Battery based electric vehicles of today and tomorrow.

[Gale Hawkins]

Gale probably has covered this, but if not, a nice read for morning coffee.....

The battery invented 120 years before its time

Olde = New , finally....

Rgds, D.

EV's almost had a shot 120 years ago. A lot of history gets buried over time.

 

[sd455dan]

New Video

Cough

We will need oil for another couple decades, at least.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

New Video

Cough

We will need oil for another couple decades, at least.

I am starting to think it will be 2050 after the baby boom generation has long passed on. This type of video will play billions of times in schools around the world for the next 30 years. Gas engines are expected to be in production until 2050 in some parts of the world.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

I think the move from 12v to 48v automotive systems is long over due. GM was going to 42 volts years ago but was never able to make it a reality.

Improving vehicle production rates to the point that fewer factories will be needed in the world was a new thought to me. Now I see how Telsa is able to keep cutting the price of the same car and do it profitably.

 

[Grumpycat]

I think the move from 12v to 48v automotive systems is long over due. GM was going to 42 volts years ago but was never able to make it a reality.

Improving vehicle production rates to the point that fewer factories will be needed in the world was a new thought to me. Now I see how Telsa is able to keep cutting the price of the same car and do it profitably.

Tesla has gone through several generations on their production lines already because their original idealism didn't work.

42V is the same sort of idealism. In paper it is the perfect solution. Voltage stays below the 50VDC accepted human-safe threshold even when charging (48V exceeds). But in practice all new bulbs, radios, door lifts, solenoids, at least 100 components over and above the battery must be designed and tested, limiting the economy of scale and broad selection of vendors and components. All to save a bit on wire?

Then consider the current lead-acid battery has (6) cells where a 42V would require 21 and 24 for 48V. LiFePO4 would still be 11 and 12 cells. So what? Typical failure mode of existing lead battery is when one cell shorts. Gee, the other 5 are still perfectly good but only one brought the whole battery down. 21 cells will only shorten the time before one of the 21 decides to fail. Don't want to use (4) 12V batteries because if one fails all 4 would have to be replaced to keep the cells matched.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

https://www.powerelectronicsnews.com/electric-vehicles-48v-is-the-new-12v/

Understanding this change is going to expend or dim my 70 year old brain. : )

Reducing the need to run so many wiring bundles and using smaller gauge wire when it is required should cut cost and weight. Planning to be building 20 million EV's a year by 2030 this could lower the cost of Tesla vehicles by billions of dollars in time and materials and give better service on the moon and Mars.

 

[Industrial Toys]

Seems a lot of people are "Discovering" technology traps.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

You are new at this.

Let me sell you options on land I control which Disney will have to have shortly to expand Disney World!
Also have shares of the Brooklyn Bridge for sale.

Every month or two somebody has a "breakthrough which is going to revolutionize the EV market!" Quite frankly only Tesla has been able to deliver.

I'm so old at this that when I was a kid the only options were the zinc-carbon dry cell and the lead acid wet cell. Battery technology has progressed since WWII, and there is every reason to think it will continue to progress. Better batteries have already revolutionized the EV market, and there is every reason to think that progress will continue. I submit that you have no context for your opinion.

Meanwhile, if we continue burning fossil fuels we face the prospect of making vast areas of our planet uninhabitable. If you think a few thousand people on our southern border are a problem, wait until they are a few million climate refugees.

 

[dragoneggs]

I recently purchased two 100amp hour 'Battleborn' LiFePO4 batteries to upgrade my Class C RV lead-acid. Very impressed with getting double the power at half the weight. Does come at a price though!

Busy building new 1/0 custom wire lengths. Thought it would be a simple plug and play but of course the battery dimensions and terminal locations are different enough that I have to make new wire connections.

 

[Grumpycat]

https://www.powerelectronicsnews.com/electric-vehicles-48v-is-the-new-12v/

Understanding this change is going to expend or dim my 70 year old brain. : )

Reducing the need to run so many wiring bundles and using smaller gauge wire when it is required should cut cost and weight. Planning to be building 20 million EV's a year by 2030 this could lower the cost of Tesla vehicles by billions of dollars in time and materials and give better service on the moon and Mars.

Yes but the author is a talker not a doer. Read his biography at the bottom. "Maurizio has worked in the research field of gravitational waves and in space research projects as a design engineer. ..." Yes, a theoretical physicist.

48V is not going to reduce the number of wiring bundles.

He has fantasies about using DC-DC converters to eliminate the small battery by deriving the voltage from 400-800V batteries with no understanding of why your LEAF, my Tesla, Prius, etc, use two batteries: The 12V battery is used to "boot" the high voltage battery which remains safely disconnected until the 12V battery starts the computer to monitor the high voltage battery.

This is a case of intellectuals thinking they are so smart because they thought of something and are intellectuals so that is that.

Lets get back to basics. There are advantages to higher voltages, but there are disadvantages too. 50V is deemed the safe limit for human contact beyond that requires extra measures. 42V is where one needs to be to stay under 50V when charging.

None of the articles supporting 48V have quantified its supposed benefit. Just how much does a 12V wiring loom weigh? And how much would a 48V loom weigh?

Consider LEDs? An LED is a current device (control it with current not voltage) which operates around 3V. We get away with using LEDs on 12V systems by wiring 4 devices in series. So now one needs 16 in series to tolerate 48V? This is making things more complex.