutch. Luckily the engine rpm was pretty low but it did hammer those gears pretty good. That one could have chipped a tooth for sure. I've stalled the whole machine instantly a few times from getting a rock in the rotary plow. Maybe 1/2 to 3/4 throttle those times. Didn't seem to phase it and started right back up.
They do seem to take an insane amount of abuse without complaining. I'm always working on my Troy-Bilt snowblower and Cub Cadet lawn tractor just to keep them working reasonably well. Not to mention the 2 stroke toys. But that BCS just keeps on doing it's job with nothing but a tank of fuel.
I think I got mine in 2014 so 10 years old now. I'm a lot easier on it now that I've learned how to use it properly. Back then BCS didn't have any good videos and it took me a while to discover EarthTools website and videos. And this great forum. The BCS manuals I got were next to worthless as they didn't even include one for my tractor. The dealer gave me a stack of manuals about 3 inches high that covered just about everything except my tractor. And even if you have the right one those manuals aren't too helpful. The Honda engine manual was pretty good though.
I guess the clutch could wear out. BCS has an instruction sheet somewhere on how to replace that. I remember there's a left hand thread in there somewhere. I've broke my parking brake lever twice from snapping it back off rather than releasing it gently. Lucking it's cast aluminum so I just welded it to repair.
I don't know anyone personally that owns one either. But I know they're out there because I occasionally see BCS equipment on craigslist. Now that I have my duals I'm pretty much set up to do what I want. I do want to get a cultivator working for me. I modified one to pull behind the tractor but haven't tried it yet. This is it. Brinly-Hardy 18-40 in. Sleeve Hitch Adjustable Tow-Behind Cultivator CC-55BH - The Home Depot
Nibbana
I do think that piece of metal I found was probably the corner of a gear tooth. Thinking about it, when I first got the tractor I didn't know how to properly engage the pto and would sometimes try to "feather" it in with the clutch. (Have since learned the correct way from Earthtools videos.) You just can't "feather" these hydraulic clutches. And a couple/few times it did go in hard. Another time I was mowing an all too steep slope next to the pond with the sickle bar. I was going down toward the water and the thing started to get away from me. Had to keep my footing pretty square just to keep me and the machine from going head over heels down the slope and into the water. Well I sort of lost my footing and started to stumble and temporarily losing my presence of mind I guess I just instinctively grabbed for the reversing lever and shifted from forward to reverse without the clutch. Luckily the engine rpm was pretty low but it did hammer those gears pretty good. That one could have chipped a tooth for sure. I've stalled the whole machine instantly a few times from getting a rock in the rotary plow. Maybe 1/2 to 3/4 throttle those times. Didn't seem to phase it and started right back up.
They do seem to take an insane amount of abuse without complaining. I'm always working on my Troy-Bilt snowblower and Cub Cadet lawn tractor just to keep them working reasonably well. Not to mention the 2 stroke toys. But that BCS just keeps on doing it's job with nothing but a tank of fuel.
I think I got mine in 2014 so 10 years old now. I'm a lot easier on it now that I've learned how to use it properly. Back then BCS didn't have any good videos and it took me a while to discover EarthTools website and videos. And this great forum. The BCS manuals I got were next to worthless as they didn't even include one for my tractor. The dealer gave me a stack of manuals about 3 inches high that covered just about everything except my tractor. And even if you have the right one those manuals aren't too helpful. The Honda engine manual was pretty good though.
I guess the clutch could wear out. BCS has an instruction sheet somewhere on how to replace that. I remember there's a left hand thread in there somewhere. I've broke my parking brake lever twice from snapping it back off rather than releasing it gently. Lucking it's cast aluminum so I just welded it to repair.
I don't know anyone personally that owns one either. But I know they're out there because I occasionally see BCS equipment on craigslist. Now that I have my duals I'm pretty much set up to do what I want. I do want to get a cultivator working for me. I modified one to pull behind the tractor but haven't tried it yet. This is it. Brinly-Hardy 18-40 in. Sleeve Hitch Adjustable Tow-Behind Cultivator CC-55BH - The Home Depot
Nibbana
joecoin
Gold Member
I have a similar cultivator except mine has the tines attached via force fit wedges.
I pull it with my Steiner 420 with a cat 0 hitch.
I use a Aldo Biagioli cultivator with my Grillo 107d. It works great. I do have a small garden, maybe 1,000 sq feet.
NibbanaFarm
Silver Member
Joecoin,
Do you have a link for the Aldo Biagioli cultivator? Where did you get it?
I have about 2000 square foot garden and need some power cultivation.
Nibbana
joecoin
Gold Member
I got it from Earth Tools.
Tool Bar/Cultivators - Earth Tools
Clamp-on shanks with standard reversible 1½” wide chisels, adjustable angle and two adjustable depth wheels
www.earthtools.com
Hi
As I wrote in post #18 in the following thread recently, I have been blessed with good luck for most of the 13 years that I have had my BCS 740:
Zanon ZRF 1000 drum mower
I have only had minor issues like a flat tire or a broken starter rope - that is until October 30th, when the above mentioned damage happened to my Zanon drum mower
Only 5 days later bad luck struck again, this time hitting the tractor itself. At the end of a job with the drum mower, the handlebars felt „spongy“, especially in the vertical direction. As I had parked the tractor on the trailer, and removed the blue plastic bit that covers the handlebar assembly, I saw the following:
The left photo shows the left hand side of the handlebar assembly where it swivels around the vertical post. The right photo shows the right hand side.
I am of course aware that this is a part of the handlebar assembly that has to cope with quite a lot of stress, especially when working with heavy implements like the flail mower or the drum mower. Still, I was a bit surprised to see this.
This topic was mentioned more than 4 years ago in the „Berta flail mower“ thread, where our member „ppea“ expressed his concerns regarding the risk of braking the handlebars when working with heavy implements. I have had similar concerns over the years, especially with the flail mower and the drum mower, as they are quite heavy, weighing 92 kg/203 lbs and 80 kg/176 lbs respectively. Pressing hard on the handlebars to get these heavy implements off the ground, of course puts a lot of stress on the lower part of the handlebar assembly where it meets the vertical post. Up till now I thought it was up to the job, but it wasn’t anymore
As with the drum mower recently, my neighbor had a look, and with his lifelong experience working in a machine shop, he had a to me surprising comment concerning the welding on the right hand side: „It’s not the handlebar assembly that has broken, it’s the welding!“ I’m no expert on weldings, but to me there is a clear difference between the two sides of the handlebars. On the left hand side the welding seems to be intact, whereas on the right hand side, it seems to me that the welding has given in, and the assembly itself is still intact. This can perhaps be seen even better on this photo taken from above:
For a professional welder like my neighbor it was no big deal to weld both sides again, and in the future I will need to keep an eye on these parts more often
Best regards
Jens
As I wrote in post #18 in the following thread recently, I have been blessed with good luck for most of the 13 years that I have had my BCS 740:
Zanon ZRF 1000 drum mower
I have only had minor issues like a flat tire or a broken starter rope - that is until October 30th, when the above mentioned damage happened to my Zanon drum mower
Only 5 days later bad luck struck again, this time hitting the tractor itself. At the end of a job with the drum mower, the handlebars felt „spongy“, especially in the vertical direction. As I had parked the tractor on the trailer, and removed the blue plastic bit that covers the handlebar assembly, I saw the following:
The left photo shows the left hand side of the handlebar assembly where it swivels around the vertical post. The right photo shows the right hand side.
I am of course aware that this is a part of the handlebar assembly that has to cope with quite a lot of stress, especially when working with heavy implements like the flail mower or the drum mower. Still, I was a bit surprised to see this.
This topic was mentioned more than 4 years ago in the „Berta flail mower“ thread, where our member „ppea“ expressed his concerns regarding the risk of braking the handlebars when working with heavy implements. I have had similar concerns over the years, especially with the flail mower and the drum mower, as they are quite heavy, weighing 92 kg/203 lbs and 80 kg/176 lbs respectively. Pressing hard on the handlebars to get these heavy implements off the ground, of course puts a lot of stress on the lower part of the handlebar assembly where it meets the vertical post. Up till now I thought it was up to the job, but it wasn’t anymore
As with the drum mower recently, my neighbor had a look, and with his lifelong experience working in a machine shop, he had a to me surprising comment concerning the welding on the right hand side: „It’s not the handlebar assembly that has broken, it’s the welding!“ I’m no expert on weldings, but to me there is a clear difference between the two sides of the handlebars. On the left hand side the welding seems to be intact, whereas on the right hand side, it seems to me that the welding has given in, and the assembly itself is still intact. This can perhaps be seen even better on this photo taken from above:
For a professional welder like my neighbor it was no big deal to weld both sides again, and in the future I will need to keep an eye on these parts more often
Best regards
Jens
NibbanaFarm
Silver Member
Looks like the plate sheared on the left side and the weld started to crack on the right Jens. Did you take the assembly off or did your neighbor weld it on the tractor?
Hi again Nibbana
I think you are absolutely right!
If you look carefully on the left photo, you might notice a little dark patch on the left hand side of the crack. That spot was a little bit rusty, which might indicate that it had been there for a while, and that the troubles probably started there. As more of the left hand side started to fail, things probably happened pretty fast, quickly spreading to the right hand side, with an end result as shown.
I like to think that I look after my tractor and my implements pretty well, and try my best to take good care of them. I therefore still find it difficult to forgive myself for not seeing this at an earlier stage. It should be no excuse on my part, but the fact that most of the handlebar assembly is hidden out of view by a plastic cover, does make it difficult. Now that I’m aware of the problem, I will remove this cover more often, and do a thorough inspektion. Had I seen the first little crack on the left hand side much earlier, it would have been easy to repair and at the same time make the weldings a bit stronger
Being used to work in a proper shop, my neighbor wanted me to bring him only the broken parts that he had to weld of course, so he could work with them on his bench. Removing the handlebar assembly is quite a job I assume, because all the cables (11 in total!) have to be disconnected. In the end we made a few metal hooks holding the cables, and then tore them to the side and out of harms way with straps. His concern was of course that he might damage the many plastic bits and the cables, with the heat while welding. We covered all plastic and cables with wet rags, and only left enough metal exposed for him to work with the angle grinder and the welding machine. - It almost looked like the surgery room of a hospital as he started working
The working conditions that my neighbor had were certainly not optimal, and he wasn’t able to work to his normal high standards, but I’m very pleased with the result, and with the fact that I didn’t have to tear apart the whole tractor.
This is the left hand side after welding and painting:
Best regards
Jens
I think you are absolutely right!
If you look carefully on the left photo, you might notice a little dark patch on the left hand side of the crack. That spot was a little bit rusty, which might indicate that it had been there for a while, and that the troubles probably started there. As more of the left hand side started to fail, things probably happened pretty fast, quickly spreading to the right hand side, with an end result as shown.
I like to think that I look after my tractor and my implements pretty well, and try my best to take good care of them. I therefore still find it difficult to forgive myself for not seeing this at an earlier stage. It should be no excuse on my part, but the fact that most of the handlebar assembly is hidden out of view by a plastic cover, does make it difficult. Now that I’m aware of the problem, I will remove this cover more often, and do a thorough inspektion. Had I seen the first little crack on the left hand side much earlier, it would have been easy to repair and at the same time make the weldings a bit stronger
Being used to work in a proper shop, my neighbor wanted me to bring him only the broken parts that he had to weld of course, so he could work with them on his bench. Removing the handlebar assembly is quite a job I assume, because all the cables (11 in total!) have to be disconnected. In the end we made a few metal hooks holding the cables, and then tore them to the side and out of harms way with straps. His concern was of course that he might damage the many plastic bits and the cables, with the heat while welding. We covered all plastic and cables with wet rags, and only left enough metal exposed for him to work with the angle grinder and the welding machine. - It almost looked like the surgery room of a hospital as he started working
The working conditions that my neighbor had were certainly not optimal, and he wasn’t able to work to his normal high standards, but I’m very pleased with the result, and with the fact that I didn’t have to tear apart the whole tractor.
This is the left hand side after welding and painting:
Best regards
Jens
NibbanaFarm
Silver Member
Looks like the handlebar turning release cable is the one you have to worry about the most. I would get a piece of automotive fuel line, slit it lengthwise, and slip it on that cable to protect it. Fuel line can stand a lot of heat. Then try to get a little fiberglass insulation in there too. But you probably don't have to worry about it now.
Here are some similar links:
