Anyone else waiting to see if tractors without the EPA stuff are coming?

[rScotty]

Well I would rather bring it back for national security's sake

Right. But doing that requires that the other side wants the same thing. That's a fantasy that is not going to happen. Somebody needs to have a real plan for how to get things done the best way with what we have.

 

[rScotty]

The DEF injection systems on modern commercial diesel powered trucks remain issue prone and expensive to repair as well.

Most everything that is manufactured goes through the same cycle of being expensive and prone to breakdown at the first. That is part of the process. Whatever it is, after we make it for awhile we learn how to make it better and better. Until finally becoming common, inexpensive, and reliable. Tractors included...

 

[airbiscuit]

Dumb, Dirty and Dull Manufacturing went overseas, and that's the cheapest place for it. We are able to compete domestically in Advanced Manufacturing, but those companies are already struggling to find skilled talent. I'd rather see an upskilling of America (i.e. technical colleges) than tariff wars.

 

[airbiscuit]

Most everything that is manufactured goes through the same cycle of being expensive and prone to breakdown at the first. That is part of the process. Whatever it is, after we make it for awhile we learn how to make it better and better. Until finally becoming common, inexpensive, and reliable. Tractors included...

The mid 70s smog control Detroit gave is is a good example of that!

Today's automobile engines are way cleaner, with scads more horsepower.

 

[Hay Dude]

Most everything that is manufactured goes through the same cycle of being expensive and prone to breakdown at the first. That is part of the process. Whatever it is, after we make it for awhile we learn how to make it better and better. Until finally becoming common, inexpensive, and reliable. Tractors included...

Been 15 years now.
I would say they have improved, but are still a significant cost up front, and still prone to failure at too high of a rate.

You have to remember, we are stuck with all the lousy junk they built in the beginning. Not all of us can afford low emissions diesel equipment built in 2025.

 

[Hay Dude]

Dumb, Dirty and Dull Manufacturing went overseas, and that's the cheapest place for it. We are able to compete domestically in Advanced Manufacturing, but those companies are already struggling to find skilled talent. I'd rather see an upskilling of America (i.e. technical colleges) than tariff wars.

View attachment 3114416

I want both. For national security.
I am highly opposed to buying all our pharmaceuticals from the Chinese.
We also need to be able to produce enough steel and mine enough rare earth.

War is always a possibility and I don’t want those commie killers squeezing our b@lls everytime theres a crisis.

 

[Axing]

我认为这取决于后处理的种类。如今，大多数大型柴油机都使用后处理，将流体注入排气流。他们闲置得很好。

几乎所有国家都在实施排放标准

 

[Axing]

I think it depends on the kind of after-processing. Most big diesels today use an after-treatment that injects fluid into the exhaust stream. They idle just fine.

Emission standards are being implemented in almost all countries

 

[ultrarunner]

Dumb, Dirty and Dull Manufacturing went overseas, and that's the cheapest place for it. We are able to compete domestically in Advanced Manufacturing, but those companies are already struggling to find skilled talent. I'd rather see an upskilling of America (i.e. technical colleges) than tariff wars.

View attachment 3114416

Don’t forget Dangerous…

 

[rScotty]

I want both. For national security.
I am highly opposed to buying all our pharmaceuticals from the Chinese.
We also need to be able to produce enough steel and mine enough rare earth.

War is always a possibility and I don’t want those commie killers squeezing our b@lls everytime theres a crisis.

I agree with Mike Rowe. Worldwide manufacturing competition is a math problem, and the answer is education.
We did this before when sputnik went up - so I guess we can do it again. It does take time to see results because the kids that need to learn this stuff are in Jr. High right now.

Back in the sputnik era, many of our parents came from a trades background and knew the value of education. Parents now may not feel the same.

So education is one possible answer for the future, but it has about a ten year lag time if we begin right now.
Is there a better answer sooner?
rScotty

 

[ultrarunner]

Few want there kids to get their hands dirty…

I hear often families discouraging the RN profession… yet good pay and job security… unless urge family is foreign born.

The mechanical trades not so much in fashion.

Not every grad can be in finance, real estate or a government EPA inspector.

 

[Rustyiron]

I wouldn’t be so sure. It’s well known that consumers hate the emissions equipment’s reduced reliability and even more so the cost. If it was made legal I think you would see it disappear in a hurry.

And it is an EPA regulation, not an executive order. I wonder if someone who worships the climate change religion enters that position can undo it as easily as an EO? It would seem to be.
Surely anything produced in compliance will be grandfathered in the future, of course you can't underestimate "that types" disrespect of personal property either.
Maybe if the manufacturers call the un choked new motors transgender......

 

[Hay Dude]

Few want there kids to get their hands dirty…

I hear often families discouraging the RN profession… yet good pay and job security… unless urge family is foreign born.

The mechanical trades not so much in fashion.

Not every grad can be in finance, real estate or a government EPA inspector.

I am friends with a lot of adult parents who have HS and college age kids. It’s sad to see those parents that struggle to push their kids, and even cheat for them, to get them through college.
They should have sent those kids to learn a trade, a skill, or a small business.

 

[Fixastuff]

I am friends with a lot of adult parents who have HS and college age kids. It’s sad to see those parents that struggle to push their kids, and even cheat for them, to get them through college.
They should have sent those kids to learn a trade, a skill, or a small business.

If they have HS and College age kids then you don’t yet know the results of their education on success so how are you already sad for them? Are these USA or Russian parents you know?

 

[Muhammad]

Let's stay on topic and avoid politics please.

 

[Hay Dude]

If they have HS and College age kids then you don’t yet know the results of their education on success so how are you already sad for them? Are these USA or Russian parents you know?

Because they either graduated with poor grades or are struggling and don’t want to go to college.
Their parents are making them go for the “status”.

 

[rScotty]

I am friends with a lot of adult parents who have HS and college age kids. It’s sad to see those parents that struggle to push their kids, and even cheat for them, to get them through college.
They should have sent those kids to learn a trade, a skill, or a small business.

I see nothing but benefit in learning a second or third trade or skill. Not only something to fall back on if the first one blows up, but it gives all sorts of opportunities to save money or just as a hobby.

There just are not jobs anymore for a lot of college degrees. A single year learning the basics of a trade can free a person from job worries for a lifetime.
rScotty

 

[ultrarunner]

Emission rules have sent a lot of very good equipment out of California… doubt any of it is coming back as long as California sets the in State standard.

 

[Hay Dude]

Right. But doing that requires that the other side wants the same thing. That's a fantasy that is not going to happen. Somebody needs to have a real plan for how to get things done the best way with what we have.

I’ll hold you to that. I think it will come back. Not to the degree of 1900-1960, but recent changes, popular with American company owners, are pursuing a new future in manufacturing.

 

[jyoutz]

Seems like the best, most direct, and least harmful strategy for incentivizing US manufacturing is a direct federal tax credit waiver for ten years for the construction of new manufacturing facilities. Straightforward and no collateral economic damage.