540 pto to 1000 conversion on spader

[Adelynn]

Hello, looking for help with a possible project. We were advised to convert our spader (Imants SE115RH) with a 540 pto to a 1000 pto. Our tractor (Kubota m5660) doesn't have a creeper gear which means we are spading to fast and not getting the outcome we want. We're hoping that this conversion means we can run the tractor at a lower rpm while still getting the pto output we need to run the spader. Has anyone done this, is it possible? Also I've had no trouble finding an adapter for the pto shaft, is there an adapter out there for the driveline? Is the solution for the driveline issue to be to get a new 1000 rpm driveline and an adapter for the implement as well or is there a cheaper work around? Thanks for any input/help!

 

[Sportsman762]

To change the spader to run on 1000 rpm will require some changes to the spader. You will need to change gears/belts/sprockets/or gearboxes. This will let the spader run correctly on 1000 RPM input. However since your tractor can only run at 540 this will cut the speed that the spader runs in half. So therefor you would have to cut the tractor speed in half to get as many strokes as you currently do. What you need to do is figure out how to increase the PTO speed of the kubota or reduce ground speed. If your machine is equipped with a 540E (540 economy PTO) then it will run the engine at a lower speed reducing the ground speed.

I think E PTO had to be factory installed so it is not viable to add after the fact. I think you will need to find another piece of equipment to do the work of the spader or find a different tractor if the current combo is not achieving your goals. I know that this is not the news you want to hear. Hopefully someone else has a better idea.

 

[zzvyb6]

How about using a hydraulic motor and throttle it as necessary to get a satisfactory speed ? You have enough tractor, now just a motor, hoses, and connection. Maybe a cooler. Size the motor to get the desired spader rpm plus the ground speed you are comfortable with. Seems to me this allows several ground speed options with a corresponding compatible attachment speed.

 

[oldnslo]

Does the M5660 have the option of 1000 RPM PTO output vs 540? If yes then in theory you would just need the 1000 RPM PTO shaft and throttle down your tractor to achieve approximately 540 RPM. Your tractor speed would be reduced while maintaining the spader speed of 540.

What is max input speed for the spader?

 

[Adelynn]

How about using a hydraulic motor and throttle it as necessary to get a satisfactory speed ? You have enough tractor, now just a motor, hoses, and connection. Maybe a cooler. Size the motor to get the desired spader rpm plus the ground speed you are comfortable with. Seems to me this allows several ground speed options with a corresponding compatible attachment speed.

I thought this sounded like the solution after briefly looking into it. I don't have much experience and I posted in another forum as well that's getting more responses than this one. I asked about a hydraulic motor over there and was told "You don't have enough hydraulic flow to run a PTO hydraulic motor. It takes about 4 times more GPM than your tractor is capable of." Do you know if this is true? This guy has shot down everything while everyone else is saying all thing mentions can work if the right parts and engineering is done. I feel like I'm in a worse place than when I started with all the different feedback I am getting.

 

[Harry in Ky]

"This guy" has shot down everything because he is well aware (as I'm sure you soon will be) that what you hope to do here simply won't work. Your tractor is no match for your implement. You should consider a larger tractor to match the implement, or a smaller implement to match your tractor.

 

[5030]

Both my M9's are 540-1000 pto but it's not a cheap date by a long shot. The 540-1000 on mine cost me over a grand and I did the work myself. Additionally, 1000 pto is typically 21 spline not 6 so you still need a 21-6 adapter.

 

[Adelynn]

Found that the tractor doesn't have the correct gpm needed to run an hydraulic motor. I did find that someone was able to achieve this set up with a flow divider though, but on a front mounted implement and voided their warranty. Also the implement and tractor work fine together and I run it at the average speed recommended. I was just trying to see if there was a way I could run the implement at a lower speed. This change was recommended by a veteran farmer with an extremely high reputation so that why I believed it worked. For now I'll stick to keeping the stock set up.

 

[oldnslo]

Adelynn
For hydraulic drive you would to know torque required to run the spader at load. This information along with operating pressure would be used to determine required displacement of the hydraulic motor.

Once motor displacement is calculated you could then determine required flow to achieve desired 540 RPM.

Specs I saw online shows approx 10 GPM flow rate at rated RPM for your tractor.

You could probably achieve approx 11 - 12 HP input to your spader based on the 10 GPM and 2500 PSI.

 

[CliffordK]

"You don't have enough hydraulic flow to run a PTO hydraulic motor. It takes about 4 times more GPM than your tractor is capable of."

Keep looking. You can run a hydraulic pump off of your tractor's PTO which should be able to handle up to about the full HP of your tractor.

I picked up a former government owned PTO driven flail mower. It has a big tank and power unit to carry around on the rear of the tractor.

However, the cheapest method will likely be to change the sprockets or pulleys on your tiller as @Sportsman762 mentioned. Unless you need to do this on several devices.