Battery based electric vehicles of today and tomorrow.

[Hay Dude]

Thanks for seeing the light.

Meaning……?????
EVs wont be hauling the loads, either.

 

[RoyJackson]

They have a strict, authoritarian control.

yep, so did Germany in 1933

 

[DieselBound]

Not everything sold in WalMart is made in China and not everything sold at small stores is made in USA.
Its up to the BUYER to read the label.
I guess the Chinese flying bombers over Taiwan is a peaceful act?
And trying to buy off American college professors, being caught in acts of espionage and patent infringement, sometimes on top secret information is just peaceful commerce? Have you ever seen the backlog of patent infringement cases against them?

OhhhhKayyyy

No doubt theyre modernizing at an amazing pace. I wont argue with that. I wish we could do that by attracting more business here and tax them at a reasonable level.

You do know that Taiwan is PART of China, right? And the US doing this is? All this China bashing does NOTHING to improve our own lives here in the US: it's an excuse; works really well to bilk US taxpayers out of money for "defense".

 

[Hay Dude]

You do know that Taiwan is PART of China, right? And the US doing this is? All this China bashing does NOTHING to improve our own lives here in the US: it's an excuse; works really well to bilk US taxpayers out of money for "defense".

Ummm no its a sovereign nation

“Taiwan is Taiwan, and China is China. They are different countries, and Taiwan is not a part of China. There has not been a single day in the 55 years since the establishment of the People's Republic of China (PRC) in 1949 that China has had effective control of Taiwan.

Taiwan can be considered a nation in today's world -- it fulfills all requirements for nationhood according to international law. Taiwan has a population of 23 million people and has sovereignty over, and effective control of, the defined territory of Taiwan, Penghu, Kinmen and Matsu. These areas are controlled by a government which has the right to form policies and the ability to conduct diplomatic, economic and other types of exchanges with other countries throughout the world.

From the perspective of international law, Taiwan ceased to be a part of China in 1895. Over the years Taiwan has evolved into a country in its own right. During the course of this development there have been a number of important milestones.”

Source: UNPO: Taiwan is a modern, sovereign nation


And BTW: I’m not bashing China. I’m saying we better get off their teat real fast, or we really, I mean REALLY wont survive if they want to screw with us. I dont like that. Do you? I like the ability to a least survive on my own. I may not thrive, but I’d like to survive. Its a matter of national security that we can build our own EVs or ICEVs

I dont want an America with streets cluttered with Chinese EVs, all to soothe the feelings of the “world is ending in 9 years” emotional types.

 

[DieselBound]

Look Gale, trying to put words in my mouth isnt the way to go. I just showed you CA is cutting off the sale of ICEV in about a decade. That alone will cut the sales of ICEV down 10-15% just based on population statistics (CA is 10-15% of US population). That pretty much signals the end, as states that want to be like CA will likely follow.
When you say theres no reason to mandate, be sure to remember, it already IS mandated with CA forcing the end of the sale of ICEVs.
I’m all for markets determining whats better.
But you know putting an end to a competitors production isnt a mandate to buy EVs, its a mandate to destroy the competition. Which at the end of the day, is the same thing.

You are correct that China has been spoon feeding us everything we need for quite some time. With the probable end of American GM and Ford jobs building cars and all the support systems that exist around the ICEV, we are possibly putting the final nails in the coffin of the American experiment. We will lose our independence. There will be little industrial production left, but a few token industries. Chinese built or cars with majority Chinese parts will become the norm here.

If you view that as a “win” or “progress”, then you and I view the world quite differently.
I’d rather see a market based competition with NO mandates to see what the people chose, not one small group of people who may or may not have this countries best interests in mind.

Let's be honest here, OK?

US is spoon-feeding the entire world with worthless, backed by nothing but the "good faith" of the US govt (controlled by the bankers and corporations), USD. In return its "US population" gets actual products and resources (finite stuff that seems too precious to give away for worthless paper).

Wait until the natural consequences of the USD fiat currency come to a close. THIS will have nothing to do with China: other than they, Russia, Iran and it's looking more an more like it every day, India, push away from SWIFT and into their own trading system- this diminishes the need for USD, and will push it toward a tipping point.

Complaining that our govt is pushing EVs on us while accepting the our govt is pushing USDs on China seems to be a bit uneven. <- While perhaps no specifically stated, it is, nonetheless, the facts on the ground.

 

[Cat385B]

This thread is about electric vehicles. Political opinions are worse than normal opinions because they come from the body part we relate to opinions.

The Silverado EV was introduced, it seems the Avalanche is back.

 

[DieselBound]

Ummm no its a sovereign nation

“Taiwan is Taiwan, and China is China. They are different countries, and Taiwan is not a part of China. There has not been a single day in the 55 years since the establishment of the People's Republic of China (PRC) in 1949 that China has had effective control of Taiwan.

Taiwan can be considered a nation in today's world -- it fulfills all requirements for nationhood according to international law. Taiwan has a population of 23 million people and has sovereignty over, and effective control of, the defined territory of Taiwan, Penghu, Kinmen and Matsu. These areas are controlled by a government which has the right to form policies and the ability to conduct diplomatic, economic and other types of exchanges with other countries throughout the world.

From the perspective of international law, Taiwan ceased to be a part of China in 1895. Over the years Taiwan has evolved into a country in its own right. During the course of this development there have been a number of important milestones.”

Source: UNPO: Taiwan is a modern, sovereign nation


And BTW: I’m not bashing China. I’m saying we better get off their teat real fast, or we really, I mean REALLY wont survive if they want to screw with us. I dont like that. Do you? I like the ability to a least survive on my own. I may not thrive, but I’d like to survive.

I dont want an America with streets cluttered with Chinese EVs, all to sooth the feelings of the “world is ending in 9 years” emotional types.

UNPO is????

Japan messed things up: part of their terror campaign against China. China was backward and had little ability to flex in the international community up until recently. Think about whether China could make a claim that Puerto Rico isn't part of the US: want to talk about a really messed up situation?

Here's the standing OFFICIAL US policy

Foreign Relations of the United States, 1969–1976, Volume XVII, China, 1969–1972 - Office of the Historian

Simple overview:
International Law Is Taiwan’s Enemy

I don't give a rat's behind about other countries. I just spot festering propaganda that's meant to eat away at our brains so that we don't see the thieves among us (the power elite). If Communism is so bad then let it crash and burn on its own (like Cuba- do we really have to spend decades and countless dollars trying to overthrow its government?).

Last I'll say on this. But know this, much is PROJECTION, and it's totally working in opposition to what the proponent/projectioner thinks: for every action... (<- why it's stupid to be applying any energy to ousting Cuba's government; it only provides rallying support; one could almost think that the real objective is to keep people outraged such that they don't notice that their pockets are being picked for "defense" reasons).

As others have stated, markets will have to shift. Either folks in the US collectively, yes, COLLECTIVELY (sounds a bit socialist, no? sorry, but that's the basis for any group) decide to alter policies to promote local production. I don't think that we have to paint others ugly in order to do the right thing. Again, when the wheels fall off the USD it'll be pay-back (and I won't blame others).

 

[Hay Dude]

“UNPO is???”
Open the link?

 

[Hay Dude]

I’d say it’s smarter than sending our dollars to a bunch of jihadist supporters in Saudi Arabia.
…then again, China doesn’t buy as much military equipment from the US as they do.

Didn’t know China bought any military equipment from us….
Energy independence would be a walk in the park for the US to achieve. If its used to power EV or ICEV, it could all be in the palm of our hands

 

[DieselBound]

Haydude made a good point I never considered before...

The EV revolution (gales words not mine) does just transfer our wealth to china.

Is this a smart move?

Trading worthless USDs for goods?

The entire world knows that the USD is going to collapse. I'd speculate that a lot of the Green push has to do with limiting/controlling that impact: consider that the majority of the worlds trade value is in energy, fossil fuels, and that the USD is the currency used to engage in that trade (US gets to skim transactions- it's a great gig). No more do people believe that oil is infinite and as such the perceived value against the USD is only going to go up. Discrediting oil is a way of diminishing that trend. These are the facts. What we do with them is the issue: I will NOT pretend that I have "answers" (anyone who does is a false prophet).

The US opted to spend trillions on wars and "defense" spending while others spent on increasing trade capabilities.

 

[DieselBound]

“UNPO is???”
Open the link?

They're an "organization," NGO style. They are not the UN, NOT a legal body. Refer to the actual governing positions (essentially legal policies) by the US and Japan vis a vis Taiwan.

Look at these folks. I mean, really? These are the folks that you're going to follow into a war against China?

UNPO: The team

 

[DieselBound]

Maybe, or it continues to adapt in a way that the Soviet Union never was able to, Gorbachev tryed to reform but it collapsed into a more or less bandit state where small groups stole state property and got sickening rich and leaving the citizens broke.

Yes, China is actually socializing it's Communism. Folks stuck in the Vietnam-Commie era mindset will be forever incapable of understanding the difference. Socialism is something that MANY early farming communities would engage in to help sustain themselves collectively: look up Grange; co-ops; church organizations are also a form.

The US actually screwed up Russia in the attempts by the West to rape Russia: US actually boasted of interfering in their elections- helping to get the POS Yelsin reelected. Putin is the demon because he wouldn't continue the country's wealth to be extracted by the West: allowed the oligarchs to stay out of jail if they kept their wealth in Russia- only way to try an hold the country together until it got firmly on its feet. People continue to believe that Russia is communist.

I'm all for folks being given the opportunity to improve. Demonizing and stopping discussions does NOT work toward such ends.

 

[DieselBound]

They have a strict, authoritarian control.

Why are you so hung up on China? To me this sounds like projection, in that if you had your way you would force your views on them.

How about reporting on how to IMPROVE the US? If we have to trash China in order to do that then perhaps the US isn't as great as we've been programmed to believe it is? There's the Low Road and then there's the High Road...

 

[DieselBound]

Didn’t know China bought any military equipment from us….
Energy independence would be a walk in the park for the US to achieve. If its used to power EV or ICEV, it could all be in the palm of our hands

Energy independence using? Are you old enough to see all the growth that's happened around you to understand there's this thing called growth and that perpetual growth is NOT possible? So, it's about FOR HOW LONG that independence can happen. Long enough for the usual US oligarchs to rack in more wealth and then walk away saying that things just didn't work out? Promotion of growth which will make that moment happen faster?

Strength through exhaustion. A rather bad strategy.

 

[Rebeldad1]

Since all of you pro gas and diesel guys are fact based....

You have brought up lots of reasons not to embrace EV's into our infrastructure.
EV pollution from manufacturing. Overloading a already failing electrical power system and much more.

If you will... answer this for me.
#1. On a daily basis how much gas and diesel is used daily on 0-150 mile trips? This should also include those big boy diesels delivering heavy cargo and equipment as well.

#2. What US EV manufacture cannot do this on a daily basis?

 

[airbiscuit]

https://fordauthority.com/2022/01/ford-sold-27k-units-of-the-mustang-mach-e-to-americans-in-2021/

Sounds like Tesla now has Ford's attention.

I found this interesting.

The 2021 Ford Mustang Mach-E has thus far been a hit with critics and consumers alike, ranking as one of the top considered electrified vehicles as over 90 percent of owners previously said they would recommend the EV crossover to others.

 

[ruffdog]

To help boost electricity in the area, 10 wind turbines (673 feet tall) may be built nearby.

State’s tallest wind turbines could be along Rock-Walworth county line

 

[Hay Dude]

To help boost electricity in the area, 10 wind turbines (673 feet tall) may be built nearby.

State’s tallest wind turbines could be along Rock-Walworth county line

My only wish would be that the wind turbines are made in USA.

An interesting piece from the article

“…the state has not seen a wind farm proposal larger than 100 megawatts in the past 12 years.”
Not profitable? Or trying to avoid all the red tape of 100MW or larger?

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Meaning……?????
EVs wont be hauling the loads, either.

Future fossil fuel costs. It's not about EVs but about saving some fossil fuel for the coming centuries. Teslas use lube and oil filters.