Grading Box Blade On a Hill

[TheMadOne]

Quick question. I'm getting a L3301 to do my driveway, which is a hill. Should I only push the box blade uphill and pull down, always keeping the load to the uphill side, or is it fine to work both up and down?

 

[teg]

First, you don't want to push the box blade, 3pt arms can bend - they are designed to pull.

Bottom line, drag down hill - race back up with the box blade in the air.

Now if you can quickly change the tilt so you are pulling in both directions... If you have Ag tires, you might be able to do both up and down but the tractor will let you know (running out of traction or power). R4's depending on how much of a hill, same thing but will most likely loss traction quickly.

 

[s219]

I'd say try it both ways, but if the tractor runs out of steam or traction going uphill, then you'll have your answer. And as noted, be sure you're pulling the box.

 

[teg]

So, follow up... you are wanting to cut the uphill side, fill in the down hill side. I've done this and it takes a bit of time. Usually, drop the scarifiers and drag it a few times to loosen the soil. Make it pretty wide (have room for ditches). Do you have a thread on the road build? Would be cool to see one.

 

[TheMadOne]

Thanks for the replies, but if you're not supposed to run a box blade backward then why does it have a rear blade?

Also, this video from everything attachments shows Peanut running both directions.

How to use the Everything Attachments Tractor Box Blade - YouTube

If it's not recommended, then why is it shown in every "how to box blade" video I've come across?

I was more afraid of flipping then just running out of power/traction.

 

[Thomas]

Does L3301 have frontloader?, added weight of the loader will coming handy if you decide to pull up hill,can always fill bucket little for more weight should keep front end tires down,also try in 4WD going up hill.

 

[TheMadOne]

Teg,

No thread yet. No tractor yet. Should be getting it in by next weekend. It's not so much a road build as a complete reconstruction of an existing one. There is a 12" plus deep ditch where water has gotten into the wheel track and eaten away at it, plus other problems. There's a clay strip across the drive, and when it's really wet it perks through and turns into a bottomless quagmire(it ate a F-150 to the axles). I estimate the whole project will require a minimum of 4-5 truckloads of stone, for a less than 300ft section(the hill). The rest of the 1/4 mile drive is in pretty solid shape, probably only needs gone over with the blade and scarifiers. That's just the existing driveway. I want to extend it, add some paths, and some new parking areas. I'm gonna move a lot of stone this summer!

Thomas,

Yes to the loader. Thanks for the idea of putting ballast into the bucket!

 

[teg]

You can go backwards but you can (and people have) bent the arms. If you use you head and don't pretend it's a bulldozer, you can do it. The rear blade is used mainly for smoothing out. Lengthening the top link until the only thing touching the ground it the rear facing blade. (Works great).

For the quagmire area, we've used both 3"/4" stone ground into the mud until you can top dress it. I like to have it rain on the "finished" road bed before gravel to see where water problems are. I have a friend that has at least one truck load of gravel in their creek before he finally got the road to where it doesn't wash out.

PS. just watched the video, pushing new gravel backward is definitely not a problem.

 

[JRobyn]

I'll disagree. On the hills in my gravel drive, gravel tends to wash down the hill in heavy rains. Particularly the lighter, smaller crusher-run stuff. So I always blade from the bottom to the top. If this causes traction problems, you're trying to move too much at once. Slow down and take more, smaller bites.

I have often "bulldozed" in reverse with the back blade of my boxblade with no ill effects. But it IS CORRECT that your lower lift arms are NOT designed for this, but for tension. So if you do it, keep this in mind, and use only moderate force and take small bites.

Where that rear blade excels is when you tilt the front of the boxblade up so that just the rear blade is contacting the ground. Then it will "brush" and smooth your surface without cutting or moving much material.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Thanks for the replies, but if you're not supposed to run a box blade backward then why does it have a rear blade?

Also, this video from everything attachments shows Peanut running both directions.

How to use the Everything Attachments Tractor Box Blade - YouTube

If it's not recommended, then why is it shown in every "how to box blade" video I've come across?

I was more afraid of flipping then just running out of power/traction.

I use my box scraper in both directions.

On my driveway, I find myself bringing the runoff back up the hill.

 

[s219]

When going forward, the box blade rear cutter is meant for feathering/smoothing, depending on how you have the top link adjusted. I have to strongly echo the caution that the box blade is intended for use going forward. The whole purpose of the box is to fill up with material, to remove from high spots and deposit in low spots. That process really only works when going forward. On top of that, the 3-pt lower arms and top link are designed for pulling, not pushing. There are plenty of threads here on TBN by unfortunate souls who discover that the hard way, though it should be obvious in my opinion.

All that said, I use my box blade in reverse sometimes -- with proper adjustment of the top link -- to smooth or move loose material. It should not be angled so that it is digging in reverse, and it should not be used to bulldoze in compacted soil, or something will break. Neither the box blade or 3-pt is made for that.

So basically, in forward, do whatever you want. The tractor will run out of traction or power before something breaks. In reverse, use it with care on loose soil. In reverse, mechanical parts will break before the tractor runs out of steam.

As far as box blades being used in reverse in videos, well, I can link you to a lot of dumb tractor usages shown on video. Doesn't make any of it right or universal. Any tractor expert worth his salt should know that the 3-pt is much weaker pushing in reverse than pulling forward. Use that expertise to decide how much rear pushing is safe. It's not a black/white issue -- it takes judgement and experience.

 

[TripleR]

I pull in both directions on our hills, I my not be able to move as much material in some instances, but I usually don't need to move a lare amount. I have a hydraulic top-link which make using my box scraper easier for everything.

As others, I push and pull with mine as well, but am mindful of the force pushing vs pulling and I've never bent any arms on our tractors. Done incorrectly you will bend arms and some have broken mounting points on their 3PH.

 

[oosik]

I have a roll over box blade. I use it in both directions. I'll dig deep & pull hard going forward. I'll push, in reverse, to flatten & smooth already dug dirt or to push small piles to smooth. I will NEVER push something hard or dig in reverse. It simply isn't worth it to find out what might happen.

 

[sw99]

If you get the opportunity, you should find an area where you can practice a bit. A BB can get you in trouble fast.

 

[TripleR]

Don't know if this is relative to your situation, but may be worth reading: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/214590-how-use-box-blade.html

 

[jeff9366]

If you have RIGID STABILIZERS for your Lower Links you can push "a little" with prudence, as snug adjusted, rigid stabilizers provide some Lower Link support in reverse.

With CHECK CHAIN STABILIZERS for your Lower Links you have zero support for your Lower Links in reverse. PUSHING you can deform check chain stabilizers easily. You can surely guess how I found out.
Photo #3 - Bent, three-pound Check Chain Stabilizers replaced with fourteen-pound Rigid Stabilizers; Kubota B3300SU.





When pulling down hill with a Box Blade this 3-Pt. adjustment may be helpful:

The solution is to move the adjustment pins for the Three Point Hitch right and left Lifting Rod stirrups, which attach to the Lower Links, from the TOP hole to the LOWER hole. This will allow your Box Blade to drop down 3" to 4". Then play with Top Link length.

Removing pins is easy with implement off. Grease pins lightly. I use anti-seize compound but any grease is fine.

This pin adjustment is useful when using a Box Blade, Landscape Rake, Rear Blade and/or Turf Thatch Remover.



Kubota L3560 photos:

#1 Standard position for Lower Link, stirrup pin in UPPER adjustment hole. Note Lower Link angle.

#2 Optional position for Lower Link, stirrup pin in LOWER adjustment hole. Note Lower Link drop.

 

[TheMadOne]

This is all excellent info, thank you!

 

[mfl_jr]

This is all excellent info, thank you!

One thing that has worked well for me is to never push with a box blade in 4wd.

It has been my experience that if you push in 2wd then you really shouldn't have any problem, the tires should spin before you can break/bend anything.

Of course, YMMV...

Thanks,
Mike

 

[John_Mc]

When pulling down hill with a Box Blade this 3-Pt. adjustment may be helpful:

The solution is to move the adjustment pins for the Three Point Hitch right and left Lifting Rod stirrups, which attach to the Lower Links, from the TOP hole to the LOWER hole. This will allow your Box Blade to drop down 3" to 4". Then play with Top Link length.

Removing pins is easy with implement off. Grease pins lightly. I use anti-seize compound but any grease is fine.

This pin adjustment is useful when using a Box Blade, Landscape Rake, Rear Blade and/or Turf Thatch Remover.

Jeff9366 - I understand what you are saying, but I'm not sure why that makes any difference. If I'm pulling downhill, the tractor and the 3 pt hitch are tilted down the hill right along with my box blade. The geometry of all of this relative to the ground still remains the same. The only time I could see this making a difference is that brief distance when the tractor transitions from level to down hill, but the boxblade is still back on the level ground. I guess it's possible that the boxblade might not lower enough to engage the ground until both the tractor and the implement were on the downhill slope (though I've never experienced this problem myself: my box blade still seems to have plenty of downward range of motion).

Am I missing something in what you are describing?

 

[jeff9366]

Jeff9366 - I understand what you are saying, but I'm not sure why that makes any difference. If I'm pulling downhill, the tractor and the 3 pt hitch are tilted down the hill right along with my box blade. The geometry of all of this relative to the ground still remains the same.
Am I missing something in what you are describing?

Not it does not. The cutting edge of the Box Blade will be 3" to 4" lower, that is why there are two stirrup holes.

It is easier to try it than to type about it. Give it a go.