Tractor quit and won't start

[BakoJ]

I have a MT2 25S that I've had for a couple of weeks. I'm on it most days. I spent about 2 hours on it yesterday, everything went well. I dug out a really large concrete collar with the backhoe and that was a ton of fun.

Today, we were going to lift the collar with the backhoe onto the trailer. The collar weighs somewhere between 400 to 500 lbs. We backed up the tractor and we were about to strap it up when the tractor just stalled. When I turned the key to restart it, the tractor wouldn't start. I can hear the starter solenoid click, but it won't crank. Strangely, the display has going blank. At first, it would light up but the display was blank. After a few tries of cranking, the display doesn't even light up anymore. The headlights, tail lights and flashers all still work.

After opening the hood, checking battery connections and looking underneath, there's a small puddle of what I'm guessing is hydraulic fluid underneath the tractor.

Could this be a fuse issue? I'd be surprised if it was battery. I didn't have any trouble starting it before. I will say, there's a ton of smoke from the engine when I start it up, but it dissipates fairly quickly. I figured that was normal.

 

[CADplans]

RELENTLESSLY check the battery cable connections,, at BOTH ends of the cables.

A voltmeter is useless,, it will show volts, but, a loose connection will lose that voltage when current is pulled.

A loose bolt at where the negative cable connects to the tractor is very common.

 

[BakoJ]

RELENTLESSLY check the battery cable connections,, at BOTH ends of the cables.

A voltmeter is useless,, it will show volts, but, a loose connection will lose that voltage when current is pulled.

A loose bolt at where the negative cable connects to the tractor is very common.

Thanks. I'll have to check that in the morning.

 

[jaxs]

Have you attempted to test battery voltage with a volt meter? What about turning lights on? I can already tell you it;s either something minor,something major or a combination of minor and major things but if you put forth a little effort,maybe it won't be neccessary to cover every possability.

 

[BakoJ]

Have you attempted to test battery voltage with a volt meter? What about turning lights on? I can already tell you it;s either something minor,something major or a combination of minor and major things but if you put forth a little effort,maybe it won't be neccessary to cover every possability.

I haven't yet. It was getting dark (and really cold!). I will check in the morning, for sure. Headlights, tailights and flashers all work.

 

[jaxs]

Sounds like wiggle pin fell out of wobble shaft or there abouts.

 

[Diggin It]

Strangely, the display has going blank. At first, it would light up but the display was blank. After a few tries of cranking, the display doesn't even light up anymore. The headlights, tail lights and flashers all still work.

Not familiar with that model, but maybe check for a multi-pin connector to the dash that might have worked loose. That might account for the display and some sort of safety interlock.

After opening the hood, checking battery connections and looking underneath, there's a small puddle of what I'm guessing is hydraulic fluid underneath the tractor.

Not really sure how that could be related if it's hydro fluid. Unless it's battery fluid from a cracked battery? Also check engine oil ... if low engine could be locked out by a low pressure condition, but that wouldn't make the dash act silly.

I will say, there's a ton of smoke from the engine when I start it up, but it dissipates fairly quickly. I figured that was normal.

Cold starts will choke and shudder and puke. More Glow Plug time should help a lot.

Since your machine is so new, I don't suggest doing a whole lot until you can get ahold of your dealer.

 

[workinonit]

I'm not familiar with your tractor at all and don't know the level of electronics it has but I would say the starting issue and the shutting down issue could very well not be related. For me, I'm always concerned when a diesel tractor shuts down for no reason. That's usually not good and it's a pretty good sign it's not gonna start back up. However i would think it would turn over. My recommendation is get it to the dealer unless you have a service manual and a good knowledge of working on tractors.

 

[Texasmark]

I have one i bought new a year ago. The glow plug timer is short. Apparently its a high current plug and heats rapidly. The more glow time you have the easier it is to start and the less the partial ignition causing the white smoke on startup. I never tried to start mine colder than about 40F. On those days I will watch the glow coil in the dash display come on and go out. As soon as it goes out I cycle the On-Off Switch back to On and repeat a couple of times. Hitting the switch the 3rd time and rolling on over to Start gets a fast clean start.

On the click your starter solenoid is energizing closing the high current contact closing the circuit to spin the starter. There has to be current flowing for the starter to spin. Other folks have clued you in as to what to check. You have an "open circuit" somewhere in your loop from battery + around and through the starter and back to battery -.

Open circuit can be defined as a loose connection that would not allow the battery to supply the 100-200 amperes necessary to spin up the starter, get the bendix to engage the engines flywheel and supply the power to spin such. I agree if you had easy starting, something became loose during your previous run and the battery and charge level is probably not the problem.....but it could be if it was accidentally discharged (somehow) while you were working.

 

[rodneyn]

I have one i bought new a year ago. The glow plug timer is short. Apparently its a high current plug and heats rapidly. The more glow time you have the easier it is to start and the less the partial ignition causing the white smoke on startup. I never tried to start mine colder than about 40F. On those days I will watch the glow coil in the dash display come on and go out. As soon as it goes out I cycle the On-Off Switch back to On and repeat a couple of times. Hitting the switch the 3rd time and rolling on over to Start gets a fast clean start.

On the click your starter solenoid is energizing closing the high current contact closing the circuit to spin the starter. There has to be current flowing for the starter to spin. Other folks have clued you in as to what to check. You have an "open circuit" somewhere in your loop from battery + around and through the starter and back to battery -.

Open circuit can be defined as a loose connection that would not allow the battery to supply the 100-200 amperes necessary to spin up the starter, get the bendix to engage the engines flywheel and supply the power to spin such. I agree if you had easy starting, something became loose during your previous run and the battery and charge level is probably not the problem.....but it could be if it was accidentally discharged (somehow) while you were working.

I also have MT225S yes it hates cold weather. Noted on this board if you cycle glow plugs it will start better. I am in agreement but it still puffs a lot raw diesel for 30-40 seconds until motor is running smoothly in cold weather. Check your safety switches they can prevent motor from turning over. The MT225S is drive by wire throttle. Checking fuses and grounds is also wise suggestion. I have over 250 hours on my tractor it has been used primarily as yard mower with attached MMM. Only complaint I have is the plastic wheels on the MMM. Poor design on all four wheels. I have re-engineered the wheels adding swivel bearings and oil lite bronze bushing. The MMM does fantastic job mowing no disappointments running gear was poor design, cheaply designed.

 

[LittleBill21]

RELENTLESSLY check the battery cable connections,, at BOTH ends of the cables.

A voltmeter is useless,, it will show volts, but, a loose connection will lose that voltage when current is pulled.

A loose bolt at where the negative cable connects to the tractor is very common.

a voltmeter will easily determine a bad connection if current can be pulled through it on a starting circuit. Look up how to perform a voltage drop test

 

[CADplans]

a voltmeter will easily determine a bad connection if current can be pulled through it on a starting circuit. Look up how to perform a voltage drop test

True, if you have long enough leads, and long enough arms to hold the leads in place,, while you use your third arm to turn the key to get the current pulled,, and be able to see the meter from where you are safely cranking the tractor while sitting in the operators seat,,

 

[LittleBill21]

True, if you have long enough leads, and long enough arms to hold the leads in place,, while you use your third arm to turn the key to get the current pulled,, and be able to see the meter from where you are safely cranking the tractor while sitting in the operators seat,,

or you buy this and do it from the tractor seat with the meter next to you...

https://amzn.to/3rmw97L

 

[Avenger]

As others have mentioned, check for bad ground. That could be the reason it wont start. However, that's probably not the reason it died. The oil does concern me, check the level of both engine oil and hydraulic. If the oil pressure dropped, because of a leak, then the engine will save itself by shutting down. If you think its hydraulic oil, that shouldnt shut down the tractor, but is cause for concern since you need to find the leak anyway.

Since its cold, could be a dead battery. Jump it with a strong battery, like from a pickup. If it starts, then its probably the battery. I just had to do this about a month or so ago.

When it shut down, did it do anything like idle down, loop (rev up and down), anything weird like that? Or was is idling and suddenly stopped?

The smoke at startup is normal, unless it's excessive.

 

[BakoJ]

As others have mentioned, check for bad ground. That could be the reason it wont start. However, that's probably not the reason it died. The oil does concern me, check the level of both engine oil and hydraulic. If the oil pressure dropped, because of a leak, then the engine will save itself by shutting down. If you think its hydraulic oil, that shouldnt shut down the tractor, but is cause for concern since you need to find the leak anyway.

Since its cold, could be a dead battery. Jump it with a strong battery, like from a pickup. If it starts, then its probably the battery. I just had to do this about a month or so ago.

When it shut down, did it do anything like idle down, loop (rev up and down), anything weird like that? Or was is idling and suddenly stopped?

The smoke at startup is normal, unless it's excessive.

The engine just stopped. It is full of brand new fuel. I'm heading out to check everything else now.

 

[BakoJ]

Update: Checked everything I could. Every lever, switch, sensor, fluid level was checked. Battery connections were tight and showed 13.6 Volts on the multimeter.

The dash display and none of the warning/idiot lights display except for the parking brake indicator does light and the parking brake warning sounds. I'm sure it is an electrical or fuse problem, I just haven't located the fuses yet.

I called and asked to speak to a service tech at the dealership and was told one would call me back. Sadly the dealership is giving me the runaround. The sales rep told me they have a mobile tech. The service manager said they don't. And now it looks like service is going to be handled by another of their dealerships (not a big deal, equi-distant from my dealership).

Looks like I'll be loading it up and taking it over tomorrow.

 

[Avenger]

You didnt put a load meter on the battery? Amps vs volts. You need both.
Did you try jumping it, like I suggested?

 

[BakoJ]

You didnt put a load meter on the battery? Amps vs volts. You need both.
Did you try jumping it, like I suggested?

Yes, tried jumping it and no change. It won't even crank and the display is blank and will not light. I can't tell if this model has an ECM. It looks like it may. Does anyone know for sure?

 

[ZetorSteve]

Yes, tried jumping it and no change. It won't even crank and the display is blank and will not light. I can't tell if this model has an ECM. It looks like it may. Does anyone know for sure?

Did you check all the grounds to see if they are painted over? Whenever I get a car from a body shop that has wonky electrical issues I usually find a chassis ground that has no or poor ground due to paint between the connection. Take off any chassis ground you find check to make sure there is no paint between the connection and the chassis.

Did anybody explain how to do a voltage drop test on the wires? With all wires hooked up properly, take one of the meter leads and put it on the ground post of the battery. Directly on the post, not the terminal. Take the other lead and put it on the chassis ground. Have someone crank the engine while you watch the meter. If it is any more that .25v you have excessive resistance in that wire or the connections. Clean them to bare metal and recheck. Do the same on the positive post to the big power cable on the starter. If all checks ok then the problem is elsewhere.

Even if it doesn't crank right now you need to put the key in crank for the test to work fully. This test validates how well electricity will flow. Poor or no flow will give you problems. The higher the voltage reading during a voltage drop test, the higher resistance, or worst the problem.

 

[Egon]

If the tractor was running well and then just stopped I’d suspect a fuel solenoid issue or internal breakage of some kind that seized the motor. For the motor try cranking it with a direct connection from battery to starter. On the solenoid it’s all about following all circuits and safety switches, all control levers in the proper place, a solenoid that is good and there may be thermistor in circuit holding the solenoid open that has failed. The problem could also be with the battery. In some cases jumping the battery will not help.