Diesel fuel Injector pump leaking into crankcase?

[piper184]

That is a different pump than mine but the basic structure is similar. They probably all are.

The o-ring I was referring to was on the the actuator shaft where it enters the lift pump body. It was the only thing that separated the fuel in the lift pump from the oil in the IP sump. The lift pump had a gasket on it where it clamped to the IP.

Here are a couple of pictures of my IP with and without the lift pump. You can see where I make a plate to cover the hole in the IP sump with the over flow port just to the left of the plate. The IP governor is in the housing to the right of the plate, it shares oil with the sump.

When the lift pump leaked at the o-ring the fuel just flowed into the sump, diluting the oil and eventually overflowing it. By eliminating the lift pump leak it solved the fuel in the sump problem for a while. Now it is leaking a little and because the lift pump is gone, the leak has to be internal to the IP since the only source of fuel is in the upper end of the IP. Probably wear in the pistons that could be repaired, IF there were a competent shop nearby that would work on it. The only good shops here refuse to work on import stuff and by the time I ship it to someplace I can probably buy a new pump for the same $.

At this time, there is no issue with fuel getting into the engine because I keep the excess drained from the sump so it can not get pressurized and push past the input shaft seal where it could then enter the engine via the timing gear case.

 

[Bob Rooks]

They are all the same except on which side the primer pump is on. This is the push rod where the O-ring goes. Don't know why I didn't include this pic. Sorry.

 

[piper184]

Good. I had looked but didn't find where I had taken a picture of the lift pump. It is in a box somewhere in the shop.
I never seem to throw something away just because it doesn't do the assigned task any longer. Never know what I might do with it in the future.
Or, it will just be the auctioneer's problem....

 

[Lodi]

Here are your lift pump components.

Thanks much Mr Rooks!
From that photo there doesn’t seem to be any o-rings or seals that I would be able to replace in the lift pump. Do you have a method for repairing a leaking lift pump? If so, I would gladly try to do that on mine before going any farther.

 

[Lodi]

Good. I had looked but didn't find where I had taken a picture of the lift pump. It is in a box somewhere in the shop.
I never seem to throw something away just because it doesn't do the assigned task any longer. Never know what I might do with it in the future.
Or, it will just be the auctioneer's problem....

Lol. I agree with you. I never throw anything away either. I seem to find some odd use for them years later.

 

[Bob Rooks]

Thanks much Mr Rooks!
From that photo there doesn’t seem to be any o-rings or seals that I would be able to replace in the lift pump. Do you have a method for repairing a leaking lift pump? If so, I would gladly try to do that on mine before going any farther.

Individual component parts are not available. You would have to source the O-rings locally (Buna-N, silicone, Neoprene). But as Piper and myself have done is to just remove the mechanical lift pump altogether and install an electric pump wired to the key switch. My wheel loader with a Kubota diesel, and my excavator with a Yanmar diesel came from the factory with electric lift pumps. It's the way to go, really. You will always get some minute fuel leakage from the barrel and plungers because there is no seal, it's just the lap fit that prevents leakage - that's why it is so important to keep the fuel as clean and moisture free as possible - to minimize wear and prevent "bugs".

 

[Lodi]

Individual component parts are not available. You would have to source the O-rings locally (Buna-N, silicone, Neoprene). But as Piper and myself have done is to just remove the mechanical lift pump altogether and install an electric pump wired to the key switch. My wheel loader with a Kubota diesel, and my excavator with a Yanmar diesel came from the factory with electric lift pumps. It's the way to go, really. You will always get some minute fuel leakage from the barrel and plungers because there is no seal, it's just the lap fit that prevents leakage - that's why it is so important to keep the fuel as clean and moisture free as possible - to minimize wear and prevent "bugs".

Okay. Sounds good to me. I will look for electric lift pump. Do I need to look for some specific pressure rating?

 

[piper184]

It doesn't take much pressure. I think the one I used was 4 to 7 psi.
If your fuel tank is higher than the filter and the IP, you can probably just get it to run without the pump. At least for some testing.
If you make a cover plate for the lift pump you can leave it connected, just tied up securely. Then if you run the tractor an hour or so, you can check the oil level in the IP sump and the crankcase to confirm whether or not that was the source. That way you can easily put things back if the lift pump is not the culprit.
Another thing you could do is get some fluorescent die for oil and put in the IP sump. Then after a couple of hours, check to see if it shows up in crankcase.

 

[Bob Rooks]

This is the one I used, there are cheaper ones now.

Amazon.com

And I used this filter before the electric pump.

Amazon.com

 

[Lodi]

That is a different pump than mine but the basic structure is similar. They probably all are.

The o-ring I was referring to was on the the actuator shaft where it enters the lift pump body. It was the only thing that separated the fuel in the lift pump from the oil in the IP sump. The lift pump had a gasket on it where it clamped to the IP.

Here are a couple of pictures of my IP with and without the lift pump. You can see where I make a plate to cover the hole in the IP sump with the over flow port just to the left of the plate. The IP governor is in the housing to the right of the plate, it shares oil with the sump.

When the lift pump leaked at the o-ring the fuel just flowed into the sump, diluting the oil and eventually overflowing it. By eliminating the lift pump leak it solved the fuel in the sump problem for a while. Now it is leaking a little and because the lift pump is gone, the leak has to be internal to the IP since the only source of fuel is in the upper end of the IP. Probably wear in the pistons that could be repaired, IF there were a competent shop nearby that would work on it. The only good shops here refuse to work on import stuff and by the time I ship it to someplace I can probably buy a new pump for the same $.

At this time, there is no issue with fuel getting into the engine because I keep the excess drained from the sump so it can not get pressurized and push past the input shaft seal where it could then enter the engine via the timing gear case.

Thanks much for photos. That silver canister looks like it might be block heater maybe. Those suggestions you made about cover plate and leaving pump connected to fuel lines sound great. Also the idea you have about using fluorescent dye in IP sump. Do you just use 4 ounces of engine oil for sump or a different oil. Your “before” picture shows your fuel line connectors to the old lift pump. Mine are the same. Can I ask how you were able to connect fuel lines to new electric fuel pump? Did you have to change the connectors?
Thanks much for your time Mr Piper.

 

[Lodi]

This is the one I used, there are cheaper ones now.


And I used this filter before the electric pump.

Thanks much Mr Rooks! Those links you posted are just what I needed to see.

 

[piper184]

Yes, the cylinder with the red mounting strap is a 1000W tank heater. Will bring the head from -30F up to above freezing in about an hour. Real necessity here.

The banjo style ends are just crimped onto the hoses like any other hose end. Probably technically a 6mm fitting but will work just fine with 1/4" hose. I used a cut off wheel in the Dremel and removed the ferrel then it just pulled out of the hose. To re-use the end, a small regular hose clamp works just fine especially considering the low pressure application.

The OEM sediment bowl had a plastic bowl that quickly got cloudy and hard to see through, plus the valve leaked. I bought an aftermarket upgrade kit from Ranchhand Supply. As it turned out the tank was tapped 1/4" NPT so I added the two street elbows to move the bowl for easier access.

The electric fuel pump upgrade came later. The pump is an old style "clicker" pump that I had bought for a gas vehicle way back in the 1980's but never used. The box it came in had long been lost so I had no instructions and no idea if it was compatible with diesel. Installed it anyway and it has been working fine for many years.

The output hose goes to the secondary filter housing, where I removed the banjo end from the old hose and reused it on the new one. The last picture is the OEM setup when I was assembling it from the crate. I had already swapped out the blue OEM filter for a new NAPA Gold unit. You wouldn't believe the stuff that they called fuel that came in the tractor. All fluids were drained and flushed prior to re-filling with quality domestic products before it was started for the first time.

 

[Lodi]

Yes, the cylinder with the red mounting strap is a 1000W tank heater. Will bring the head from -30F up to above freezing in about an hour. Real necessity here.

The banjo style ends are just crimped onto the hoses like any other hose end. Probably technically a 6mm fitting but will work just fine with 1/4" hose. I used a cut off wheel in the Dremel and removed the ferrel then it just pulled out of the hose. To re-use the end, a small regular hose clamp works just fine especially considering the low pressure application.

The OEM sediment bowl had a plastic bowl that quickly got cloudy and hard to see through, plus the valve leaked. I bought an aftermarket upgrade kit from Ranchhand Supply. As it turned out the tank was tapped 1/4" NPT so I added the two street elbows to move the bowl for easier access.

The electric fuel pump upgrade came later. The pump is an old style "clicker" pump that I had bought for a gas vehicle way back in the 1980's but never used. The box it came in had long been lost so I had no instructions and no idea if it was compatible with diesel. Installed it anyway and it has been working fine for many years.

The output hose goes to the secondary filter housing, where I removed the banjo end from the old hose and reused it on the new one. The last picture is the OEM setup when I was assembling it from the crate. I had already swapped out the blue OEM filter for a new NAPA Gold unit. You wouldn't believe the stuff that they called fuel that came in the tractor. All fluids were drained and flushed prior to re-filling with quality domestic products before it was started for the first time.

Thanks much for great photos! Your repair work looks very professional in my opinion.

Thanks to your experience, creative ideas and photos and all the contributions from Mr Rooks and others at this site, I now at least have a repair plan in mind.

My fuel bowl valve is leaking too. I found that out when removing lift pump. I looked up Ranch Hand Supply as you suggested. I also found similar one at Affordable Tractor Sales.



I assembled my tractor from crated parts also. But I’ve never separated the engine from the tractor.

I don’t know how the clutch/pressure plate assembly is attached exactly. I would assume it would be similar to car/truck engines here. I would like to swap this engine before I get too old to move around.

My other concern is that the engine block itself seems to be holding the whole tractor together.

Have you had any experience removing your tractor’s engine? Like maybe you had to change a clutch plate or something?



Anyway thanks much again for sharing your knowledge and ideas. And for all of your time spent writing here. I am truly grateful.

 

[piper184]

When I was in high school I helped my dad split an old Case VAC tractor to replace the main seal. That was quite an ordeal since we didn't have any decent shop equipment. Getting the engine out of a tractor with a frame should be a lot easier. Especially now 50 years later when I own an engine hoist and lots of floor jacks and jack stands. However, I am glad that I have not had to do that kind of thing recently.

Just a matter of figuring out what comes off and what stays and how to hold it up.

Oh yeah, and LOTS of pictures as you go. We would never had considered such a thing back in the days when you had to send film in the mail and wait two weeks for the pictures to come back....

 

[Bob Rooks]

We would never had considered such a thing back in the days when you had to send film in the mail and wait two weeks for the pictures to come back....

One of my first ever jobs, working for a film developing lab - picking up and delivering film and photos in grocery and drug stores up and down the San Fransisco Peninsula in an old Jeep.

 

[Lodi]

One of my first ever jobs, working for a film developing lab - picking up and delivering film and photos in grocery and drug stores up and down the San Fransisco Peninsula in an old Jeep.

Cool! What a fun job that must have been! I only lived as close to that as Alameda, CA for a little over a year, but I sure enjoyed that area. The weather was always nice there in my opinion anyway. I went back to that area on vacation maybe 10 years ago. Everything had changed since I lived there in the early 70’s.

A lot of the Naval bases had been shut down. Even Treasure Island Naval base had become a ghost town.

 

[Lodi]

When I was in high school I helped my dad split an old Case VAC tractor to replace the main seal. That was quite an ordeal since we didn't have any decent shop equipment. Getting the engine out of a tractor with a frame should be a lot easier. Especially now 50 years later when I own an engine hoist and lots of floor jacks and jack stands. However, I am glad that I have not had to do that kind of thing recently.

Just a matter of figuring out what comes off and what stays and how to hold it up.

Oh yeah, and LOTS of pictures as you go. We would never had considered such a thing back in the days when you had to send film in the mail and wait two weeks for the pictures to come back....

Thanks much for reply! That sounds like good advice to me. I don’t have an engine hoist yet, but will probably just pick one up from Harbor Freight when I am ready. It’s just too cold for me to work outside now that I’m retired. Lol

I ordered a fuel bowl assembly that looks like it might fit from Affordable. I know he’s been around these Chinese tractor sites for quite a while. But I think this is the first time I’ve ordered any parts from his website.

 

[piper184]

They have a good reputation.