Help me buy a compact tractor - information overload...

[ViperDriver]

Information overload. Need a tractor - likely buying new. Below are our use cases, preferences, and limitations along with some data about our property - I am like this looking at all the options: :shocked::shocked::shocked: and figured you could help narrow it down.

Background -
We have 15 acres - mostly wooded and will remain that way. Currently building long term / retirement home with large workshop. Longer term use will be field / septic area maintenance and some light grading - but early use may be "heavier duty" as we take on more tasks ourselves - i.e. drainage, etc.

Use cases:

• Mowing septic field / pasture - approx 1.5 to 2 acres - not looking for "finely groomed" - right now - it's $1100 to pay someone to do this
• Mowing side of road / taking back some brushy areas
• Moving dirt / grading
• leveling and filling backyard area, prepping for artificial turf (north side / no sun / dogs will kill grass)
• backfilling foundation area / over plumbing and buried electrical
• perhaps some grooming of long road before paving (1300'), but will hire out the heavy stuff
• digging / trenching for drainage for hardscapes - this is where we can save the most $$$
• will NOT do fine / general mowing up at the house - the area inside the retaining wall is small / contained / lots of obstacles - so that's push mower and SMALL.

Preferences:

• Want to buy new - we take really good care of things, and due to financing, want to spread out payments (building house - keeping my cash is king); also, need an installment loan to bump credit score since all we have is a mortgage
• Don't want something that is underpowered or finicky / hard to work on
• Want easy of use / quick disconnects
• While money is not "no object" - if the right answer is $3K more then it's the right answer. Budget is about $25K-$28K
• Expect to get attachments at initial purchase - bush hog, FEL, backhoe and MAYBE a box spreader

Limitations

• In order to get to back yard, the side areas are tight at 72" - so we'd like to stay under 60" width for the tractor - including bucket - 60" absolute TOP
• In NC so not interested in snow moving equipment
• Personal vehicle buying mantra "you can never have too much torque"
• Don't need a cab
• Looking for hydrostatic trans - can do the gears - but not preferred

Currently looking at Kubota and something like a B3350 - but then.... saw Kioti, John Deere, and others - and that led to the information overload.

Anything we should take into consideration? Missing any brands? the width limitation is really driving the decision here - but that also has the benefit (?) of not letting us go too crazy - because we, uh, kinda tend to do that.

Warnings? Ideas? Think the B3350 is the best thing since sliced bread?

Thanks in advance to experts who have WAY more experience in this than we do.

 

[jeff9366]

The most efficient way to shop for tractors is to list your tasks first, then determine bare tractor weight needed to safely accomplish your tasks. The fundamental importance of TRACTOR WEIGHT eludes many tractor shoppers. Heavier tractor chassis weight is more important for most tractor operations than increased tractor horsepower. Bare tractor weight is a tractor specification easily found in sales brochures and web sites, readily comparable across tractor brands and tractor models, new and used.

Within subcompact and compact tractor categories, bare tractor weight must increase 50% before you notice a significant tractor capability increase. It takes a 100% increase in bare tractor weight to elicit MY-OH-MY!

Shop your weight range within tractor brands. Budget will eliminate some choices. Collect a dealer brochure for each tractor model in your weight range. I spreadsheet tractor and implement specs, often a revealing exercise. I have a column for cost per pound.

Most tractors under 3,000 pounds bare weight operate in residential or hobby farm applications on one to ten flat acres. Subcompact and compact tractors under 3,000 pounds will enter a residential garage with typical 84" door height.

Selling a used tractor is easy. Selling multiple light implements in order to buy heavier, wider implements for a heavier tractor requires a lot of time. Depreciation on implements is generally greater than depreciation on a tractor.

Tractors over 3,000 pounds bare weight are generally offered in a utilitarian configuration and a deluxe configuration. Deluxe kit enhances productivity and operating comfort ~~~ but you must pay. Most tractors over 3,000 pounds bare weight are too tall to fit through an 84" height garage door, even with ROPS folded.

Heavier tractors are built on larger frames with larger wheels/tires. Heavier tractors with large diameter tires have more tractive power pulling ground contact implements, pushing a loader bucket into dirt and pushing snow. Larger wheels and tires increase ground clearance, enabling a heavier tractor to bridge holes, ruts and downed tree limbs with less bucking and disturbance when passing over rough pasture and woodland.

Safe hillside operation demands more tractor weight than level land operation. Heavier tractors have adjustable rear wheel spreads; wide rear wheel spreads hugely improve tractor stability. Four wheel drive is essential on hillsides. Four wheel drive supplies increased traction. When descending slopes 4-WD augments rear brakes as tractor weight shifts forward, decreasing rear tire grip.

Tractors optimized for hill work have liquid installed in the rear tires rather than air. "Loaded" tires are filled 50% to 75% with liquid, which lowers the tractor's center-of-gravity, increasing rollover resistance. "Loading" two compact tractor rear tires will increase tractor weight 300 pounds to 800 pounds over weight of identical two tires inflated with air.

A quality dealer, reasonably close, available for coaching, is important for tractor neophytes. Almost every new tractor is delivered with a glitch or two requiring correction. My kubota dealer is six miles away. I feel my local dealer continues to add value to my equipment. Dealer proximity is less important to those experienced with tractors and qualified to perform their own maintenance.

BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR.​

 

[jeff9366]

B3350/B3350SU is 1,896 pounds bare tractor, minimum width 54" with R1 tires. DELUXE KIT.
https://www.kubotausa.com/docs/default-source/brochure-sheets/b50rops.pdf?sfvrsn=a30d900_6

L2501 is 2,623 pounds bare tractor, minimum width 55" with R1 tires.
((No Tier IV emission controls on sub-25 horsepower tractors.))
https://www.kubotausa.com/docs/default-source/brochure-sheets/l2501.pdf?sfvrsn=34e9b1d_8

Every tractor brand includes a model in the 2,600 pound to 2,900 pound (bare tractor) range with 100 cubic inch/24 horsepower engine ample for your tasks. Tractors under 25-horsepower are exempt from the stringent, Tier IV emission controls which abruptly increase a tractor's cost about $2,000 above the 25-horsepower demarcation.

VIDEO: Kubota B-Series vs Standard L1 Series - YouTube

Consider both B3350 models against the L2501.

 

[jeff9366]

ViperDriver

Background -
We have 15 acres - mostly wooded and will remain that way. Mowing septic field / pasture - approx 1.5 to 2 acres - not looking for "finely groomed" - right now

How many "open" acres do you have? What is your plan for the "open" acres?

Use cases:

• Mowing septic field / pasture - approx 1.5 to 2 acres - not looking for "finely groomed" - right now - it's $1100 to pay someone to do this.

Preferences:

• Want to buy new - we take really good care of things, and due to financing, want to spread out payments (building house - keeping my cash is king); also, need an installment loan to bump credit score since all we have is a mortgage
• Want easy of use / quick disconnects = B3350
• While money is not "no object" - if the right answer is $3K more then it's the right answer. Budget is about $25K-$28K
• Expect to get attachments at initial purchase - bush hog, FEL, backhoe and MAYBE a box spreader
• Backhoe will be around $7,000 of purchase price. Do you really need one? Backhoe must be removed in order to access the Three Point Hitch.
  VIDEO: tractor middle buster - YouTube
  
  You need to consider Three Point Hitch counterbalance for heavy FEL loads. Some use a Rotary Cutter/Bush Hog but R/Cs protrudes far to the rear and can limit maneuverability. Most common FEL counterbalance implement is a Box Blade. For proper counterbalance you will need a Box Blade with a weight of at least 100 pounds per foot of width, 120 pounds per foot of width better.

Currently looking at Kubota and something like a B3350 - but then.... saw Kioti, John Deere, and others - and that led to the information overload.

Anything we should take into consideration? Missing any brands? the width limitation is really driving the decision here.
Look at LS tractor brand too. Like Kioti, imported from Korea.

Bear in mind tractor widths are with R1/ag tires, the narrowest tires.
R4/industrial tires equip 90% of compact utility tractors. R4s increase tractor rear tire spreads 4" to 6" over "spec".

 

[Bigfoot62]

Jeff,
Wow! What a well written and thoughtful response. Good advice.
Found it very interesting that you mostly talked about tractor weight. Those of us involved in Ag operations talk about such things regularly. Not often that I hear that discussed when talking about sub-compacts.
My newest, the 5090M, weighs about 6 tons with the FEL and rear wheel weights. As I have heard all my life, "all the HP in the world won't do you any good if you can't get it to the ground."

 

[ViperDriver]

Wow - thank you for the responses.

Answer questions first:

I think the R4 Industrial tires are a good compromise for what we need / flat areas vs inclines. I did not know that they add width - IMPORTANT in our case - thank you! That might push us into the smaller base model. The 55" L2501 can't really afford to have the R4 tires if it adds 6". When we looked at them - that felt like the beefier tractor, which we liked. However, - even if the tires don't push that too wide, in configuring one, they only have a 66" bucket - which I think is a deal breaker (and I can't understand why the Grand L's have so many other width buckets.... - maybe dealer would swap out to a 60"?)

The open area is 1.5 - 2 acres. Of that - maybe 3/4 acre is septic field, and the rest kept in a "pasture" condition - but it's not pasture now (but may be in the future) Everything else wooded.

The shop being built has a 13'6" overhead door, so I am not height limited on the ROPS and won't have to fold it down - but my width limitation will likely keep the height in check.

Do we "need" a backhoe - no - but there's a reasonable amount of water management / drainage work that still needs to be done under the driveways and alongside the road. Paying someone to do it will be WELL over $8K.

Looked at the L3560 - NICE MACHINE - but too pricey for us, and with the width, we'd spend $2K every time we took it behind the house replacing the custom downspout that we'd tear off in the process.

Going to research LS and Kioti - Kioti are built in Wilson, NC - only about 45 minutes from us - might be decent to support local.... And will start spreadsheet - thank you for the thoughts - especially on weight. It's not our normal thought process: pile on the weight and settle for less HP..... but it makes sense.

 

[jeff9366]

Answer questions first:

The open area is 1.5 - 2 acres. Of that - maybe 3/4 acre is septic field, and the rest kept in a "pasture" condition - but it's not pasture now (but may be in the future) Everything else wooded.

Going to research LS and Kioti - Kioti are built in Wilson, NC - only about 45 minutes from us - might be decent to support local.

Kubota B2650/B3350 seems close to ideal. I have a Kubota 'Grand L' and I really like DELUXE KIT on B2650/B3350/L3560 after two sparely equipped predecessor tractors.
VIDEO: Kubota B5-Series tractors, B265 & B335. Review and functions | Messick's - YouTube

Give Kioti careful consideration. Parts might arrive overnight when needed.

 

[majorwager]

Viper Driver. jeffy always pushes the weight aspect, it is excessive/ compulsive. The mantra could easily be labeled

"BUY TOO MUCH TRACTOR"

I own both large and smaller tractors and a 2000 lb 25 gross hp tractor will perform a lot of tasks.

Take a look at RK Tractors made by TYM. Even if you do not select them, their pricing is very favorable. A You Tube channel, Outdoors with the Morgan's is very informative. Mike is currently testing three RK tractors beginning with video # 124. Worth a look, he puts these tractors through their paces while explaining the operation at each step..

RK Tractors Pricing and tractor sizes in easy viewing on website. Note: None of the compacts are built on US Soil. Some are assembled in the US.

outdoors with the morgans youtube - Bing

There is also a thread concerning tractor purchasing wherein a number of folks expressed satisfaction w/ very capable smaller tractors. The thread is long but worth the time investment

https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums...uide-shopping-sizing-tractor-development.html

YOU TUBE Video 124 for the YOU TUBE MORGAN'S CHANNEL, my ERROR ###### ##### # ## #

RK Tractor Store
Morganton
Call 828-317-1895
1227 Burkemont Ave.
Morganton, NC 28655
Full Line Tractor Store
RK Tractors Available Now

 

[ViperDriver]

17 pages! and I learned a lot about personalities. ;-)

Looking back at L2501 and the L Series @ Kubota but they show that with a 66" bucket which is WEIRD and nothing smaller..., considering the B26TLB for some of the apparently unique options, checked out RK (seriously budget conscious), working through Kioti.

Found package deal pricing with trailers and everything on tractor house.com (really, cheaper in Texas? ROAD TRIP...) and some good deals in Illinois. List prices are crazy - but there appears to be a large amount of markup, as well as much savings as you load up with attachments / accessories.

Progress is being made. Still look like this, though... :shocked:

 

[Tractorable]

If you’re interested in the Kubota B3350, cross shop the Yanmar YT235. Premium features, a little more weight than the B, 60” wide with R4’s, and has a 60” bucket. Japanese quality, assembled in Georgia.

 

[jeff9366]

Found package deal pricing with trailers and everything on tractor house.com (really, cheaper in Texas? ROAD TRIP...) and some good deals in Illinois.

If your LOCATION was filled in on your T-B-N PROFILE about now someone would write you where the dealer with the sharp pencil is, near your home.

Package Deals: Shady Internet Tractor Package "deals" - YouTube

 

[4570Man]

If your LOCATION was filled in on your T-B-N PROFILE, about now someone would write you where the dealer with the sharp pencil is, near your home.

Package Deals: Shady Internet Tractor Package "deals" - YouTube

I’m glad we have a self appointed location police. Knock it off. No one else cares.

 

[majorwager]

4570 man,

Agree, some folks just prefer a little privacy, The OP named a city from which he lives 45 minutes. Do we need more?


As an aside, many larger kubota dealers do offer factory package deals. Jeffy doesn't understand folks have search engines and an intellect.

Treats folks as if they are unable to tie their own shoes.

 

[ericm979]

The package deals usually have the absolute cheapest trailer and implements. Spending a little more on them can get sturdier ones.

If you get get a SSQA loader which I'd strongly recommend you can put any SSQA bucket on it. That can give you a few more options.

A wider track on the rear wheels makes for a tractor that is more stable on slopes. If you will be working on slopes that will be important and unfortunately working against your width restriction.

R1s wear quickly when used on pavement. They're also rough on lawns.

When I asked here about operating on a leach field I got 50% sure no problem and 50% no way you'll ruin it. There's a lot of youtube videos showing where people ruined their leach field. If yours is getting mowed now it's probably ok to use equipment that weighs that much and has that much footprint (R4s have a larger footprint than R1s, spreading out the force). But if the leach field is ever wet at all I'd reconsider operating on it.

B3350s had a lot of problems with their emissions equipment. I was considering them when I was shopping last year and even the dealers were discouraging me.

Cut a piece of PVC pipe to the width of the tractor you're considering and walk around the restricted areas with it, keeping in mind that when turning the bucket takes a longer arc than the tires. That'll help visualize how well it'll fit. I did that and ended up deciding that a larger tractor would work. There's one spot where it's pretty tight to operate but it's doable and still faster than the old B7100. Everywhere else I've been glad I went larger. The wider tractor can handle slopes better and pretty much all our land is steep.

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

Limitations

• In order to get to back yard, the side areas are tight at 72" - so we'd like to stay under 60" width for the tractor - including bucket - 60" absolute TOP

Not sure why you need a 35HP tractor to maintain 2 acres. Also, it won't fit within the under 60" width you need. Aside from the width of the tractor itself, you want your implements to be a bit wider than the tractor for obvious reasons. A 5' implement is of course 60" wide and will give you just 6" of clearance on each side through your 72" space. If you're comfortable with that, you're looking at a max tractor width of around 54", including the tires.

If you're new to tractors, you may be underestimating the power and capability of a 25HP tractor.

 

[Jam242ti]

I just went through this process last fall and understand totally. This may be sacrilege but most of the brands are good quality, most source major components from the same companies. So a big decider for me was the ergonomics of the operator station particularly the location and operation of the FEL joystick, the operating pedals, the brake, the locking differential etc.... The next criteria was quality and convenience of the dealer, and the last was price. In my HP/weight range the Yanmar happened to have the most effective operator station for my body size, two dealers within 50 miles and one makes house calls, and the price was in the low-medium range for the less than 25hp category. I do have one small recommendation when test driving tractors. Wear the boots or shoes you will most often be wearing when operating the tractor my foot pedals are a little to close together for me and occasionally I find myself pushing both at the same time. I don't have large feet (9) but with my work boots I need to be careful until I learn better habits.

 

[Tompet]

With your budget and outline, I would suggest a Kubota B2650 rather than the B3350. You mentioned a B26 which would work well, but you would be looking at used according to your budget over desire for new. The 2501, though heavier is more of a bare bones setup vs the B2650.

Whatever you get consider adding SS quick attach to FEL.

Whether Kubota or another brand, Kioti, LS etc., new and in your budget you'll be in this size range. Which will be fine. You will enjoy having the backhoe for your tasks. I traded up specifically for a more capable BH with full bucket rotation and swing.

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

With your $25k+ budget you should have many choices in the 24-26HP range, except perhaps for Deere and Kubota, which tend to cost a bit more. Kioti, RK, Branson, Mahindra, Massey Ferguson, Yanmar--are also good brands. Sounds like you want max power in a smaller package; so compare size, weight and lift capacity. Then drive them all and get price quotes on paper--price "out the door"--including the implements you want. Since width is critical for you, I would bring a tape measure. Specs are sometimes deceptive. Also get a feel for the dealer. Tractor *salesmen* are a pretty mixed bag IMO, so also speak to a manager, or better yet the service manager, if you can. I like to take a peek at the service bay; should be clean and orderly. Also I like to ask questions I already know the answer to--from TBN--to test their knowledge.

You might want to rethink the backhoe. A lot of dirt moving tasks can be done with a FEL equipped with a PTB. You can make ditches with a rear tilt blade. Not sure what you mean by "digging/trenching for hardscapes," but it would take a lot of trenching to pay for a $10k backhoe, and once that's done, will it just sit in your garage? Renting a small excavator might make more $$$ sense. Plus, with that machine you can scoop and scoot.

 

[deezler]

Limitations

• In order to get to back yard, the side areas are tight at 72" - so we'd like to stay under 60" width for the tractor - including bucket - 60" absolute TOP
  
  Currently looking at Kubota and something like a B3350 - but then.... saw Kioti, John Deere, and others - and that led to the information overload.
  

• 
  
  You have 15 acres and somehow only have 72" around your house to move around?!?!?
  
  Don't buy a tractor for minimum width! You need weight and width for balance, stability and capability. Just make the narrow areas of your property wider, or go around the narrow spots and get a little used riding mower for backup if you have to.
  
  I started with 19 acres but sold off two parcels to end up at 10 acres now. I'm looking very strongly at the Kioti CK3510H, as it seems to represent an excellent balance of capability with affordability. Not too big, not too small, plenty of power, and should be reliable if this forum is any indication.

 

[Yanmar Tractor]

If youæ±*e interested in the Kubota B3350, cross shop the Yanmar YT235. Premium features, a little more weight than the B, 60 wide with R4ç—´, and has a 60 bucket. Japanese quality, assembled in Georgia.

There are 16 Yanmar Tractor dealership locations with 200 miles of Wilson NC.

Dealer Locator - Yanmar Tractor