Kubota still offering 0 percent financing

[rScotty]

Wrong. It is a game. its a game of “who’s got a bigger pair” lol
0% financing is a gimmick. You pay more and get 0%, or you pay less if you pen a check IF you know how to negotiate.
I’m sorry I disagree with your opinion and after buying with a check and financing probably close to 50 pieces of equipment over the last 25 years, thats how the “0% financing” game works.

Like I said before, when you accept the 0% financing, most dealers bluff when they say “no, there’s no cash back if you write a check”.

There is. Its just that many people don’t have the mental strength to get up and walk out if the dealer plays his game.

Just ask Lineman North Florida. My experience has been the same. How many deals have you made with dealers lately on financed or non-financed equipment lately? It helps to be a frequent or recent buyer to know how to negotiate
Hay Dude

Dude, I don't doubt that shell game you describe is the one that you play with dealers, and I also understand that because you do it that way, you think yours is the same game that all customers and all dealers play. But it isn't, and it's not. That's just your own perspective. That limitation defines your game.

Others do it differently and for different reasons. Deals that other TBNers put together between dealers and customers could be similar to yours - or they could be entirely different. In my case, it's very different.
rScotty

 

[Hay Dude]

Dude, I don't doubt that shell game you describe is the one that you play with dealers, and I also understand that because you do it that way, you think yours is the same game that all customers and all dealers play. But it isn't, and it's not. That's just your own perspective. That limitation defines your game.

Others do it differently and for different reasons. Deals that other TBNers put together between dealers and customers could be similar to yours - or they could be entirely different. In my case, it's very different.
rScotty

Theres only a few ways to purchase: check or finance (leaving trade in out as it just complicates things). So theres only a few ways to buy.
Here in this topic, we are talking about 0% financing . Only a very foolish seller supplied by a manufacturer would off both 0% and cash back.
Theres more money there. You just have to know how to get it.
North Florida Lineman just showed us exactly what I’m saying.
Are you saying he’s wrong?

 

[jyoutz]

Theres only a few ways to purchase: check or finance (leaving trade in out as it just complicates things). So theres only a few ways to buy.
Here in this topic, we are talking about 0% financing . Only a very foolish seller supplied by a manufacturer would off both 0% and cash back.
Theres more money there. You just have to know how to get it.
North Florida Lineman just showed us exactly what I’m saying.
Are you saying he’s wrong?

He’s not wrong. But that sort of thing isn’t universal, and it depends on what equipment Kubota is offering incentives on at the time. It changes periodically. There are machines that don’t even qualify for 0% periodically, then they will come back on incentives. This is reflected in the Kubota website and I’ve watched incentives come and go online for about a year before making my last purchase.

 

[rScotty]

Theres only a few ways to purchase: check or finance (leaving trade in out as it just complicates things). So theres only a few ways to buy.
Here in this topic, we are talking about 0% financing . Only a very foolish seller supplied by a manufacturer would off both 0% and cash back.
Theres more money there. You just have to know how to get it.
North Florida Lineman just showed us exactly what I’m saying.
Are you saying he’s wrong?

There is no way that "Lineman North Florida" can be wrong. Back in message #80 he simply reported how a transaction worked between himself and his dealer.
The key is that is how it worked between himself and his dealer.

It was you, who then immediately - in the very next message - took what Lineman said, blended it with your own purchasing philosophy, and tried to make the resulting shell game sound like all of these buying and selling deals involving cash and financing worked the same way.

But they don't, and thinking that they do is simply your own perception.
And that is the limitation.

Think about it,
rScotty

 

[Torvy]

Math is a thing. 0% is an advertising technique, but it is also a way for lenders to make more total dollars available to lend. (That part is a regulation thing)

You have to do the math on every deal. In some cases, the 0% is still a way better deal than the cash back. In some cases it is not. Most of the time you are better off taking the 0% and investing the cash. 36-84 months from now the recently dropped stocks will rebound. Over the last 50+ years the market has averaged over 10% ROI. If I buy a 100k tractor over 7 years, that would allow me to invest that money and make something in the neighborhood of 50k over those years...after losing some to inflation. Paying cash, even getting $10k cash back would still be a losing option financially.

All dealers do NOT pay the same wholesale. Most manufacturers offer their best dealers all sorts of incentives. Sometimes they also offer incentives to new dealers to help them get started moving product. On top of that, some dealers go for higher volumes with lower margins; others want higher margins and sell fewer units.

Dealers also market to different types of customers. Up where I grew up, it is mostly rural and many farms are 300+ acres. They sell a higher percentage of big AG tractors. Small tractors are 2nd (or 3rd+) and used to clean up around the farm stead or assist with pulling trailers or wagons while the big tractors are working. In suburban areas like I am in now, most tractors are small and spend most of their time landscaping. Dealers here sell few AG tractors as they are too big for the properties. Margins are larger on the big stuff, so they can sell fewer and still make payroll.

 

[Hay Dude]

Math is a thing. 0% is an advertising technique, but it is also a way for lenders to make more total dollars available to lend. (That part is a regulation thing)

You have to do the math on every deal. In some cases, the 0% is still a way better deal than the cash back. In some cases it is not. Most of the time you are better off taking the 0% and investing the cash. 36-84 months from now the recently dropped stocks will rebound. Over the last 50+ years the market has averaged over 10% ROI. If I buy a 100k tractor over 7 years, that would allow me to invest that money and make something in the neighborhood of 50k over those years...after losing some to inflation. Paying cash, even getting $10k cash back would still be a losing option financially.

All dealers do NOT pay the same wholesale. Most manufacturers offer their best dealers all sorts of incentives. Sometimes they also offer incentives to new dealers to help them get started moving product. On top of that, some dealers go for higher volumes with lower margins; others want higher margins and sell fewer units.

Dealers also market to different types of customers. Up where I grew up, it is mostly rural and many farms are 300+ acres. They sell a higher percentage of big AG tractors. Small tractors are 2nd (or 3rd+) and used to clean up around the farm stead or assist with pulling trailers or wagons while the big tractors are working. In suburban areas like I am in now, most tractors are small and spend most of their time landscaping. Dealers here sell few AG tractors as they are too big for the properties. Margins are larger on the big stuff, so they can sell fewer and still make payroll.

Depends on interest rates of course.
Back about 2 years ago, if you were financing, it was an easier decision to take the cash offered by dealer and finance through a business line.
Now that rates have doubled or tripled in the “new economy”, taking the 0% is probably going to result in less interest paid over the life of the loan, even though the up front price paid will be higher. Still a good idea to calculate both and see what the results are.

Then there’s personal loan guarantees and other issues that come into play.
I have a line with no personal loan guarantee and I will not borrow money under anything other than my corporation or LLCs name. No personal signature guarantees signed for business equipment and I never will.

 

[Hay Dude]

There is no way that "Lineman North Florida" can be wrong. Back in message #80 he simply reported how a transaction worked between himself and his dealer.
The key is that is how it worked between himself and his dealer.

It was you, who then immediately - in the very next message - took what Lineman said, blended it with your own purchasing philosophy, and tried to make the resulting shell game sound like all of these buying and selling deals involving cash and financing worked the same way.

But they don't, and thinking that they do is simply your own perception.
And that is the limitation.

Think about it,
rScotty

I have thought about it-many times in the last 30 years.
All I can comment on your last response is, if you and your likers enjoy giving the dealer more money than you should, that’s your right.
I will fight for every dollar, and will continue to do so as I have through my 30+ years in business.
I became friends with a Kubota tractor and equipment salesman who recently retired and became a pastor. He was able to share with me many things unknown to me about the business that surprised me.
And BTW: I don’t play a shell game with the dealer-they try to play it with their buyers.

 

[Hay Dude]

He’s not wrong. But that sort of thing isn’t universal, and it depends on what equipment Kubota is offering incentives on at the time. It changes periodically. There are machines that don’t even qualify for 0% periodically, then they will come back on incentives. This is reflected in the Kubota website and I’ve watched incentives come and go online for about a year before making my last purchase.

Whats the old saying? “Theres a sucker born every minute“
Sure there’s always the possibility there’s no incentives from the manufacturer, but the dealer has a markup. If he won’t move, knowing how to get up and walk away is part of negotiation. Last deal I made, I walked away and the salesman called me while driving home with a better offer. A sucker would sit in the chair and accept.
It’s knowing how to negotiate the markup that separates the suckers from the successful.
Have fun being in the former category. I’ll try to be in the latter.

 

[rScotty]

SNIP

Then there’s personal loan guarantees and other issues that come into play.
I have a line with no personal loan guarantee and I will not borrow money under anything other than my corporation or LLCs name. No personal signature guarantees signed for business equipment and I never will.

Whats the old saying? “Theres a sucker born every minute“
Sure there’s always the possibility there’s no incentives from the manufacturer, but the dealer has a markup. If he won’t move, knowing how to get up and walk away is part of negotiation. Last deal I made, I walked away and the salesman called me while driving home with a better offer. A sucker would sit in the chair and accept.
It’s knowing how to negotiate the markup that separates the suckers from the successful.
Have fun being in the former category. I’ll try to be in the latter.

We run our businesses very differently as regards loan guarantees. And that is probably reflected in how we work with suppliers and dealers as well.

We disagree on much. I work in a business world that is not limited to suckers vs non-suckers - although I admit to encountering some of each. There are many different values and ways to work a deal for both parties.
Business is just not that simple or all about profit - even 0% finance is not so simple.

rScotty

 

[jyoutz]

Whats the old saying? “Theres a sucker born every minute“
Sure there’s always the possibility there’s no incentives from the manufacturer, but the dealer has a markup. If he won’t move, knowing how to get up and walk away is part of negotiation. Last deal I made, I walked away and the salesman called me while driving home with a better offer. A sucker would sit in the chair and accept.
It’s knowing how to negotiate the markup that separates the suckers from the successful.
Have fun being in the former category. I’ll try to be in the latter.

Please describe your recent experience with buying a NEW machine. Lots of big talk, but have you executed? Describe your masterful negotiation. Not buying something used, but new. People are waiting to hear. Or is it all theories with you?