2210 or 4010

[Koz]

I am planning to upgrade from a JD 445 (w/ 60" deck and the MC 519 cart). I own 3.5 acres. About 2 acres is grass with multiple plantings and trees (mostly evergreens that are approx 4' diameter). The last 1.5 acres is a rough field that is only mowed every 2-3 weeks.

All in all, we have been pleased with the 445 but it sometimes has difficulty going through the field. I am convinced a diesel would be better. Also, I would like the option of getting a useful loader in the future (the 445's loader is not very capable).

We have looked at the BX 2230 and the JD 2210 and 4010. At this point, I think I prefer the JD offerings to the Kubota (more comfortable and I prefer the local JD dealers). I was originally only looking at the 2210, but one of the dealers recently told me that I would be foolish not to consider upgrading to the 4010. He feels the 4010 is a much more rugged tractor for the additional $1,000. In particular, he prefers the frame and transmission of the 4010. He tells me that maneuverability is almost identical and that quality of cut is the same.

Since the 4010's deck is more costly than the 2210's, it ends up being almost $2,000 more.

The 4010 has an 18HP versus 22 HP for the 2210. The dealer tells me that 18HP is more than enough for my needs.

What do you guys think?

 

[BillG_in_TX]

Here's a discussion from last year that might be of interest to you.

 

[Bob_In_MN]

Koz,

I was part of the thread BillG linked to. As I recall that was the first encounter between DocsKnotInn and myself. We have since discussed the 2210 vs. 4010 thing a number of times. We have come to agree that we bought our machines for different reasons and both are serving us well.

My opinion is that the 4010 has some higher capabilities in the FEL (Loader) and 3 point hitch. The additional height of the 3 point MAY be of some benefit with CERTAIN 3 PT attachments.

The 2210 puts more HP to the rear and mid PTO's. The rear PTO power issue may come into play in tilling (although I have never run out of power while tilling with the 4010) or running some other 3 PT attachment. I also believe it is probably superior at mowing.

I can't comment on the differences in the transmissions between the two--but would be interesed to find out what they are.

You mention adding a loader in the future. I would make two comments.

1. The fact that you are considering this to be a future choice tells me you don't have major loader work to be done which means the 2210 should be more than sufficient.

2. Get the loader right away. I'd give up my mower deck before I gave up my loader even though the 4010 is my primary mowing machine.

Lastly--test them both and see what feels right. They both weigh about the same, but they really are different tractors. My dealer recommended the 4010 when I was pricing out the X595--the cost difference was $500. I sure glad he made the suggestion to look at the 4010--the X series are nice, but I would have been disappointed given my needs.

Good Luck

Bob

 

[keeney]

Its not clear to me why the big difference in price on the mower decks. Is one bigger?


- Rick

 

[Koz]

The 2210's deck is 62" and is a new design. I believe it is 11 gauge. The 4010's deck is 60", is an old design and is 7 gauge (per verbal info from JD dealer).

 

[EquipmentJunkie]

FYI - 11-gauge is THINNER than 7-gauge. Don't ask me why.
In theory, the 11-gauge is going to be easier to stamp into a mower deck with fancy "wind tunnels" for the cut grass. But, I'd take the heavier deck for the durability.

 

[Hambone]

I like the new style. It is a deeper deck.
Personal preference.
I think it ejects the grass better.

 

[Dutch445]

I would ask your dealer to look up the decks again. My information shows the deck for the 4010 to be the same basic 60" deck that was available on the 445, with the reinforcement rod running the bottom front edge of the deck, and is made of 10 gage steel. The 60 " decks on the 4210-4410 get the newer 7Iron deck. That older 60" deck is quite a deck though, I used to own one, and it is heavy. Here is the Deere info word for word:

60-in. deck, 10-gauge (.134-in. thick) (4010, 4110, 4115, and 4100 Compact Tractors)

 

[bigpete]

Dutch, you are correct. The 60 deck for the 4010 has essentially the same pan and contour as the 60" deck for the 445. The 7-Iron deck is the 7-guage steel, I believe (hence the name...) The 4110 and 4115 also use the same 60" pan as the 445 and 4010, but with different mounting points.

My history is a graduation from 445, to 2210, and now to 4110. I've used all of the decks mentioned with the exception of the 60 on my 4110 (waiting for the grass to grow, as we speak) and can say that both the 62C and the heavy-duty 60" deck cut very well. I actually preferred the cut of the 60" on my 445 over the 62C, but I have always had the mulching kit. That is not to say that the 62C has any issues at all, execept I have heard there is a blow-out condition from the left front of the deck. I did not experience that condition with the mulching kit installed on my 62C.

The 62C is a much lighter deck - 200 pounds vs. 300 pounds. The weight is in the guage of sheet metal but also in the guide wheel supports, leading edge suppports and the complete lack of plastic. Also, both the 60" deck for my 445 and my 62C for my 2210 have plastic belt covers, as opposed to sheet metal with latches for my 4110. No big deal here, though. I will say that the front guide wheels on the 60 decks are bigger and more stout than the 62C. Again, this does not indicate a problem with the 62C--I loved that deck, too.

As far as advice on the original question, you will love the "graduation" no matter which tractor you get. Having worked extensively with the loader on both the 2210 and 4110 (4110 has the same hydraulics and loader as the 4010) I will say that there is a significant loader advantage to the 4010. You can also get a stock folding ROPS with the 4010, and there are a few more luxury options such as cruise control, vibration dampening in the floorboards...no need to repeat the 3PH dynamics and position control vs. a "drop-and-stop" lift on the 2210.

I will repeat that the 2210 is probably a better mowing machine, but I haven't mowed yet with the 4110. The turning radii are virtually identical for the 4010 and 2210, so they should both trim about the same.

SO... try them both, and enjoy!

 

[Charlie_in_TX]

Just something for you to consider.

If you are happy with what the 445 does except the field, keep the 445 and get a tractor to mow the field and FEL work.

2210, IN MY OPINION a FEL dosn't belong on the 2210. The front tires are too small and there is little ground clearance. Put a little weight in the bucket on soft dirt and the axel will be on the ground. The 22hp motor does make a powerful mowing machine.

4010, a step up in FEL work, a step down in mowing.

Both of these machines lack position control. That is something I couldn't get used to.

I would look at doing one of 3 things.

On the cheap end, get a 24hp 4wheel drive Chinese tractor or grey market with a FEL and 5ft brush hog. The 445 finish mowes great. The Chinese/grey tractor will rough mow and FEL FAR better than the 2210 and 4010. On the downside, with the Chinese and greys you have to be prepaired to spin a wrench. The likelyhood of finding a local repairman is small.

In the middle, a used CUT. It will do anything the Chineses/grey will plus have local mechanic.

On the top is a new cut. JD, Kubota, NH, MF, Kioti, Mahindra, Cub (I'm sure there is more but I can't think of them) all make good FEL machines.

 

[Bob_In_MN]

Koz,

I re-read your first post. Do you simply mow the rough area with your 445 (it sounds that way). If that is the case, over time you will turn that rough field into a fairly nice lawn just by mowing it.

I was initially thinking you were going to get a bush hog, but is that really something you intend to do or are you going to just finish mow the entire 3.5 acres?

If you are planning on doing what I mentioned above then the 2210 should work better on 3 week growth than the 4010 just from a simple HP standpoint.

It doesn't sound you plan on heavy use of the FEL. What would be some of your intended loader tasks? I can't comment on the strength of the FEL on the 2210 having never used one.

Bob

 

[Koz]

I really appreciate all of the comments that have been provided. I need to sit down and really think through this, but I thought I would pass along comments from a local JD dealer (different than the one I spoke with regarding the deck gauge).

This dealer is recommending the 2210 because of the increased HP. He feels that the 4010's 18HP diesel will provide performance with a 60" deck that is no better than my 445, and maybe worse. Basically, he feels I would be disappointed with the 4010's mowing performance. He is basing this on mowing a field on a intermittant basis as well as on the slight hill that my field is located on.

I left the prices in my car (I'm at the office now, working hard!) but the 2210 with 62" mower is around $11,500. The 4010 is almost $13,000. Do these prices sound right? My guess is that they are high, as it is the first time the provide pricing and I did not press them.

I did get a chance to drive the 2210, and am very impressed with its maneuverability. It seems to be an almost negligable increase in turning radius versus my 445.

The 2210 is a far more comfortable machine than the Kubota BX 2230 (which I was originally considering). The BX is smaller, but feels less maneuverable. The seat on the BX almost seems to be angled toward the engine, much less comfortable than the 2210. There are a few BX advantages, though. The deck and belts are heavier duty than the 62" JD deck (the Kubota's belt is a monster in comparison) and the frame/axle on the Kubota is beefier (more in line with the 4010).

At this point, I have not actually driven the 4010. I sat on it, and it is certainly no less comfortable than the 2210. Unless I scratch the 4010 from consideration due to mowing performance concerns, i will be driving on on Saturday.

Having 2 tractors would be a solution, but I do not have the room and my wife would never let me park the tractor in the garage or build a second shed.

 

[Koz]

Bob - I didn't see your post prior to my last post.

You are correct, I am using my 445's belly mower for the field. You are also correct that the field has basically turned into grass. After being mowed, it basically looks like an extension of my seeded lawn.

But, it grows much faster and the grass is much thicker. Also, I do not mow it weekly like the seeded lawn. Thus, the 445 has trouble with it.

My intent is to continue using a finish mower for my entire property.

The 2210's loader can handle approx 700 pounds. My anticipated uses are uncertain, I understand that ways to use a FEL pop up everywhere. I'm guessing that my FEL usage will include (but not be limited to) moving firewood, mulch and dirt.

 

[Bob_In_MN]

Koz,

I can tell you with the 54 inch deck, my 4010 has never given me a problem, but I have never put it in a position you will encounter on a fairly regular basis. I remember when I purchased my 4010, the dealer said the 60 inch deck combined with tall, wet grass would really make the engine work. I would think the 2210 would be better suited for the mowing you describe. You will definately give up some other capabilities, but everything you talk about suggests you won't necessarily need what the 4010 offers.

By the way--what does the price you listed include? I can track down my price list to give you a comparision (although as has been discussed--pricing is regional).

Bob

 

[JClark]

Koz

If you are going to buy a tractor (vs. a big lawn mower) I recommend getting one that has full Class 1 3 point hitch capabilities. There is a world of implements out there just waiting to be bought, borrowed or rented, and the vast majority of them hang on Class 1 3pt hitches with 540 RPM PTOs. In a JD CUT I believe that qualification starts at a 4110.

I have similar acreage and conditions to yours that I cut with a 4110 and a 60" MMM. I really like that particular deck, it is built like a tank, no plastic, run quiet and cuts and discharges very well. It was one of th main reasons I chose the 4110 over a B series Kubota, the other being the very easily removable FEL.

 

[Hypernix]

bigpete,

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( (4110 has the same hydraulics and loader as the 4010) )</font>

Actually the 4110 has slightly better hydraulics than the 4010 although the 4110 and 4115 have the same capacity. This was taken from the JD 4000 TEN brochure:

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre> 4010 4110 & 4115
Implement Pump 3.4gpm 5.1gpm
Steering Pump 2.2gpm 2.3gpm
Total Flow 5.7 gpm 7.4gpm
</pre><hr />
Koz:

When I was looking for my tractor I was also looking primarily at the 4010. Then the JD dealer told me about the 2210. I didn't like the small footprint but did like the bigger HP. So I ended up buying a 4110 just to make sure that HP would not be an issue at least for a few years /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Maybe you should take a look at the 4110 also... It is probably going to cost a couple thousands more than the 4010 but I think in my case it was well worth it. (More HP, more 3PTH lift power, more hydraulic power /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif)

Hyp3rnix

 

[Koz]

Unless i'm misunderstanding something, both the 2210 and 4010 have class 1 hitches. The only difference explained to me is that the 2210 is a bit lower and thus may have problems with some kinds of post hole diggers.

I have a headache...I was leaning toward the 4010 because of 3 yr 0% financing versus 2 yr 0% for the 2210. Now i'm wondering if that would be wise considering the lower HP. Moving up to the 4110 is not an option (my wife doesn't even know i'm considering an upgrade to the 2210!) because of money.

Here are the best current pricing for each tractor:

2210 with 62" mower, 210 loader and ballast box - $12,900

4010 with 60" mower, 410 loader and ballast box - $15,500

Evidently the 4110 is about $1500 more than the 4010

 

[bigpete]

Hyp, thanks for the correction. I should have checked my figures before making that statement. The 410 loader on the 4010 still shows the same lift capacity, but I guess it must do it a llittle slower /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Koz, you can drive yourself crazy with the "next size up" syndrome, but I think I've found my sweet spot at the 4110 (I bet I said something similar when I bought the 2210 /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif). I have a little more loader work now than I originally predicted and after a few spins around without the loader and ballast, I'm sure I will be very pleased with the mowing capabilities. The 4110 just carries its weight extremely well, the engine sounds different, and the bigger wheels make it ride a lot smoother than my 2210 did on the same terrain. It looks like your prices are still a little high, but you will get there. Since you are financing, spreading out the difference between the 4010 and the 4110 might not be so painful. It's been said a thousand times, but nobody complains about having bought as much tractor as they could afford.

 

[Bob_In_MN]

Koz,

Can't comment on the 2210's 3 point, but the 4010 has a true cat 1 hitch. You are correct that the 2210's lower stance MAY be a limiting factor in using SOME 3 point attachments. But I have never read that from any of the 2210 owners on this site.

I love my 4010, but I'm just not sure it's up to running a 60 inch deck through high grass. I can't say that it isn't, because I've never tested it under those conditions.

When I was looking, the 4110 was about $1500 more than I was paying for my 4010. At the time, my dealer missed some rebates that would have put me within $500 of the 4110. If I would have known that, I would have paid the extra money. He gave me the money, but by then I had owned the 4010 for awhile and was quite happy with it.

If you can get the dealer to get the 4110 within $1000 of the 4010 and you finance that $1000 over 3 years, you are talking about an extra $30 per month. I also understand what it's like to be at your limit from a cash outlay standpoint.

I just dug out my invoice.

4010 Tractor--$9999
54 Inch Deck--$1600
Loader/Ballast--$2500
Suitcase Wgts.-180

Total--$14,279

In addition to the above, I received some rebates on attachments, but left those out of the above as I bought some more items and don't know what the rebates applied to.

I don't know the how much more the 60 inch deck is versus the 54.

Bob

 

[JClark]

Koz,

Just checked the JD site and Bob is correct in stating that the 4010 has a true Cat 1 hitch. Deere calls the 2210 hitch "Limited Cat 1". My 4110 has a "true Cat 1 hitch" but it sure is the lesser of equals in relation to the Cat 1 hitch on my old 950.

Like Bigpete, I really like my 4110 (relieve valve issue notwithstanding) and we all seem to have similar conditions. As for the $$, with very little haggling I paid $16,015 for my 4110, FEL, 60" MMM and Frontier BB1060 box blade (tax not included). That's just $500 more than your 4010 quote. Also, let me tell ya, a box blade is a lot more useful than a ballast box and still serves the same purpose.

I guess all this did nothing to help your headache, did it?