Fallon, I just read your link. I was wrong, about one thing. You can DOT placard the trailer, instead of the truck if the truck GVWR is 10k, or less. I’ve never seen or heard of it being done this way, but there you go. I would still buy magnets and put them on the truck-easier to find a space big enough and that’s where most people look for them.
Newer 3/4 ton advice?
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4570Man
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My 3500 rides pretty good. A lot better than my dads solid axel leaf spring Ford. My Topkick is in a league of its own for terrible ride.
Yeah, but I bet that Topkick is a **** of a load mover.
4570Man
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It doesn’t set land speed records with the 366 gas burner but its a workhorse. My one ton doesn’t sit around collecting dust but it’s a far cry from what the Topkick is.
I might take you up on that at some point. I'm pretty good at researching, but you don't know what you don't to start doing the research on know a lot of the time. Knew about the 26k bit & assumed I was good, but missed the 10k part.
Definitely going to reevaluate the 1 ton option as it looks like staying under 10k GVWR doesn't buy me much worthwhile. The trailer is actually tagged at GVWRPNBV 14,900 on the VIN plate but 7k GAWR each axle. I know the extra 900lbs is expected hitch weight not on the axle, although that's a bit light. Does that mean I'm at 11,100 max GVWR for the truck or 12,000 to stay under the CDL limits. Most 4x4 double cab configurations seem to be just a couple hundred lbs over my CDL threshold for a diesel but possible for some gas rigs. Will definitely need to look at things a lot closer.
Wise. Some guys can skate by for a long time, but travel through high-enforcement areas can get really spendy just in fines..... w/o even considering insurance implications.
You may have checked out this end already (didn't read entire thread), but one option here (CDL wise) is a Modified Class A license. What it accommodates is the +10k# towing, targeted for a contractor towing a float with a 1 ton or 450 etc. No air-brake, and easier physical testing (just drive the p/u and trailer you already have). Don't know if CO has that license structure or not, but IMO it's one of the smarter bureaucratic moves I've seen here...... plenty of folks may want to use a p/u with a float trailer, but have no interest or need (or time/$) for a full highway tractor/trailer license.
Rgds, D.
No, 10k trucks really don稚 do much, when staying legal. Part of the reason work trucks are most common in regular cab and spartan luxury items. Got to save the weight.
26,000-14,900= 11,100 lbs for the GVWR of the truck, to stay under CDL. A 12k truck would require the CDL.
Some trailer companies allow for tongue weight (not usually for all of it) in their GVWR. Most companies seem to just use the trailer axle capacities. When I saw you had a Diamond C, I should have put that together as mine is the same way. GVWR on 7k axles.
Since the trailer GVWR is for the trailer standing alone, I like having the trailer GVWR allow for tongue weight. There痴 no way your truck isn稚 going to carry some of the load, so you can carry more and stay legal. You can find yourself in trouble with axle weights, on really long trailers, while still being below your GVWR, but you just have to use your common sense.
I致e never heard of a modified, in the US. Once you trip the CDL requirement, it痴 the full whammy. Of course, there are still the combination of restrictions and endorsements.
For me, it was more important to have the right trailer-to do jobs- than to stay under CDL. I was in your shoes, two years ago, and went through all the same headaches. I got an idea of trailer and looked at what I needed, in the truck. I ended up with a winning combination. Though, if I were to do it again, I would have got a heavier trailer.
Copperhead
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CDL is not required unless one is doing work commercially, not for personal use. I have had a CDL A with all endorsements since it was brought into being in 1992. It is a Commercial Driver's License. It can function also as a normal driver license as it is backward compatible. I also have my Motorcycle endorsement on it. But a CDL is not required except for doing commercial work. One can own a 19K semi truck tractor and use it to pull around a 20K 5th wheel RV and they don't need a commercial license. Some states might require some sort of higher class of personal license, but the CDL is controlled Federally.
And if CDL applies, so does mandatory Medical Certification and random drug testing program also apply.
Same for DOT numbers. Only if one is doing commercial work. Even the same semi truck pulling a 5th wheel RV for personal use doesn't require a DOT number.
If one is using any truck and trailer combination for their own personal pursuits, there is no requirement for CDL or DOT numbers. That is, except for those few states that are into finding every way they can to generate revenue.
Now, state weight requirements for axle loading and road limits will apply. One can be stopped by Enforcement and have weight and equipment checked. That has nothing to do with commercial use.
And if CDL applies, so does mandatory Medical Certification and random drug testing program also apply.
Same for DOT numbers. Only if one is doing commercial work. Even the same semi truck pulling a 5th wheel RV for personal use doesn't require a DOT number.
If one is using any truck and trailer combination for their own personal pursuits, there is no requirement for CDL or DOT numbers. That is, except for those few states that are into finding every way they can to generate revenue.
Now, state weight requirements for axle loading and road limits will apply. One can be stopped by Enforcement and have weight and equipment checked. That has nothing to do with commercial use.
I’m just curious why you felt the need to type all of this, here. The OP clearly states he’s doing it for commercial use.
If it’s just for general knowledge, great post, but largely irrelevant to the OP.
two_bit_score
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A lot of people looking at this thread might get the mistaken impression that they would be required to have a CDL and commercial registration just to take a large tractor to the shop. It was informative information and clarification. Lot of good information has been posted in this thread.
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Copperhead
Veteran Member
Exactly my purpose. To let others know that weight is not the factor in whether one needs a CDL, but what one is doing that determines the need for a CDL.
Was in the market for a new drw diesel in 2012. Was looking at Ford and Ram. Ended up with my Ram for the same reason, ride quality. Last year I took a trip with a buddy from Missouri to Wisconson to pick up a tractor in his F350. That trip on the way there empty reinforced that I made the right decision.
Copperhead
Veteran Member
I am really surprised that all the pickup truck OEM's do not have air ride suspension as an option. It would cure so many ills.
I've noticed some owners inflate their truck tires well above the recommended rating, going by the maximum PSI on the tire rather than what the truck is spec'd for. Even my F150 with LT tires is harsh when I run at the top end PSI without a load. I try to keep the tires inflated per the door sticker unless I'm towing or hauling heavy and it makes a big difference.
Copperhead
Veteran Member
I always get the load pressure chart from the tire maker and inflate according to actual axle weights. When empty, i keep about 50 PSI all the way around on my BFG KO2 E rated tires. I will air up some if I am going to be loading down the pickup. GM says the pressures should be 60 front and 70 rear. Well, that is fine, if the pickup is loaded down to full GVWR. Most folks rarely load to full GVWR.
I dropped the cat in heat rake down a little in the back with a set of McGaughy's 2" drop shackles. I then installed a set of 1500lb urethane foam SumoSprings that replace the stock axle bump stops and the Sumo's rest right on the axle when pickup is empty. They are equivalent to air bags without the hassle and go to work the minute I start loading up the pickup. And I replaced the stock Rancho shocks with a set of Bilstein 4600's. One nice riding 3/4 ton now and it just starts getting to level with over a ton of material in the back.
I dropped the cat in heat rake down a little in the back with a set of McGaughy's 2" drop shackles. I then installed a set of 1500lb urethane foam SumoSprings that replace the stock axle bump stops and the Sumo's rest right on the axle when pickup is empty. They are equivalent to air bags without the hassle and go to work the minute I start loading up the pickup. And I replaced the stock Rancho shocks with a set of Bilstein 4600's. One nice riding 3/4 ton now and it just starts getting to level with over a ton of material in the back.
^One big truck basic feature that would be really useful on small stuff..... another one I'd like to see is front hood and fenders, hinged at the bumper. Since most people don't always haul the same payload all the time, I've seen Firestone or equivalent air-bags make a huge difference on light trucks.... best of both worlds. I think Ram has/had a factory airbag option (?).
Rgds, D.
From an engineering standpoint, I like CuHead's elegantly simple approach to running the #'s to determine the psi. That said, it's way beyond what the avg consumer would ever consider.
I've found that even amongst people with some mechanical knowledge, there is plenty of confusion surrounding Door Sticker vs. Tire Max PSI #'s....... leads to guys driving around with mostly empty 3/4+ton trucks on E range tires at 80psi..... then blaming the tire when centre of the rear tires balds-out early......
Rgds, D.
Yep, that's exactly my point. Blame the poor tire life on the tires, and blame the rough ride on the truck. Owner is to blame for both issues but you can't tell them that... "says right here on the tire 80 psi".
gladehound
Veteran Member
My cousin's employee was pulling an empty 14,000 dump trailer with an F550 in PA. The combo was well under 26,000 actual weight (12,000 for the F550, 4500 for the empty dump trailer). The GCWR was 33,000. The employee was pulled over and told that he needs a CDL. The state trooper took his info and said if he catches him again without a CDL he'd lose his license and the company would be fined. The fine would be several thousand dollars, I forget the exact amount.
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