New 2025 Ram 1500 with hurricane engine.

[KennyG]

But adding a turbo requires more fuel (at higher output). Isn’t your statement skewed.

I think that's why trucks like the eco-boost get relatively poor gas mileage when towing, but a lot better unloaded (almost never on boost). Which is why the turbo engine makes sense for occasional towing but the diesel or V-8 is probably better if you tow a lot.

As an unrelated side note, I saw a news item on TV about the Stellantis CEO leaving. They illustrated it with images of a Ford dealer lot. Where do they find these people?

 

[tacticalturnip]

In the US, it is a disaster. When sales are down 42%, way more than other makers, something has to be done. My cousin bought a Ram 3500 because the price was right (below cost), but that doesn't help the companies bottom line if that is how they sell vehicles.

"In North America its revenues collapsed by 42 percent to $13.47 billion because of a fall in sales and price cuts to clear its stock of vehicles."

Sales Slump 27% At Carmaker Stellantis

Oh wow, maybe I'll take my F350 in and look at a 2500; I really liked my RAM 1500.

 

[orezok]

Okay, yes... his statement has a flaw, if you let the grammar police have at it. But I think we can assume he's talking about the old displacement versus turbo debate, and the cold hard fact that, over the full range of driving requirements, a turbo on a smaller displacement can achieve similar peak horsepower with less average fuel usage.

But adding more fuel implies higher output for normally aspirated, similar for turbo. Higher output is NOT average.

 

[WinterDeere]

But adding more fuel implies higher output for normally aspirated, similar for turbo. Higher output is NOT average.

I'm not following the argument, but it sounds like you're letting semantics get it the way of real-world advantage.

To produce more horsepower, you must use more fuel. After all, horsepower is nothing but the conversion of chemical potential energy to mechanical kinetic energy. We all get that.

But in the real world, you will use less fuel over the lifespan of a vehicle, if it has a smaller-displacement engine with a turbo, versus a larger displacement engine making similar peak horsepower without aid of a turbo.

 

[orezok]

You seem to consider “average” while the poster discussed “added fuel”. That is not the same thing

 

[WinterDeere]

You seem to consider “average” while the poster discussed “added fuel”. That is not the same thing

Yep. Just guessing at his intention, as it's what makes the argument reason out.

 

[ruffdog]

Oh wow, maybe I'll take my F350 in and look at a 2500; I really liked my RAM 1500.

When you go looking at vehicles, pay attention to how long it has sat on the lot. Depending how the dealer finances it's stock, they may be more willing to deal more on the vehicles that have sat there longer. Some of these dealers (some going out of business) have vehicles sitting for 250-350+ days.

 

[Blue Mule]

Now that's funny disaster ..Maybe USA will bail out Ford and GM again how's that for disaster ? LMAO.. PS see a chit ton of jeeps still on the road can't say they have fallen off any cliff.

What you're not seeing though is NEW Jeeps on the road. As already mentioned, sales are falling quarter after quarter for Jeep and Ram. They're the ONLY domestic brand showing losses every quarter and this has been going on for 2 to 3 years. It is a disaster. They're scrambling trying to figure out a plan. That's why the Charger EV has been delayed and the ICE version is being sped up. It's why Jeep base pricing has been slashed. It's ultimately why the CEO is gone. They're in trouble.

I test drove a 2025 Ram 1500. 14 miles on the odometer. Wind noise was so bad around the windshield I couldn't even have a conversation with the salesman. The quality is horrendous now. The UAW workers are ticked off because the company is forcing them to pass junk down the line that even UAW wouldn't normally pass.

The only automaker in worse condition right now is Nissan. Their CEO says they've got 14 months to "survive" unless things somehow miraculously turn around right now.

In the U.S. market you have to build what people want. Otherwise you're cooked. Neither Stellantis or Nissan got the memo.

 

[deserteagle71]

What you're not seeing though is NEW Jeeps on the road. As already mentioned, sales are falling quarter after quarter for Jeep and Ram. They're the ONLY domestic brand showing losses every quarter and this has been going on for 2 to 3 years. It is a disaster.

It's a case of pushing the pricing just to see just how far they could go before people refused to buy.

I have a 2006 Wrangler Rubicon. Two years ago I was thinking I'd like a new one so I priced it out with the options I required. It came to $71,000 before taxes! If I wanted the V8 engine in it, starting price was $85,000! That was two years ago; I'm still driving my 2006.

The selling price doubled...and the quality went way down. Jeep forums are filled with people crying about the problems they are having with their new Wranglers.

 

[coobie]

What you're not seeing though is NEW Jeeps on the road. As already mentioned, sales are falling quarter after quarter for Jeep and Ram. They're the ONLY domestic brand showing losses every quarter and this has been going on for 2 to 3 years. It is a disaster. They're scrambling trying to figure out a plan. That's why the Charger EV has been delayed and the ICE version is being sped up. It's why Jeep base pricing has been slashed. It's ultimately why the CEO is gone. They're in trouble.

I test drove a 2025 Ram 1500. 14 miles on the odometer. Wind noise was so bad around the windshield I couldn't even have a conversation with the salesman. The quality is horrendous now. The UAW workers are ticked off because the company is forcing them to pass junk down the line that even UAW wouldn't normally pass.

The only automaker in worse condition right now is Nissan. Their CEO says they've got 14 months to "survive" unless things somehow miraculously turn around right now.

In the U.S. market you have to build what people want. Otherwise you're cooked. Neither Stellantis or Nissan got the memo.

Now thats odd Drove a 2025 GMC Denali 1/2 ton & experienced the same thing you did with the Ram you drove.IMHO you can get a lemon in any brand ..

 

[Snobdds]

What does this post have to do with 2025 Ram 1500 just curious?

Nobody wants to buy a truck with a company that won't be here in 5 years.

 

[coobie]

Nobody wants to buy a truck with a company that won't be here in 5 years.

Funny they said the same thing about ford,GM and Chrysler before the government bail out.Funny how that works

 

[Snobdds]

Funny they said the same thing about ford and Gm before the government bail out.Funny how that works

I wouldn't be acting too cocky...

There is no appetite in this country right now to bail out any poorly ran business...which stalentis is experiencing right now.

Just because something happened in the past, does not guarantee that same result in the future...

 

[WinterDeere]

Funny they said the same thing about ford,GM and Chrysler before the government bail out.Funny how that works

I'm not sure I would count on a bail-out, this time around. Times and attitudes change. Our government has done a lot of things over the years, which were accepted in their time, but would not be today.

I think snobdds makes a good point about confidence in a continued parts and support chain driving sales. We have seen it happen before, a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I really hope it's not the case, as I have grown to prefer Dodge and Ram over any other USA brand in the last 20 years. But if they do manage to stay in business, and if product quality has already dropped from their relative high of the 20-teens, then it may not be the same company it recently was, anyway.

 

[coobie]

I Could care less who gets bailed out or who got bailed out in 1979/80.Get tired of ram this chevy this ford this crying truck comparisons ..Makes for great entertainment tough.

 

[Snobdds]

I Could care less who gets bailed out or who got bailed out in 1979/80.Get tired of ram this chevy this ford this crying truck comparisons ..Makes for great entertainment tough.

Are you new at this?

Every truck thread in the history of the internet has devolved into Chevy v Ford v whatever the third one is called today.

This should surprise nobody.

 

[coobie]

Are you new at this?

Every truck thread in the history of the internet has devolved into Chevy v Ford v whatever the third one is called today.

This should surprise nobody.

Nope not new at all to this dumb comparison crap show.I find it amusing .. My truck is better than your truck.Meet you down by the monkey bars so we can settle this dispute..

 

[paulsharvey]

Nope not new at all to this dumb comparison crap show.I find it amusing .. My truck is better than your truck.Meet you down by the monkey bars so we can settle this dispute..

You want to get people riled up.
"Back in my day, we drank the Miller and welded with a Lincoln"
"Nothing runs like a deere"
"if it's not a CAT, it's a dog"
45 ACP, back to back World War champions
Shuttle shift is better than HST
SEC SEC SEC

 

[Hay Dude]

But adding a turbo requires more fuel (at higher output). Isn’t your statement skewed.

No, Ozerok, it isn’t “skewed”.
It’s pretty simple. A 4 barrel carb of yesterday simply added fuel. Lot’s of fuel.
If you didn’t notice, fuel has gotten expensive.

A turbocharger compresses air into the engine, and of course more fuel is added, but not the amount of fuel a 4 barrel carb does. It’s much more efficient than just flooding fuel into the engine was my point.

If you still don’t get it, ask yourself this: How many 4bbl cars/trucks you see in production? How many turbocharged cars/trucks you see in production?

 

[Hay Dude]

Nobody wants to buy a truck with a company that won't be here in 5 years.

It’ll still be here. Just owned by someone else.
I have somehow survived the change from FCA to Stellantis without a hiccup.

Best truck I’ve ever owned and if the new version with a ZF-8 behind a Cummins is what I think it’ll be, I’ll be driving one.