Backhoe attachment for Yanmar FX24D?

[Leaferfly]

Hi, I'm a new member and new to tractors in general. I inherited a property of 5 acres recently and am beginning a small family (non-commercial) farm. I have a Yanmar FX 24D in very good shape with only 340 hours on it. I'm having trouble finding specs on this grey market tractor. Specifically I am trying to determine if it will accommodate a small backhoe attachment. I'm looking at the WoodMaxx BHM5600 6', which weighs in at just under 1000 lb with thumb, operates with 3 point tractors in the 16-25 HP range.
My Yanmar brings 24 HP to the PTO, 28 to the engine. I do not know the lift capacity of the PTO, there is limited info on tractordata.com or anywhere else it seems. The weight of the tractor is 2623 lbs. Has 3 point hitch. Has wheel base approx. 65". Currently equipped with a 300Kg front loader.
The dealer I bought it from, who primarily deals used Yanmars, stated it'll work with a small backhoe unit without causing damage to the tractor and without the need for a subframe. He stated he has sold hundreds of older yanmars and has known several people who run a backhoe attachment for years, even on lower power units like the YM2210, without using it super gingerly and have seen no issues. Yet I have heard from others that a backhoe unit on an old 3 point Yanmar may split the tractor in half if it doesn't have a subframe.
My uses for the backhoe will be fairly light duty: digging out roots of smaller trees and shrubs, picking smaller boulders, and digging a 300' 16"- deep trench for fiber optic cable.
I'm looking for a confident answer. Does anyone have direct experience with this? Can I operate a 1000 lb backhoe attachment on my Yanmar FX24D without engineering a subframe? (not sure if I currently have the skills to create such a thing)
I do not need it to be 100% risk free usage, but within a reasonable risk tolerance for the applications I'll be using it on.
Thank you

 

[Vigo327]

Generally speaking a tractor of that size could lift 1000lbs on the 3 pt. It may or may not be able to lift 1000 lbs in the shape of a backhoe because a significant part of the weight hangs pretty far out. But, in a pinch you can push the 3pt up with the backhoe (boom or outriggers), take up the slack with the 3pt lift on the tractor, and then raise the backhoe boom/outriggers and drive gingerly to your next location. I do this occasionally with a 3pt trencher attachment that my tiny kubota cannot lift. I just use the 'chain bar' tilt to pick the trencher itself up, lift my 3pt, tilt the chain bar back up and drive. Just be aware when carrying something heavier than what the 3pt will actually lift, trying to lift the 3pt will actually DROP the attachment. Might want to chain it up for transit.

As for whether it will break the tractor, I would say if you are a cautious operator you will be fine. Just my .02

 

[Williy]

My dealer says never use a 3pt backhoe
tractors can be damaged too easy and the
cost is a lot more that buying brackets to
hook up the backhoe proper!

You can try these people to see if they have what you
need! Durattach https://www.durattach.com/tractor-p...r=asc&limit=64&manufacturer=25&order=name&p=2

Backhoes are an extremely handy tool but some care needs to be taken when installing one on your Yanmar tractor. The problem is that the yanmar uses the bellhousing as a structural part of the frame.

The bellhousing is plenty strong for normal tractor and loader work but add a three point backhoe and you can get into trouble. In order to prevent the tractor from breaking in half you need to be sure the three point has a sub-frame installed. A subframe is a structural brace that connects the front axle support to the rear axle housings. It basically takes the load off of the bellhousing and distributes it safely.

willy

 

[Leaferfly]

Generally speaking a tractor of that size could lift 1000lbs on the 3 pt. It may or may not be able to lift 1000 lbs in the shape of a backhoe because a significant part of the weight hangs pretty far out. But, in a pinch you can push the 3pt up with the backhoe (boom or outriggers), take up the slack with the 3pt lift on the tractor, and then raise the backhoe boom/outriggers and drive gingerly to your next location. I do this occasionally with a 3pt trencher attachment that my tiny kubota cannot lift. I just use the 'chain bar' tilt to pick the trencher itself up, lift my 3pt, tilt the chain bar back up and drive. Just be aware when carrying something heavier than what the 3pt will actually lift, trying to lift the 3pt will actually DROP the attachment. Might want to chain it up for transit.

As for whether it will break the tractor, I would say if you are a cautious operator you will be fine. Just my .02

Thanks for your input. It adds one more vote to the group of folks who say I can do it without a subframe. But that’s the answer I want to hear. Is it the right answer? I still am hearing from people who caution me heavily against it. The problem is I don’t know how much personal experience they have and what their risk tolerance is. It’s like some people will drive on a donut spare for only as long as the manufacturer recommendation, while others know that can be flexed quite a bit if done carefully. I don’t know.
I might look more into a subframe, I just worry my learning curve with it will be steep. I have seen photos on other forums of example subframe, and I know some metal workers so that’s at least a start.

 

[yanmars]

Now this is not a direct comparison. I have a Yanmar 336d tractor, an early 1980s model with 33 HP. I have a Woods 750 3pt backhoe on it. Initially I used it without a subframe. That always concerned me. I wondered why would Yanmar make a subframe if they did not feel it was needed. I added one and am glad I did. The expense was not that great and thought it could avoid the potential for a great deal of tractor damage. Just my thoughts.

 

[Leaferfly]

Now this is not a direct comparison. I have a Yanmar 336d tractor, an early 1980s model with 33 HP. I have a Woods 750 3pt backhoe on it. Initially I used it without a subframe. That always concerned me. I wondered why would Yanmar make a subframe if they did not feel it was needed. I added one and am glad I did. The expense was not that great and thought it could avoid the potential for a great deal of tractor damage. Just my thoughts.

Where did you find your subframe? Or did you make it yourself? All of my efforts of finding a pre-fab subframe for my fx 24d have come up empty

 

[yanmars]

It is a Yanmar subframe. Purchased in the early 1990s from a Yanmar dealer. Can disconnect easily to remove the backhoe unit but part still remains attached to the tractor as I recall. Have not fussed with it for years as occasionally I have a use for the backhoe and I have a second tractor.

 

[yanmars]

I should take that back. It may have been a unit built or provided for by the Woods backhoe company for the Yanmar. Just don't remember for sure. If I get time I will try to locate the invoice.

 

[yanmars]

I found info on the purchase for my 336d Yanmar and Woods 750 BH. That will not help your model but I got the subframe on 12-14-1992 through a Case IH dealer. It cost $345.00 then. No model number on the invoice but I have some notes that seem to indicate 8561. Is that a Woods or Yanmar number, unsure? Wish I could provide more.

 

[Leaferfly]

No worries, thanks for taking a look, I appreciate it. I'll keep plugging away and researching. I'm thinking I better not risk it without a subframe. If I cant find one pre-fab, I'll have to create it myself. With time and will, one can do nearly anything.

 

[Leaferfly]

My dealer says never use a 3pt backhoe
tractors can be damaged too easy and the
cost is a lot more that buying brackets to
hook up the backhoe proper!

You can try these people to see if they have what you
need! Durattach https://www.durattach.com/tractor-p...r=asc&limit=64&manufacturer=25&order=name&p=2

Backhoes are an extremely handy tool but some care needs to be taken when installing one on your Yanmar tractor. The problem is that the yanmar uses the bellhousing as a structural part of the frame.

The bellhousing is plenty strong for normal tractor and loader work but add a three point backhoe and you can get into trouble. In order to prevent the tractor from breaking in half you need to be sure the three point has a sub-frame installed. A subframe is a structural brace that connects the front axle support to the rear axle housings. It basically takes the load off of the bellhousing and distributes it safely.

willy

That all makes plenty of sense. Not sure why my dealer would say the Yanmar didn't need a subframe, guess he just wanted to make the sale.
But if the weight and leverage of a backhoe attachment could break through the bell housing, wouldn't it also be a concern for breaking the subframe itself? How stout would the subframe need to be, I wonder. What thickness steel would be adequate?

 

[yanmars]

leaferfly What State are you located?

 

[Leaferfly]

leaferfly What State are you located?

I’m in California in the northeastern Sierra Nevadas pretty close to the Nevada border.

 

[Vigo327]

The problem is I don’t know how much personal experience they have and what their risk tolerance is. It’s like some people will drive on a donut spare for only as long as the manufacturer recommendation, while others know that can be flexed quite a bit if done carefully.

I absolutely get that. I actually put 4 space savers on a car and flat-towed it with a tow-bar from Texas to Florida and back, and i never went below 70mph if i didn't have to. I make a hobby out of exploring the caveats to 'conventional wisdom'.

As a mechanic I often read about people concerned about using this or that on their car and it not being able to 'hold up' to whatever use they're intending, and my main response is YOU the operator generally decide how much force goes through ANYTHING. What you buy with stronger components is basically the freedom to be less attentive to what you're doing, a fudge factor that can absorb YOUR mistakes. Now, operating a machine on 'high alert' can be exhausting if you do it for too long and don't enjoy the task in the first place. I have towed 5000lbs with 3000lb sedans, etc but if i towed stuff for a living id be in a big truck just like everybody else. But nobody ever looks at a video of an excavator opening a beer bottle with its bucket and says 'that level of precision looks exhausting'. If you're doing something you like doing, and enjoy pushing your limit or a machine's limit, it's not going to feel like work unless you actually do it as work (8hr day of it etc). I have a turbocharged 4cyl dodge caravan that has been up to 20psi of boost on cast pistons that everyone said will break at 7psi, and the list of things like that goes on and on.

So if it's something you only plan to do on your own time and you enjoy running machines, i think finding a way to skillfully operate within the limits of a machine and do things other people say it won't do is actually rewarding and fun. But you have to own the risk and clean up your own messes! If you can't mechanically or financially bail yourself out of a broken bellhousing or something major like that, i would think twice about taking the risks. But if you can, and you choose to.. more power to you!!