Trespasser.....what would you do?

[Jstpssng]

First, Consider..

If you have not been to the land in many years, and that the property is held by some corporate interest? What is going on in the minds of the "trespassers? NO BODY CARES! and there is an old blind on the property, so it must be good to go.

Then think.

Most sportsmen are good people. Just like you and I. Presented with different information , they will make different decisions.

Finally. You could be friends! Friends are hard to come by. and a value that exceeds property that is seldom visited.

My employer manages 800,000 acres in this state. I'm in charge of about 50k of those. Most of that is open to use by the public in varying degrees.
I see the good and the bad, probably more than most here. Some do have the attitude they are going to do as they please. In that case a phone call to the local game warden, or to the Forest Service if it's a matter of dumping, is all that I need to do.

I talk to a lot of people over the course of a year. They want to pick up firewood after a harvest job ends, and appreciate not needing to buy it. Our only restrictions are that the job has to be done with all of the salable wood hauled; and we don't allow chainsaws.
I often hear how much people appreciate being able to use the land. Some people have been coming up to go deer hunting for over 40 years. Back then the hunting was great; now, not so much. Yet they still come up for a week. A father might take a ride out after work for a couple of hours with his two sons, trying to "pick up a bird" (Ruffed grouse). I think it's good for them to be able to do that.

There are a lot more of the latter category than the first, and I enjoy seeing people out doing things. If we didn't allow access, the only people I would see fall in the first category and I would likely share the attitude a lot of the posters here.

Our Forestry and Wildlife departments understand that most hunting activity in particular is done on private lands, and are working hard to ensure that access continues. Every year they sponsor a "fall cleanup day", where volunteers clean up what others have dumped over the past year. They also are very good about dealing with dumping and other problems, and if possible will find the owner, make him clean it up and issue a summons.

There's a push to turn the 3.2 million acres which have created jobs for centuries and turn in into a "National Park" putting me and thousands of others out of work. It also would virtually eliminate hunting in most of the state. Many don't understand (or care) that they would be destroying the very thing which makes the region unique; the interaction between public use on privately owned land.

 

[Jstpssng]

May you never experience a lawsuit…

Somewhere in TBN past there was a case about easement encroachment.
(It may have been pulled for legal reasons)

The issue went back and forth, a court case then snaked through the legal system and the op lost. In the process of losing time, experiencing prolonged stress, legal bills all ending in what I recall was the loss of the property due to court financial judgement.

In another matter a widow sold the family farmhouse to a jeweler who lived in town. The shrewd businessman then sued her - stated she misrepresented the home's condition. Five years later the widow won the court case, but she had to pay 5 years of legal bills first. She died of heart failure 3 years later.

Paraphrasing War Games - Sometimes the best choice is - not to play.

There was a lot more to that story than just somebody walking across another's land... and we only heard one side of it.
Here, if I sue you for injuries done while recrating on your land I probably will lose... and then will have to cover your expenses including but not limited to lawyer's fees. Since tha tlaw was passed over 40 years ago, there has not been one successful lawsuit.


As long as people like you let sleazebag lawyers control your life, that's the way this country will be.

 

[oosik]

Well - around here - "but the land is vacant" IS NOT a defensible position in a court action against trespass. Trespass is not defined by vacant or occupied land.

 

[Jstpssng]

Well - around here - "but the land is vacant" IS NOT a defensible position in a court action against trespass. Trespass is not defined by vacant or occupied land.

That is there. This is here. You wouldn't control your lake... anything natural pond over 10 acres belongs to the state, and (foot) access is allowed across undeveloped land.

 

[oosik]

We must have finally educated all the northeasterners to our laws out here. Like it or not - that's the way it is around here.

Once again the mighty Mississippi is a great dividing point ............

BTW - looks like the Patriots have a good chance of winning this Sunday. The Seahawks - I'm not holding my breath.

Have a good weekend Jstpssng. I like the way we can discuss varying points.

 

[MossRoad]

I think it's just Vermont and Maine that have open lands unless posted.

Then there is the exception of sates with coastlines, not just oceans, but the great lakes, too. In those states, you have to let people pass along the coast. I think it's delineated by the high water mark or something similar.

 

[Jstpssng]

<snip> I like the way we can discuss varying points.

I was thinking the same thing. As another poster mentioned, we are discussing things which should be kept at the state level.

 

[kthompson]

This is a topic that many many land owners have experienced and one of the main concerns of owning land. Even just a lot for your house. We are faced with it from time to time and have learned if in open view to asked why they are there or do they realize they are trespassing? The asking do they realize they are trespassing was recommended wording was suggest to me by a property manager for it is not threatening but does make them aware they are not legal (of course back to state law). Most have wanted to look from our clear fields at the woods land beside it for sale or wanting to fish our pond visible from the road. Has also happened with the land for sale the for-sale sign was the cause of one as it made them think it was our land.

But we have had the deer stands when it was cut over woods land and all I did was lay the stands down and, in few days, they were gone. In my part of the world, we expect people to respect each other's property. Sadly, too many moving in here are new to having land around them and don't know to ASK permission.

As has been warned by a few if you are rude as owner some will harm your land.

 

[K5lwq]

If you do not go to a property often, why not lease it out for hunting. The guys paying for the lease will run the others off for you and generally will take care of the property.

 

[Fuddy1952]

This video to me is funny, a trespassing hunter. Caution: fowl language:

 

[TheMan419]

If you do not go to a property often, why not lease it out for hunting. The guys paying for the lease will run the others off for you and generally will take care of the property.

You then have different liability issues depending on state law. In indiana if you are on my property without permission (posted or not) I have zero liability if you are injured. If you are a guest I have liability if I knew of the danger. If you are a customer I have an even higher duty to care for you.

My insurance man said if I let a friend hunt my homeowners policy covers me. If I am charging to hint I need a commercial policy.

 

[TheMan419]

We must have finally educated all the northeasterners to our laws out here. Like it or not - that's the way it is around here.

Once again the mighty Mississippi is a great dividing point ............

BTW - looks like the Patriots have a good chance of winning this Sunday. The Seahawks - I'm not holding my breath.

Have a good weekend Jstpssng. I like the way we can discuss varying points.

its east of the Mississippi. Indiana you are trespassing if you enter my property without permission. Posted or not.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

This video to me is funny, a trespassing hunter. Caution: fowl language:

I'm 100% in favor of private property rights, and for people to stay off any land that is posted.

However, something like what is shown in that video is asking for trouble. You're probably going to jail for setting booby traps.

I wonder if the property owner filmed the retribution, where the guy came back and burned his barn down, or set fire to his woods?

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Looks like both the trespasser AND the land owner were charged.

Both would have their charges dropped after 6 months of being a "good boy".

Booby traps may seem "funny" on the internet. But there are laws against it.

Booby Trap Blasts Paint All Over Trespassing Hunter

 

[Larry Caldwell]

May you never experience a lawsuit…

Somewhere in TBN past there was a case about easement encroachment.
(It may have been pulled for legal reasons)

The issue went back and forth, a court case then snaked through the legal system and the op lost. In the process of losing time, experiencing prolonged stress, legal bills all ending in what I recall was the loss of the property due to court financial judgement.

In another matter a widow sold the family farmhouse to a jeweler who lived in town. The shrewd businessman then sued her - stated she misrepresented the home's condition. Five years later the widow won the court case, but she had to pay 5 years of legal bills first. She died of heart failure 3 years later.

Paraphrasing War Games - Sometimes the best choice is - not to play.

Do you guys not buy insurance? In my state, title insurance is a legal requirement for all realtor sales. Occasionally there will be a handshake sale, but I lived next door to an easement dispute when the easement was not recorded on the deed. The title insurance company paid everybody. They paid all legal expenses. They paid compensation to the land owner, for both the use of the property and relocation of a fence line that ran down the middle of the easement. Easement disputes and clouded titles are what title insurance is for.

An umbrella policy is there for one reason - to protect you from lawsuits. My umbrella policy will defend any lawsuit and/or pay any judgment or claim. The only thing I'm scared of is starting a forest fire that burns thousands of acres and homes, which would far exceed the policy limit and wipe me out. Homeowner's insurance protects me at home, the umbrella policy protects me everywhere.

If you are paranoid about lawsuits, talk to your insurance agent. Don't let it cripple your life.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

My employer manages 800,000 acres in this state. I'm in charge of about 50k of those. Most of that is open to use by the public in varying degrees.
I see the good and the bad, probably more than most here. Some do have the attitude they are going to do as they please. In that case a phone call to the local game warden, or to the Forest Service if it's a matter of dumping, is all that I need to do.

I talk to a lot of people over the course of a year. They want to pick up firewood after a harvest job ends, and appreciate not needing to buy it. Our only restrictions are that the job has to be done with all of the salable wood hauled; and we don't allow chainsaws.
I often hear how much people appreciate being able to use the land. Some people have been coming up to go deer hunting for over 40 years. Back then the hunting was great; now, not so much. Yet they still come up for a week. A father might take a ride out after work for a couple of hours with his two sons, trying to "pick up a bird" (Ruffed grouse). I think it's good for them to be able to do that.

There are a lot more of the latter category than the first, and I enjoy seeing people out doing things. If we didn't allow access, the only people I would see fall in the first category and I would likely share the attitude a lot of the posters here.

Our Forestry and Wildlife departments understand that most hunting activity in particular is done on private lands, and are working hard to ensure that access continues. Every year they sponsor a "fall cleanup day", where volunteers clean up what others have dumped over the past year. They also are very good about dealing with dumping and other problems, and if possible will find the owner, make him clean it up and issue a summons.

There's a push to turn the 3.2 million acres which have created jobs for centuries and turn in into a "National Park" putting me and thousands of others out of work. It also would virtually eliminate hunting in most of the state. Many don't understand (or care) that they would be destroying the very thing which makes the region unique; the interaction between public use on privately owned land.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

I think it's just Vermont and Maine that have open lands unless posted.

Then there is the exception of sates with coastlines, not just oceans, but the great lakes, too. In those states, you have to let people pass along the coast. I think it's delineated by the high water mark or something similar.

Vast areas of the American West are still open range. If you don't want your neighbor's cattle grazing your land, put up a fence. Human foot traffic is so trivial it would be treated like a joke if someone objected. How would they round up their cattle?

 

[Jstpssng]

View attachment 721637

We see similar signs here. I've been putting up various signs including "No Dumping" and "No Motor Vehicles"... all supplied by the Forest Service or Fish and Wildlife.

It isn't perfect but as I said before, if we didn't allow access the only people I deal with would be those who don't care.

 

[Fuddy1952]

Looks like both the trespasser AND the land owner were charged.

Both would have their charges dropped after 6 months of being a "good boy".

Booby traps may seem "funny" on the internet. But there are laws against it.

Booby Trap Blasts Paint All Over Trespassing Hunter

The guy should have asked permission to walk through, then no problem. No one should tresspass like like.

 

[plowhog]

In my state, title insurance is a legal requirement for all realtor sales. ...

My umbrella policy will defend any lawsuit and/or pay any judgment or claim.

Not sure about Oregon, but my experience in other states is that it is the lender who requires title insurance, not a real estate broker.

I've worked with some shrewd investors who buy small land parcels and *always* bypass purchasing title insurance since it is an expensive fee. They can do this by paying cash. They accept a heightened risk, but I have not seen any of them get burned. I/they have the skills to read the available title documents and easement paperwork as well as the title officer can. Even if you get insurance, many title policies have exclusions for "undiscovered" things-- typically they only like to insure what they know about.

To the contrary, I did witness a commercial investor who learned his building had been earlier expanded without a permit. Although he had title insurance, his claim was denied because he had not purchased the "upgraded" policy, only the standard one.

I will differ about an umbrella policy removing any or even most concern should you be sued. Even if fully covered for the financial expense, being involved in a lawsuit is an emotional roller coaster and can be very, very stressful. I've been through it. I could deal with the heightened risk and stress, but others in the family had a very difficult time with it. That stress caused repercussions which last to this day (and we were the "winners", if you can call it that.) Our real estate lawsuit was not covered by my umbrella policy. Even if it was, the emotional side of it was a total bear.