Advice on Hydrostatic Transmission vs Gears

[skid mark]

Note that I think that HST and geared both have advantages and disadvantages. Pick the one that best fits your needs.

OK, that said...

HST is best for children...

I've read comments similar to the one above many times, but I have another view.

There's a LOT more to safely operating a tractor than being able to make it go and stop. My experience has been that a kid's ability to operate a geared transmission is a good litmus test that they are starting to have the mental and physical maturity required to safely operate a tractor. Before that, they might be able to steer an HST tractor around in circles in the front yard like one of these:

... but little beyond that. We may thank them for their "help", but let's not kid ourselves.

Plus, assuming the tractor buyer will keep his tractor for many years, is it best that his children are never given the opportunity to master a geared trans because Daddy chose an HST (with them in mind) when they were eight years old?

I wanted my kids to be able to go check out (and maybe buy) a classic car:

or truck:

... (many of which are manual shift) and not have to ask the seller to take them for a ride because they didn't grow up regularly operating a geared transmission.

The low gearing and the ability to set and hold engine RPM before engaging clutch make tractors the best vehicle to learn the basics of a manual transmission (ideally (but often not possible these days) to be followed up with Dad's manual shift car/truck/jeep).

Teach your kids to do "difficult" things that few can do these days. They'll enjoy (and often benefit from) picking up those unique skills.

 

[walnutman]

Note that I think that HST and geared both have advantages and disadvantages. Pick the one that best fits your needs.

OK, that said...



I've read comments similar to the one above many times, but I have another view.

There's a LOT more to safely operating a tractor than being able to make it go and stop. My experience has been that a kid's ability to operate a geared transmission is a good litmus test that they are starting to have the mental and physical maturity required to safely operate a tractor. Before that, they might be able to steer an HST tractor around in circles in the front yard like one of these:

View attachment 4580120

... but little beyond that. We may thank them for their "help", but let's not kid ourselves.

Plus, assuming the tractor buyer will keep his tractor for many years, is it best that his children are never given the opportunity to master a geared trans because Daddy chose an HST (with them in mind) when they were eight years old?

I wanted my kids to be able to go check out (and maybe buy) a classic car:

View attachment 4580121

or truck:

View attachment 4580122

... (many of which are manual shift) and not have to ask the seller to take them for a ride because they didn't grow up regularly operating a geared transmission.

The low gearing and the ability to set and hold engine RPM before engaging clutch make tractors the best vehicle to learn the basics of a manual transmission (ideally (but often not possible these days) to be followed up with Dad's manual shift car/truck/jeep).

Teach your kids to do "difficult" things that few can do these days. They'll enjoy (and often benefit from) picking up those unique skills.

True but I wouldn't buy a tractor based on teaching my kid how to drive stick. A little motorcycle with a clutch gives them the idea.

 

[bsekf]

Tim, that Yamar is really neat, my question is whether it is worth the extra money AND how will it be working in 10-20 years and 10K hours? There seems to be a lot of moving parts that must be tied together with computers and hi-tech electronics.

 

[walnutman]

Tim, that Yamar is really neat, my question is whether it is worth the extra money AND how will it be working in 10-20 years and 10K hours? There seems to be a lot of moving parts that must be tied together with computers and hi-tech electronics.

You mean like your car?
I get what you are saying but your only other choices are mostly older used tractors.
My 2004 Dodge Cummins runs on computers. Had it since new.. 21 years.

 

[bsekf]

Yes, I am thinking of my car. A Lexus with all the whistles and bells. I can imagine that someday, after that car has been in the salt and snow and ice for 20+ years, some poor soul will be driving it and it will stop, just quit, and the poor soul may not be able to even open the doors to get out!

I just got rid of my 1996 Dodge pickup; I was afraid the frame would rust in two and the vacuum assist on the front wheel drive wasn't working properly. But it still ran and most everything worked. Don't believe it had any computers except the one under my hat.

I'll be watching the owner reviews on that Yamar. It sure is neat! I replaced my "bought new" 25 year old tractor with a 2022 Mahindra 5155 for $25K, half the cost of the Yamar. Only neat thing is the 2 speed PTO, 540 at 1700 and 2500. Neither have good dealer networks in WNY.

 

[GrandpaSmurf825]

I think some of you fear hydrostatic drive because you haven't been around it. It's used in a lot of different areas. Many bulldozers use it now. Combines have been using it since the 60's. International Harvester introduced the 656 tractor in 1967 and called it the "Hydro". They were slow to catch on because they were new technology. I have a Cub Cadet/Yanmar EX3200 3 speed hydrostat and I would never trade it for a gear drive. Clearing snow or moving dirt it doesn't matter. I can reverse in an instant and it just is so much smoother and productive. I have ran plenty of gear drive machines and started out on tractors with hand clutches. There are few instances I can think of where a gear drive would be preferred unless it is a dedicated or specific function where maximum power transfer and efficiency is needed. There will be some power loss with hydrostat and that can be a factor in some instances.

 

[walnutman]

Yes, I am thinking of my car. A Lexus with all the whistles and bells. I can imagine that someday, after that car has been in the salt and snow and ice for 20+ years, some poor soul will be driving it and it will stop, just quit, and the poor soul may not be able to even open the doors to get out!

I just got rid of my 1996 Dodge pickup; I was afraid the frame would rust in two and the vacuum assist on the front wheel drive wasn't working properly. But it still ran and most everything worked. Don't believe it had any computers except the one under my hat.

I'll be watching the owner reviews on that Yamar. It sure is neat! I replaced my "bought new" 25 year old tractor with a 2022 Mahindra 5155 for $25K, half the cost of the Yamar. Only neat thing is the 2 speed PTO, 540 at 1700 and 2500. Neither have good dealer networks in WNY.

Your 96 Dodge gas or diesel? Either way I'm sure it had computers.
As far as owners reviews, they have been out for at least 9 years now and there are many videos and reviews. Most every one is positive.
I'm just an owner of one. Love it.

 

[JRH02]

Let's not confuse an automatic xmission in a vehicle with a hydro in a work machine.

 

[nybirdman]

We have one of each,mine is an HST and my son's is straight gear.Both have their places.
My son taught his then 16 year old daughter to operate his geared tractor,no problem.
A little story;we had a deer get hit just down the road,NYS trooper responded
and my son also did.
After all the paperwork was done my grand-daughter and equally blond friend showed up with the tractor and threw the deer in the bucket and drove off. Trooper was shocked(both girls are hunters also).

 

[walnutman]

We have one of each,mine is an HST and my son's is straight gear.Both have their places.
My son taught his then 16 year old daughter to operate his geared tractor,no problem.
A little story;we had a deer get hit just down the road,NYS trooper responded
and my son also did.
After all the paperwork was done my grand-daughter and equally blond friend showed up with the tractor and threw the deer in the bucket and drove off. Trooper was shocked(both girls are hunters also).

Love this story. Just makes me smile.

 

[LouNY]

The Yanmar transmission seems to be their version of a CVT or IVT transmission.
I'd like to see a 75-80 Tractor for a reasonable cost with a CVT tranmission.
I am not a Hydro fan, I do have one now (Kioti CK2620)
I also put a lot of hours on IH's original 656 Hydro,
both of them whine a lot compared to equivalent geared tractors.

 

[JRH02]

Our JD410j is as close to I'll come to an automatic with it's powershift. If I'm pulling a hill with a moderate throttle and roll the thumbwheel into 2nd the critter will wheelstand. It's marvelous to handle at low speeds in a tight area. To me it's the best of both worlds (manual or automatic equivalent).

 

[Wobblin-Goblin]

Our JD410j is as close to I'll come to an automatic with it's powershift. If I'm pulling a hill with a moderate throttle and roll the thumbwheel into 2nd the critter will wheelstand. It's marvelous to handle at low speeds in a tight area. To me it's the best of both worlds (manual or automatic equivalent).

Agreed. We have an '07 410J and it is a dream to operate. It has a reverser, but no gears, just four ranges. Best of both worlds and super easy to use, and use well.