Backhoe for L4740

[JeffInCO]

First, I'd like to thanks everyone here at TractorByNet for all of your help with regard to my tractor purchase. I finally settled on a new L4740, with a loader, and a few other options. The 4740 is on the dealer's lot, but I'll have to wait a few weeks for options to be ordered and installed.

There's one remaining major decision I need to make. I have a number of uses for a backhoe, and I am definitely going to purchase one. The question is which one and new or used. So here's my questions:

1) On paper, the Woods BH90-X looks like a slightly better backhoe in terms of specs and features. However, because it's non-Kubota, I wonder if there are potential issues integrating it with the tractor. As it turns out, the dealer from which I'm buying the tractor is not a Woods dealer, so I guess I'd have to take my tractor to a woods/kubota dealer for installation?

2) Is the BH90-X's curved boom a major advantage?

3) I'm having a very hard time locating used backhoes. I found one Kubota BH90 far from me on Craigslist, but I can't seem to figure out a way to find them at dealers, short of calling around (which I've already done in my immediate vicinity). Neither equipmentlocater.com nor tractorhouse.com seem to have a way to search for backhoes. Maybe dealers don't typically list them? Any ideas as to other places I might look for used, either Woods or Kubota?

Thanks,

Jeff

 

[canoetrpr]

I've been keeping an eye open for used backhoes myself and really don't see many come up for sale. Part of the problem is that i would want a sub-frame that fits my tractor. If I got a good deal on a 3 pt backhoe, I'd purchase it and try to come up with a sub-frame on my own.

I have pondered buying new, and continue to ponder it. Really can't justify the expense at this point vs. other things that need to be bought for the house. Really wish I had done it back when I got the tractor.

On new, I have narrowed it down to a Woods BH80X myself. Seems to be one generation newer than the equivalent Kubota backhoe. There will be no integration problems IMHO. A LOT of people use the Woods backhoes on Kubota tractors and in the grand scheme of it, there isn't that much rocket science. The BH90X seems quite well suited to the Grand L models.

I would recommend asking your selling dealer to price out the Kubota BH90 and what it would cost to add on to your purchase, and then to get a Woods dealer to price out a BH90X with installation. Since your machine is being setup, you might find that the savings are substantial getting the Kubota model. I don't think that I would notice much of a difference for my hobbiest uses and between the two I'd go with the one that was cheaper.

Just MHO.

 

[rbargeron]

It has always been hit-or-miss finding a used subframe-type backhoe - either at a dealer or anywhere else. The reason is they are usually dealer-installed on new tractors and taking it off requires swapping some original loader struts for the subframe. Most dealers would rather not bother ordering all the bits and pieces - it just adds cost on a used item that will compete with selling a new one - so it is a rare occurrence.

A low-net-cost way to get a used backhoe for your tractor is to buy a used tractor with one - then sell the left over tractor.

 

[Happyman]

I have the curved boom BH90-X on my L3940...what a great "Hoe" she is!
Go for a new, dealer installed backhoe. That's MY $.02

 

[Samandothers]

I really enjoy my Kubota 90 backhoe on my L4240. If you could buy with tractor and finance as a package with your tractor may be a good way to go. It was an expensive accessory but man have I used it!

 

[canoetrpr]

Believe you are right on the money rbargeron. I've been keeping an eye out for a local sale of a tractor with a backhoe or the same model tractor as mine with a backhoe - whose owner I might be able to make a deal with to just buy the backhoe and subframe off.

 

[JeffInCO]

I was about to go ahead and have the tractor dealer put on the Kubota BH90 new, but I just got off the phone with him and now he wants to charge me more than he quoted before. To be fair, the "before" quote for the backhoe was with a different tractor (a 5240) that he may have been more desperate to sell. In any case, my bad for not making the backhoe part of the deal in the first place.

He's telling me that the backhoe install is about one day (8 hours) of labor, which seems reasonable. The price he quoted is basically 4% off the total of Kubota's list price plus labor. This is the highest quote I've seen for an installed BH90.

So now I'm seriously considering the Woods. The nearest Kubota dealer that is also a Woods dealer is in the next state (Wyoming, but not too far from me). I have no idea how good or bad their service dept is -- one reason I picked the local dealer for the tractor is because of recommendations regarding their service dept.

There's a New Holland/Massey Ferguson dealer closer-by that also carries Woods, but not Kubota. I've heard positives regarding their service, but I'm wondering if installing a non-Kubota backhoe by a non-Kubota dealer will impact my warranty. How invasive is a sub-frame backhoe install? Both on the the frame of the tractor and on hydraulics?

Thanks,

Jeff

 

[Happyman]

I was about to go ahead and have the tractor dealer put on the Kubota BH90 new, but I just got off the phone with him and now he wants to charge me more than he quoted before. To be fair, the "before" quote for the backhoe was with a different tractor (a 5240) that he may have been more desperate to sell. In any case, my bad for not making the backhoe part of the deal in the first place.

He's telling me that the backhoe install is about one day (8 hours) of labor, which seems reasonable. The price he quoted is basically 4% off the total of Kubota's list price plus labor. This is the highest quote I've seen for an installed BH90.

So now I'm seriously considering the Woods. The nearest Kubota dealer that is also a Woods dealer is in the next state (Wyoming, but not too far from me). I have no idea how good or bad their service dept is -- one reason I picked the local dealer for the tractor is because of recommendations regarding their service dept.

There's a New Holland/Massey Ferguson dealer closer-by that also carries Woods, but not Kubota. I've heard positives regarding their service, but I'm wondering if installing a non-Kubota backhoe by a non-Kubota dealer will impact my warranty. How invasive is a sub-frame backhoe install? Both on the the frame of the tractor and on hydraulics?

Thanks,

Jeff

Putting a Woods backhoe on a Kubota will not void any warranty for either the Woods or Kubota. I know that the Woods BH90-X requires a frame mount (that's what I have on my 3940). The tractor frames change slightly as the tractor size changes so this may be the cost difference the dealer wants to charge you for. My dealer, Cavalier International, Ashland, VA, actually prefers the Woods backhoe over the Kubota. They feel the curved boom, frame, hydraulics, etc. are of better quality and performance then the Kubota.
Hope this helps your decision. I know nothing about the New Holland/Massey tractors. Also, the frame mount is not invasive, but requires at least a day of mechanics time for the installation.

 

[RichNJKubota]

I have a Woods BH90-X on my L4310 Kubota. It works just fine. The subframe mount for my tractor is a long piece that's bolted to the BH. Mounting it to the tractor takes about 20 minutes. The decision to go with the Woods vs. Kubota BH was based more on price in my case.
I called around to many Kubota dealers before deciding on my purchase. Prices varied widely from absurdly high to real good. In the end I bought it from a Kubota dealer in PA (a few miles from me). They had a great price and answered all my technical questions. I did the install after trailering the BH and subframe here on my flatbed trailer. It took about 6 hrs to do the install. The dealer supplied hoses and quick disconnects to hook into the power beyond hoses near the FEL valve.
In the end I'm very happy with my decision and the service and advice from the dealer. My neighbor is a retired equipment operator. He loves to come over and help. In fact I think he's got more hours on the BH than I have

 

[dfkrug]

How invasive is a sub-frame backhoe install?

Invasive? Interesting choice of words. Both Woods and Kubota make a very
nice 4-point style subframe that integrates well with the Kubota loader
subframes. Either can be set up to use your tractor's hydraulics, which is
the best way to go. I expect that either the BH90 or the Woods BH-90X is
going to be $8K or so including subframe and installation. One difference that
may be important to you (besides price) may be how far the mounted hoe
sticks out the back of the tractor. This will affect ground clearance, esp
in the departure angle. Having seen an number of Woods subframes (as
well as many mounted Kubotas), and having installed one Woods factory
subframe on a Kubota, I find that the Woods units stick out back farther
than the Kubota hoes. Check on this for your L before you buy.

As for finding good used hoes.....that is really tough, as many hoe
attachments with little use get parked outside and get ruined by the
weather.

 

[Bob_Young]

I've got the Woods BH-90X for my L4300 and am happy with it. It's a good backhoe, but I can't compare it with the Kubota model.

It is far from a compact installation, however. I think it sticks out the back nearly 6" more than it needs to. So with the hoe on, the tractor is a bit ungainly. Fortunately, it comes off easily enough.

If your are going to keep the hoe on your tractor or trailer your rig, you might want to compare mounted installations of both the Kubota and the Woods models before committing. The Kubota installation might be better integrated.

With the Woods hoe mounted, my L4300 with FEL is a very tight fit on my 20' pipe trailer. The fold-up rear loading gate on the trailer doesn't allow any overhang and the bucket's within an inch of it when loaded.
Bob

 

[canoetrpr]

I would not think twice about having another dealer - or a Massey dealer do the install of a Woods BH. There is no problem with warranty even if you install it yourself.

I would get some quotes, call your dealer, and tell him that if you can't get a better price from him you are going to go with a Woods.

I think he should be able to do better than 4% off list in this kind of an economy.

 

[Green Acres Homestead]

After the initial installation, I assume it doesn't take a day to take the BH off and put the 3pt back on and attach my snow blower? Correct? I am looking at buying a BH but not if it is going to take a day to take off the BH and put on my 3pt hitch.

 

[Green Acres Homestead]

Another question I have is how would the amount of work you get done with a 90 bh compare with a 2 ton excavator?

 

[Grandad4]

Attaching and removing the backhoe is a fairly easy job. I have one that's a couple of generations older than the newest ones and even it is readily set up or removed. It's a little more involved than hooking up something on the 3 point, but not by much. The biggest factors are: 1) how often you've done it, as your familiarity with the procedure makes a big difference; 2) doing it on level, even ground so everything lines up readily.

As for OEM Kubota vs. aftermarket backhoes, the main factor I saw when shopping was the Kubota hoe was better engineered to fit the tractor while the others were generic products made to fit many different brands and models. For example, the Kubota hoe was tucked up snug to the rear of the tractor so it would stress the tractor less and give better ground clearance at the back; some of the aftermarket hoes were jutting pretty far out. Kubota builds a sturdy, rugged hoe although there are some very good aftermarket ones also. The other thing I've noticed is some of the videos you see of these backhoes show some pretty crude operation, particularly when making combination movements (i.e. simultaneous lift, curl, crowd and swing motions, for example). Don't know if that reflects the quality of the controls or the skill of the operator, but my old Kubota hoe does a nice job with that so I figure the hydraulics had to be well engineered. That's worth a lot in the productivity of a backhoe.

The small excavator has a huge productivity advantage over a tractor backhoe because it can be re-positioned much faster. With any small hoe, you're constantly moving it since the reach is so short.

 

[Grandad4]

Double post

 

[FatTire]

I agree with Grandad4, familiarity is the key for BH removal/install. I sort of dreaded it the first few times, thinking it was a significant interruption in my workflow. Now it is routine, I know which wrenches I need for the 3 points removal, I get the 3 point hitch parts off in less than 10 minutes and then about 5 minutes to hook up the BH. The first time I think it took about 15 minutes to hook up the backhoe as I "experimented" with the controls to get the angle and height adjusted. I always store the BH in a relatively level spot, and a stick a block under it if storing for a long time so that it doesn't sink to the ground. That keeps the pivot out of the dirt.