Heard interesting (negative) Kioti issue from dealer who dropped them.

[Rock Crawler]

So, yesterday before I thought I would call Bruno's and ask about a price for Kioti CK2610 and the fellow informed me that they no longer carry Kioti. I asked why, and he told me that they had sold a good number of Kioti products, and a small number that had issues that came back were unable to get warranty support from Kioti at the Dealer to OEM level. He said that the dealer ended up eating the warranty work on a handful of units, and they saw that the OEM was not behind the dealership in supporting warranty issues, so they dropped the line.

That is a bit of a scary story. If a large volume dealer like Bruno's can not get support from Kioti, how bad would they treat a small local dealer that does far less volume of sales? The CK2610 has been on the top of my list for a couple months now, but with that new piece of information... I take pause.

I asked the fellow on the phone what of the brands that they carry and in similar size/weight would you recommend as the most reliable and best supported product. Without hesitation he said that he would suggest to family or friend the Massey Ferguson 1726 every time, if that was not available he said that the LS would be his next choice, but that parts were much faster/easier to come by for Massey Ferguson than anything else that they carry.

The MF1726 was on my radar screen, but I REALLY had an attraction to that Kioti. I am wondering if any actual Kioti owners have seen any signs of this poor OEM support to the dealers, or is this a sampling of 1 and not a trend across the dealer network?

My 2 semi local dealers are Evolution Agriculture in Ohio who is a small Kioti dealer who had 3 units on stock, the other dealer is Armstrong in PA who had around 15 units on hand. How would Kioti support these small dealers if they were not helpful and responsive to a large and high volume dealer?

 

[747driver]

I bought my 2013 CK27 2 years ago with 190 hrs. i have 525 hrs nown. Only had 1 issue and that was a bad fuel nozzle. The dealer i took it to was not the dealer i bought it from ( out of state ) . The dealer at first didn't want to honor the warranty....so i called Kioti hq in NC. They investigated and found my warranty good and paid the $3000 repair bill. I paid $900 extra myself as i had them replace the other 2 nozzles since the engine was open. The dealer also had to repair #3 cylinder. I have had no bad experience with Kioti...always answered my emails or calls. The dealer did a great job and went the extra mile on changing out some parts.

In-Stock New and Used Models For Sale in Shippensburg, PA | Nolt's ...
Nolt's Power Equipment LLC

How close do you live to Shippensburg ? This is where i get all my filters from, off their Ebay store. They are a Kioti dealer.

There are many of us here on TBN that luv the Kioti.....

 

[cphilip]

Well my dealer is rather large for our area. Probably has near 100 units from large to small. He's selling compacts like hot cakes. No sign of slowing down. He's real big on Kioti and has been for about 20 years. If he's had any issues with warranty's he's not talking about them. Seems to think highly of them and shows no sign of quitting. He's ranging out over 100 miles delivering units to people. Selling them to people over the phone in Florida to be delivered to Tennessee. Things like that. All this is happening within the last few days or weeks. I was just there yesterday and they loading up for delivery two units at a time every time Im there. Even the UTV's are going out the door fast as they can get them in. Compacts and subs are sold before being uncrated.

He will tell you that Kioti is very strict about its policies but he has no complaints about them. For instance the make him stock a certain number of units all the time in order to provide the discounts. He has to either have them in stock or ordered and on the way. But that allows him to give the very best prices. He's fine with it.

There are not that many of these rural mom and pop tractor dealers around these days. This ones been around for over 60 years. And so you feel a bit more comfortable with whatever tractor they are going to get behind and sell. Id probably have bought whatever they were selling because they show no signs of slowing down and I want them to be there when I need them. I shopped dealers over tractor. I passed up on LS because the dealer was tiny and had only 6 units and looked more like a small local car repair. I passed on JD because the dealers were all pop up stores that appeared to be more sales showrooms with little in the way of shop capabilities and looked like corporate ventures. I wanted some relationship. And Kioti was one of the few that did that. I can only hope it survives and prospers. I don't see any evidence its not a strong competitor that is moving forward. It appears financially stable.

When I bought my Toro contractors level ZTR from my local Toro dealer (not Kioti dealer he deals Hustler mowers) within a year they had lost their Toro dealership. At first it appeared they were mad at Toro but in the end If found out that Toro had dropped them. Some sort of dispute with the sales rep about product placement. And when the owner sold out Toro refused to sign back with the new owner. I wasn't out in the cold because there was another toro dealer 20 miles away. Toro is around everywhere. But I lost my comfort with my dealer who had one of the best Mechanics in the area. But low and behold the eventually sign with Exmark! A toro company. So you just never know.

Does this look like a company having problems growing?

2016

KIOTI celebrates its 30th Anniversary.
KIOTI expands the Field Option Cab Series to suit new and existing models in the CS Series, CK10 Series, DK10 Series, and UTVs.
A new drive-over mid-mount mower compatible with the CK2510/H was introduced.
The CS2210 and CS2510 were added to the CS Series sub-compact line.
The EDA awards KIOTI with Gold Level Status for exemplary ratings as part of their Dealer-Manufacturer Relations Survey.

If I gambled and lose well... won't be the first time. After all... its just a tractor. But I don't put much stock in rumors or disputes between certain dealers and their relationships with the manufacturer unless its some widespread epidemic. I would put my money on the person I trust to be there and hope he makes things right with me. And I see no evidence of problems there.

 

[CincyFlyer]

I've seen dealerships (motorcycle, in this case) cover things that shouldn't have been covered by warranty, and then blame the manufacturer.

 

[marchanna]

The biggest dealer in my area sells Massey and Kioti as far as CUTs and full size utility/farm tractors go. From what I can gather no dealer in a 500 mile radius can touch their prices.

They’ve been around forever. An have a really decent inventory of tractors. I would say about 75 new tractors and 25 used tractors if I had to make a guess.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

My experience with this sort of thing with many different brands is when it comes right down to it, it is the dealer, not the manufacturer that is the problem.

I mean when one dealer has nothing but problems and another dealer praises the same manufacturer, you have to look at the variable, (each dealer) and say, what makes one better than the other?

Believe it or not, there is still a human factor that should be considered.

 

[Teachu2]

It was probably a dispute over other issues between Bruno's and Kioti. MAP (Minimum Advertised Pricing) guideline violations have cost large retailers dealerships in many diverse products, from consumer electronics to automobiles to chainsaws to firearms. That may well be the case here.

Dealerships can make any excuse to explain the loss of a dealership, as the manufacturer almost never discloses their reason for terminating a dealership. Notice that Bruno's didn't say they couldn't get parts - that's too easy to check.

If you go back and check the forums, you will find examples where Kioti stepped up above and beyond warranty.

 

[cphilip]

It was probably a dispute over other issues between Bruno's and Kioti. MAP (Minimum Advertised Pricing) guideline violations have cost large retailers dealerships in many diverse products, from consumer electronics to automobiles to chainsaws to firearms. That may well be the case here.

Thats a very good guess. I know my dealer says that they have strict rules he has to follow. But he doesn't seem to mind them too much. But they affect incentives that allow him to apply discounts and promotions. It could be they got into a dispute doing those sorts of things.

 

[Gittyup]

I bought my tractor from Wallace Equipment in Lake Ariel, PA. He was all about Kioti. And both he and Kioti stepped up for me. I believe Wallace was selling a good many Kiotis back then. Then one day out of the blue he quit selling Kioti. He never publicly said why (at least not that I read). Others and I guessed that it had to do with terms for the dealership, like inventory, etc. Wallace was (and likely still is) a top notch dealer. Just not for Kioti.

 

[arits74]

google brunos powersports reviews and that will tell you all you need to know about brunos

 

[SHORT KID]

Gittyup, I bought my Mahindra from Wallace also and when I went up this spring for filters, he had closed up. There was an auction notice on the door. They always had a good supply of parts.

 

[DieselBound]

The national manufacturer's rating survey (can't recall the exact name) was one reason why I took a gamble on Kioti. Kioti was ranked toward the top of the list: Kubota, of course, was at the top (and that was for a LOT of manufacturers). It's a survey to dealers. But, every relationship is different, and sometimes things just go sideways: never good that it has to get to that point, but it happens.

 

[Msamt]

I bought my DK back in 2013 from a small shop which closed about 3 months after I bought it. Turns out there was funky stuff going on and the actual owner wasn't aware of it. Fast forward a few months and they were back in biz under new management, but Same owner. Last I talked to Dave, they had doubled their business in one year. He's got a ton of inventory and more coming every month.
Being an independent dealer is not easy, I have a lot of experience with power and cooling equipment and the reps have to follow the rules pretty tight - today's business world is much different than the old days when you ordered out of a paper catalog, and could straighten out mistakes over the phone. My guess is it is the change in business practices to ensure supply chain and sales forecast are aligned more than anything else, this is a floor plan inventory model for Kioti (and JD) so you have to move the minimum to get the inventory you want.
MT

 

[WV birdman]

google brunos powersports reviews and that will tell you all you need to know about brunos

I was about to type that very thing.

 

[fried1765]

I was about to type that very thing.

Seems like too many poor reviews for me!

 

[VictorW]

Gittyup, I bought my Mahindra from Wallace also and when I went up this spring for filters, he had closed up. There was an auction notice on the door. They always had a good supply of parts.

As Gittyup mentioned, Wallace did have some sort of falling out with Kioti and continued his business with Mahindra and smaller power equipment. Unfortunately, he and his wife had a parting of the ways and that's why the business closed. Wallace was a great dealer and maybe he'll start up again somewhere once he gets his feet back on the ground.

 

[Barrettseq]

They are not allowed to advertise or sell nationally. Now you can sneak a few here and there but that can't be your main business because it hurts the dealer network and that is why they shut him down. They would sell cheap, charge for delivery in the price and never have to touch the tractor again. When I do a warranty I don't get paid 100% of my time so I have to add a bit on the sale. This way it makes it easier to give a filter kit, free repair or free pick up for better customer service. If he sells in my area I have to charge the customer for everything warranty does not cover and then no one is happy.

Kioti has been fantastic to us for 18 years with simple rules. Rule #1 sell tractors, #2 pay for tractors that are sold, #3 repair tractors that you sold. It's that easy. We try to complicate it but if you do each of those in that order Kioti is behind you 100%.

 

[Rock Crawler]

They are not allowed to advertise or sell nationally. Now you can sneak a few here and there but that can't be your main business because it hurts the dealer network and that is why they shut him down. They would sell cheap, charge for delivery in the price and never have to touch the tractor again. When I do a warranty I don't get paid 100% of my time so I have to add a bit on the sale. This way it makes it easier to give a filter kit, free repair or free pick up for better customer service. If he sells in my area I have to charge the customer for everything warranty does not cover and then no one is happy.

Kioti has been fantastic to us for 18 years with simple rules. Rule #1 sell tractors, #2 pay for tractors that are sold, #3 repair tractors that you sold. It's that easy. We try to complicate it but if you do each of those in that order Kioti is behind you 100%.

Best response so far.

That makes sense and explains what they did not.

 

[BTI]

They are not allowed to advertise or sell nationally. Now you can sneak a few here and there but that can't be your main business because it hurts the dealer network and that is why they shut him down. They would sell cheap, charge for delivery in the price and never have to touch the tractor again. When I do a warranty I don't get paid 100% of my time so I have to add a bit on the sale. This way it makes it easier to give a filter kit, free repair or free pick up for better customer service. If he sells in my area I have to charge the customer for everything warranty does not cover and then no one is happy.

Kioti has been fantastic to us for 18 years with simple rules. Rule #1 sell tractors, #2 pay for tractors that are sold, #3 repair tractors that you sold. It's that easy. We try to complicate it but if you do each of those in that order Kioti is behind you 100%.

Very good answer Barrett
They are typically very reasonable.
There are exceptions to every rule.
Small dealers don't usually get the attention from the manufacturer they should.
This has not been the case with Kioti. No complaints here.

 

[kantuckid]

Thread took a turn toward common sense, thanks.
FWIW, I talked to a former Mahindra dealer, now Kioti who had turned sour on Mahindra based on certain experiences with models from certain countries. interestingly, his honest, IMO, comments were the opposite of another Mahindra dealer I talked to about tractors. Both are long term mahindra dealers, one is only Kioti now.