b2910 flasher/hazard fuse shorting out

[gimmodog]

I am assuming that these reading were taken with the bulbs out. My take on your readings using the 1st wiring drawing posted by countryguy
B to frame = .9 = resistance of the wire and frame gnd connection = direct gnd = no problem
left side of fuse = 80 = resistance of charge lt, regulator etc that is connected to that wire = probably no problem

right side of fuse = 1 = PROBLEM = only .1 ohm more than the direct gnd of the b wire so this is also a direct ground. This should be a very high value in the thousands or even meg ohms

since the Rw & Gw readings are higher then the extra resistance is the connections of the instrument cluster so then the ground must be before the instrument cluster

the only thing before the cluster is the wire itself and the hazard switch so must be one of those

unplug the switch and retest the right side of the fuse terminal

if you now have a high reading problem would be the switch

if the reading is still the same them problem would be that wire is grounded

 

[countryguy1225]

Thanks for the eyes-on gimmodog!. So the 10 ohms is part of the normal readings I am thinking. The fuse side reading 1 Ohm is the issue to dive in and follow.


Dave, you're 80% there! Dont let it go yet as what ever is going on could end up worse. better to figure it out now IMO. The 1 ohm side.. That where you go. Gimmodog is spot on. There should/may be a larger connector under the dash/indicators that connects the dash to the harness (ant the switch your being asked to unplug). The harness may be something you can grab w/o removing 'everything' to get to the switch? dunno. Which ever is easier!
Since I spent 4 day's getting my system diagnosed to a silly switch as well... I think your ahead of the game. Right? haha. I to know this sucks and you have million other things going on like me and everyone. boy do I know.

Ohh Was the wire Red on that fuse? or Red/Yellow? Meant to ask as there are two 20A fuses. I'm 95% certain it's the R(ed) wire. but... trust but verify.

I am assuming that these reading were taken with the bulbs out. My take on your readings using the 1st wiring drawing posted by countryguy
B to frame = .9 = resistance of the wire and frame gnd connection = direct gnd = no problem
left side of fuse = 80 = resistance of charge lt, regulator etc that is connected to that wire = probably no problem

right side of fuse = 1 = PROBLEM = only .1 ohm more than the direct gnd of the b wire so this is also a direct ground. This should be a very high value in the thousands or even meg ohms

since the Rw & Gw readings are higher then the extra resistance is the connections of the instrument cluster so then the ground must be before the instrument cluster

the only thing before the cluster is the wire itself and the hazard switch so must be one of those

unplug the switch and retest the right side of the fuse terminal

if you now have a high reading problem would be the switch

if the reading is still the same them problem would be that wire is grounded

 

[gimmodog]

Thanks for the eyes-on gimmodog!. So the 10 ohms is part of the normal readings I am thinking. The fuse side reading 1 Ohm is the issue to dive in and follow.


Dave, you're 80% there! Dont let it go yet as what ever is going on could end up worse. better to figure it out now IMO. The 1 ohm side.. That where you go. Gimmodog is spot on. There should/may be a larger connector under the dash/indicators that connects the dash to the harness (ant the switch your being asked to unplug). The harness may be something you can grab w/o removing 'everything' to get to the switch? dunno. Which ever is easier!
Since I spent 4 day's getting my system diagnosed to a silly switch as well... I think your ahead of the game. Right? haha. I to know this sucks and you have million other things going on like me and everyone. boy do I know.

Ohh Was the wire Red on that fuse? or Red/Yellow? Meant to ask as there are two 20A fuses. I'm 95% certain it's the R(ed) wire. but... trust but verify.

I tried to phrase that so he could understand how I came up with my decision of possible causes and to give him an idea how troubleshooting by reading resistance is done. I hope you agree with what I came up with

 

[dlabrie]

Countryguy and Gimmodog,

Yes the bulbs are out. I actually removed the units off of the tractor.

The Rw and Gw wires are on that 20amp fuse. The other 20amp is for a work light.

Just to be clear, when I tested the right side of the fuse socket , the meter did not change at all. It showed a 1 before starting test and there was no change when I probed it. Doesn't that mean there is no short in that side?

If that is what you understood me to mean, I need to get to the switch. Hopefully someone can tell me how to get the dash apart to get to it, before I break something

 

[countryguy1225]

OK, Thanks for helping me understand something Dave... I wonder if the 1 you refer to on Ohms is really an "I" for infinity which means open/ no-short? So if you have it on 200 ohms and see the "1" it's an "I" and means infinite. Then you touch the leads to together and get the short and zeros and some really small number like 00.1 or something.. Just making sure we're working right here.

I need to go back and re-read the notes on what happens in Ohms mode on your readings.. (elevator music here)

Sooooo..... I'll probably need to wait for you to post back, but the 10ohms side -vs- the "1" (which we now think is actually an "I" for infinite/open)

I am thinking now that your issue is on the 10ohms side. Not the "I"(infinite) which I thought was 1 ohm before
Maybe we can see what gimmodog thinks too here. If it's not too much issue, maybe just 2 pics. 1 on one side of the fuse holder, and then 1 pic while you test the other side again if you wish too.

Sorry.. we may have taken a slight detour.. but we'll see. Ohh, is the wire on that fuse a RED wire or RED/Yellow please?

Tx
jeff.

 

[gimmodog]

Countryguy and Gimmodog,

Yes the bulbs are out. I actually removed the units off of the tractor.

The Rw and Gw wires are on that 20amp fuse. The other 20amp is for a work light.

Just to be clear, when I tested the right side of the fuse socket , the meter did not change at all. It showed a 1 before starting test and there was no change when I probed it. Doesn't that mean there is no short in that side?

If that is what you understood me to mean, I need to get to the switch. Hopefully someone can tell me how to get the dash apart to get to it, before I break something

then I did misunderstand your reading of the right side of the fuse holder. I would think the the meter would read 0.00 when turned to 200 ohm and leads not touching anything. I have not used many different types of meters so it could be an I for infinite just never saw a meter read like that. Please confirm to us what the meter reads with leads not touching anything.

If you can please take these readings with the meter in 200 ohm position

rt side of fuse holder with hazard switch off

rt side of fuse holder with hazard sw on

Rw to gnd with hazard sw off

Rw to gnd with hazard sw on

Gw to gnd with hazard sw off

Gw to gnd with hazard sw on

Can you get to the connector circled in this photo and disconnect it?

 

[dlabrie]

If you can please take these readings with the meter in 200 ohm position

Pict of Meter set on 200 with no connection



rt side of fuse holder with hazard switch off = I


rt side of fuse holder with hazard sw on = 138.3


Rw to gnd with hazard sw off = 11.8

Rw to gnd with hazard sw on = 11.8

Gw to gnd with hazard sw off = 11.1

Gw to gnd with hazard sw on = 11.1

Can you get to the connector circled in this photo and disconnect it? I am not sure where or what it is. If it is under the dash,
I haven't figured out how to get the cowl and instrument cluster apart. I looked through the service manual but couldn't find any info.

The wire going to the R side of fuse looks to be Rg

 

[gimmodog]

this is puzzling. The Rw and Gw wires are the power feed wires to the lights and with bulbs out or lights removed as you stated should have no resistance to ground. When the switch is turned on the right side of the fuse holder is connected to the Rw and Gw wires therefore should have the same resistance plus the added resistance of the switch, wires and connections. I just wouldn't think it would be as much as it tested. Only thing I can come up with is maybe the flasher unit itself. I would think the turn signals would use the same flasher unit but is not blowing the fuse but then with only one light flashing the current os cut in half. Should have had you remove the flasher unit for test anyway but didn't think of it. Just to rule it out try a new flasher unit they shouldn't cost much. I'm thinking there could also be some debri of some kind around some of the connectors that is causing the Rw & Gw to have some resistance. Try to blow off as much debri as you can get to. That is why I was wanting to disconnect that connector. It looks like you may have to get behind the dash after all. Maybe start a new thread asking how to take the dash off and another owner of the same tractor will instruct how it comes off.

 

[countryguy1225]

Been traveling all day, happy to see the data you posted! It does confirm the short on both Rw and Gw lines. And that is two different wires, but they both go to the Flasher unit and to the console. so we know the problem. We know the wires involved, we know where it starts and ends.

so I agree, let's get that Flasher unit removed. Just removing it and then checking the ohms again might just show that go suddenly from short to open, and then we will know for sure your Flasher is bad. And on the other side, unplugging the dash connector shown on the print. My gut tells me once you unplug one of these, it's going to snap to the "I" infinte reading.

I'll be honest, I've been swamped at work and I do not remember if the short side of the fuse goes to the panel or to the flasher unit? Before you rip the dash all out, just unplug the flasher and toss the ohm meter on that bad side and see?

...My only thought after some thinking; is that since both light socket lines are shorted, and both are wired to the flasher unit. That same flasher unit lights them both simultaneously and I bet the circuit to drive them internally, goes to both wires internally. That might explain why both wires are reading the short? but its always speculation on wiring issues . :-0 just speculation from a hotel there!

Hope ya'll have a great week. I'll be stuck offline till later in eve's if I can get on at all.
Peace ,
GC,

 

[LouNY]

I'm not familiar with your tractor at all but I have one question.
How many lights do you have on your tractor?
Just on the rear or front and rear, usually you will have red turn and flashers on the rear and amber to the front.
Some units will have an amber lens in the front and a red lens to the rear, but many have separate forward and rearward facing light.
They are normally wired in parallel one front and one rear.
Many of your readings seemed to me like you are reading through a bulb.