Your Experiences With Ventless LP Burners?

[Diggin It]

Currently have a conventional LP forced air furnace with ductwork. Also a cast iron wood stove. Both have a list of pros and cons. Biggest issue with the furnace is the electric use and noise of the blower. Wood stove is silent, but takes a lot of work to supply. Thinking of future years when physical abilities may begin to wane, I need to consider alternatives.

I've looked at LP burners before, but never really got serious. I have an old one that was left with the house. Moved it to a back room breezeway between the house and garage to keep the chill off, but I don't try to heat the house with it due to the location.

I'm seeing some better prices now on LP ventless fireplaces. I have a spot in the LR where I could install one in a corner. It would be more centrally located than the one in the back room and the woodstove. But I'm trying to figure out how well it might heat the house as a more or less primary source. This is a fairly small story and half house, about 900 square feet on the ground floor, about half of that upstairs which I don't really use in Winter. We generally don't get long cold spells, but we have on occasion been below freezing for several days at a time.

I don't like the house too warm. T-stat is set at 60 and the wood stove usually keeps the place above that when in use.

I'd like to cut the electric use of the furnace blower, but I'm not sure how well these LP heaters heat rooms other than the one they're installed in. And I don't want it sucking too much LP which also costs money.

So, does anybody use these as a more or less primary heat source? How well do they work? And how much gas do they use realistically?

 

[oldnslo]

Had one in a 12 x 24 building for a few years and it kept that size building warm 40 - 45 degrees. One big issue was the moisture these create. Another concern was the exhaust fumes. These are like using your cook oven to heat the house on full time basis.

 

[Egon]

The ventless lpg heaters probably don’t meet code in most places.

There are much better high efficiency furnace choices that would meet your needs.

If it burns with no exhaust they remain in the house. Means headaches and moisture and low oxygen levels and other contaminates in the house.

 

[LS Tractor Owner]

The ventless lpg heaters probably don’t meet code in most places.

There are much better high efficiency furnace choices that would meet your needs.

If it burns with no exhaust they remain in the house. Means headaches and moisture and low oxygen levels and other contaminates in the house.

Agree.... They are not bad for short term temporary heat, but I wouldn't want to be exposed to the fumes in an enclosed space for longer than few hours. Definitely wouldn't want to go to bed at night with it turned on.

 

[jaxs]

Catalytic propane heaters are quite popular around here for indoor heating and I've never heard of any problem. Our guest house has used one for 20 years.

 

[dodge man]

I dated a girl once that they used those in her house. Low odor but they didn't seem to heat the entire house well, but they also had a regular furnace. We just rented a house a couple of months ago in Maine, and it had a LP furnace that was about double of the size of a window AC unit. I think it was also vented. It looked like it was easy to install. It had a fan to force the air out some. It was a small house but did a pretty good job of heating the entire house, which included a set of bedrooms on the second floor.

 

[Oldoak]

I agree with Egon Had vent less propane heaters years ago. I would never do it again.

 

[the old grind]

Had one in a 12 x 24 building for a few years and it kept that size building warm 40 - 45 degrees. One big issue was the moisture these create. Another concern was the exhaust fumes. These are like using your cook oven to heat the house on full time basis.

If the building was uninsulated, the situation sounds about right. Expect water vapor more than any other significant byproduct when using proper ventless LP or NG heaters. As for heating with the cook oven/stove, I've had a (NG) stove burner turned on ~continuously since mid-October. (turned off briefly to clean stovetop semi-weekly) Fifth strait year I've done this. It works for me at the 44th parallel and boosts the temp in the 1/4 of the house I spend most time in. (2400 SF and fully open floorplan) So it's like a room heater, and small enough to minimize moisture output.

I tried lowering my t-stat to 68, but it was too warm when wearing more than a t-shirt. 64 suits me better. Last Winter my highest (total) util bill was $188.xx & I haven't hit $100 yet this year, but the pond is far from frozen over too. I don't worry about much moisture with this small addition. (to dated ~60% efficient furnace) Downstairs in the 'machining/reloading' room) the readout on the dehumidifier stays around 35-40% lately and hasn't been emptied in months.

I'm not advising anyone to 'do what I do' just giving some perspective on non-vented heaters. A 30k BTU heater running steady will provide as much heat as a 180k BTU furnace running 1/6 of the time. And just as with wood or other 'localized' heaters it helps a lot to use a small fan to circulate and de-stratify the air. I have ~ a 10^ diff between temps upstairs to down with no way to isolate those 'zones'. A 7-10" fan per floor at most and set to blow up at 45^ or so has always been way enough to prevent having cold toes and dry eye sockets simultaneously. btw, one runs a lot cheaper than a furnace blower motor.

 

[4570Man]

Trying to heat an uninsulated building full time with a 60 percent heater isn’t very smart. It’s not a significant amount of money to insulate and buy a more efficient heater. If it was a workshop you’re heating a couple hours a week is a little different.

 

[kenmac]

Elect. or lp. you gonna pay one or the other
If possible, install a couple mini splits. Cheaper operating cost than lp

 

[shooterdon]

I have a 33k BTU unit in the basement for emergency heat so the pipes do not freeze if I am away and we lose power. Works ok but I do not use it much.

I use wood and FAG LP for heat. One of the reasons I got a tractor was to allow me to keep using wood as I get older. My plan is to put split wood directly off the splitter onto cut down pallets that the tractor can handle. Pallets go to storage and when needed, the tractor moves them into the garage. That will reduce double handling.

 

[JerryK]

I also have a 30K ventless in my living room for backup heat. I run it every few years to familiarize myself with it, just like my generator. In the dead of winter, the moisture is actually a plus because of the dryness of the outside air. But I would only run it for a day or two until my LP furnace could be repaired. I've stayed in cabins that were heated with them. They have their plus's and minus's just like most non-modern heat sources. Some of us are old enough to know about drip fuel oil heaters, etc. Even heating with wood or coal can be nasty 24/7... They all need some source of makeup air, and all put their own krap into the indoor air....

 

[gary49]

Vent combustion products into your living space=you won't like it. They are meant for intermittent use, maybe a few hours at a time, not for sole heating source, I wouldn't have one. If the climate where you are is temperate, with short periods below freezing, mini split(s) would be the least expensive to run, you'll be amazed how quiet and effective they are. You could even get one with upstairs and downstairs indoor units running off one compressor.

 

[Sigarms]

I've got a ventless gas fireplace for back up heat on our main floor (serviced by a heat pump).

No problems. Personally, if it weren't for the price of propane in my area, wouldn't have ANY problem running it 24/7 (at the time, this fireplace was a lot cheaper than a 95% variable speed gas furnace to dual fuel with my heat pump, but I was an idiot at the time as I installed it back in 2005, and knowing what I know now, I'd spend the money on the gas furnace).

ANYTIME you're burning gas, you should have CO2 detector

When and Where to Install Carbon Monoxide Detectors

Ironcially enough, I am in the HVAC industry, and a person who I knew was a licensed contractor died due to C02 poisoning (no detectors where he was staying at the time). That was close to 20 years ago, and every room and floor in my house has a detector.

 

[Diggin It]

The usual and expected mixed bag of replies. But I don't see discussion of how much fuel they use. BTUs don't mean much to me. I'm more interested in gallons per day/week or whatever, which of course will vary by ambient air temperature. If it's likely to burn through a 500 gallon tank per winter, I may be less interested.

 

[Sigarms]

The usual and expected mixed bag of replies. But I don't see discussion of how much fuel they use. BTUs don't mean much to me. I'm more interested in gallons per day/week or whatever, which of course will vary by ambient air temperature. If it's likely to burn through a 500 gallon tank per winter, I may be less interested.

What kind of motor is on your gas furnace? You talked about electric usage on your gas furnace, what is the electric usage per the motor and what it the decible reading 2' from the blower motor?

 

[JerryK]

The usual and expected mixed bag of replies. But I don't see discussion of how much fuel they use. BTUs don't mean much to me. I'm more interested in gallons per day/week or whatever, which of course will vary by ambient air temperature. If it's likely to burn through a 500 gallon tank per winter, I may be less interested.

Ventless heaters, like electric heaters, are the about most efficient form of heat. There is no chimney to loose heat, and every BTU is applied into the heated space. Not saying they are safe for long term use inside a residence, but they are extremely efficient.

 

[kenmac]

Ventless heaters, like electric heaters, are the about most efficient form of heat. There is no chimney to loose heat, and every BTU is applied into the heated space. Not saying they are safe for long term use inside a residence, but they are extremely efficient.

Yes, they are. They are 100% efficient because there is no loss.
when I lived in town. everything I had was gas. Since I moved to the farm place, the only gas I have is ventless Fire place, dryer, and something I never thought I would install. A tankless wh

It doesn't matter if you are doing ventless space heaters for your own use.
I'm just going to put this info out for info only.....International gas code states they aren't to be used as a primary source of heat

 

[Diggin It]

It doesn't matter if you are doing ventless space heaters for your own use.
I'm just going to put this info out for info only.....International gas code states they aren't to be used as a primary source of heat

And yet, I know of county government offices that did just that ... employee offices and public spaces ... for many years. They would still be doing it had they not built a new building. I also know of some businesses that do it in both employee and public spaces.

I'm not even sure I would be doing it as primary as I'd still have the forced air furnace.

 

[4570Man]

And yet, I know of county government offices that did just that ... employee offices and public spaces ... for many years. They would still be doing it had they not built a new building. I also know of some businesses that do it in both employee and public spaces.

I'm not even sure I would be doing it as primary as I'd still have the forced air furnace.

It’s probably a safer idea in spaces not used for sleeping. You can buy an upwards of 95 percent efficiency gas furnace for about $1000. That’s a small price to pay to not die. And you gain 15 percent or more over cheaper gas furnaces.