FEL seems weak- how to check

[LD1]

LD1
I might be wrong but I think TxMark is referring to bucket linkages similar to parts key 12 on the model 720 FEL on a JD ind 2010

could be. Still not understanding what he is asking.

 

[Texasmark]

Was your JD 2010 ind or ag? BTW 2010 was only 46.86 HP not 70

Scuuussssseeee me sir. Typo. 4010. Loader was either a 152 or 157. Seem to remember the former. I know the cylinders mounted directly to the bucket because on one occasion I was digging out one of my ponds with it. Technique was to tilt the bucked all the way down and drive it into the mud till the front wheels came off the ground....slightly. Then put her in reverse and pull the muck out. Worked great for about half the job then in doing so, I came to a spot where "something went dreadfully wrong" and I bent the shafts on the cylinders. So they obviously had lateral pressure on the shafts. With my current tractor the cylinder pushes straight into a pivoting arm which does the moving as the other end of the arm is attached to the bucket. No bent rods with this arrangement and better force application.

 

[Tx Jim]

Mark
Are the bucket cyl operating linkges on your tractor what you were previously referring to in an earlier post? I wonder if the previously mentioned linkages will help prevent bucket cyl rod bending when back dragging bucket with ft wheels lifted off the ground? Does bucket cyl linkage as shown in photo increase hyd pressure applied to bucket?

Back grading with the frt tires off the ground is a very good way to bend bucket cyl rods especially on a JD agriculture FEL with bucket cylinder rods fully extended

BTW JD 4010 rowcrop tractor had 84 pto HP.

 

[LD1]

using that technique is a good way to bend the rods on any loader, not just a JD agricultural loader

 

[Tx Jim]

I totally agree but will the linkages in photo help keep rods from bending as easily when back dragging when rods are attached directly to bucket or SSQA?

 

[Walker1]

Not sure if this problem took a left turn or what happened, however, change you hydraulic filter and check the fluid level. Still acting funny, get a pressure gauge on it.

 

[LD1]

I totally agree but will the linkages in photo help keep rods from bending as easily when back dragging when rods are attached directly to bucket or SSQA?

I dont think so. I think what helps is loader with the linkage "usually" have shorter stroke cylinders.

The issue with bending the rod becomes the length of it. The longer the cylinder, the easier to bend.

 

[Texasmark]

Mark
Are the bucket cyl operating linkges on your tractor what you were previously referring to in an earlier post? I wonder if the previously mentioned linkages will help prevent bucket cyl rod bending when back dragging bucket with ft wheels lifted off the ground? Does bucket cyl linkage as shown in photo increase hyd pressure applied to bucket?

Back grading with the frt tires off the ground is a very good way to bend bucket cyl rods especially on a JD agriculture FEL with bucket cylinder rods fully extended

BTW JD 4010 rowcrop tractor had 84 pto HP.

Yes on the prior reference. Interesting you found a pic of my tractor faster than I could. Nice job.

Well on the hp I was going by the manual, not the Nebraska tests. Didn't want to err on the wrong side.....reduces the feedback flak. Mine was a diesel. After my LP 4020, I never bought anything but a diesel.

On helping to solve the back drag problem, they have to as the cylinder pressure is always in a straight line. On cylinder pressure, I'm not up on it but per you guys, 0 degrees is the highest pressure. What I don't know, nor how to calculate is the effect of the "force vector" via the arms that do the angle changing. Going to guess that you are dealing with a closed system and anywhere along the line you break 0 degrees you are in for a loss; 0 degrees defined as the bucket sucked all the way up...cylinder closed. In that position there is a short, straight line to the mounting brackets of the bucket. I don't have my specs handy on lift capacity at the arms, nor the bucket max-min, but I can drive it into a peaked pile of gravel, overfilling the (6') bucket and unseat the overpressure valve. But to do so it is really full and would be awkward attempting to move from the pile to the use location.

 

[Texasmark]

I dont think so. I think what helps is loader with the linkage "usually" have shorter stroke cylinders.

The issue with bending the rod becomes the length of it. The longer the cylinder, the easier to bend.

I'd bet Jim has a picture of an old JD loader that has the cylinders fully extended. Take that picture and apply back dragging to it and you can see the problem. From the tractor seat, I couldn't very well apparently....but I got half way around before I learned of my error. But that was back in 1991 time line and I was still young at farming.

 

[Tx Jim]

Mark
I don't have a photo of JD loader with bucket cyl extended. All I did to find your tractors photo was perform a search using your handle(Texasmark)

 

[Texasmark]

Mark
I don't have a photo of JD loader with bucket cyl extended. All I did to find your tractors photo was perform a search using your handle(Texasmark)

Okayeeee. On the subject of that loader, as I recall I had 4 connections to engage simultaneously, 2 at the bottom which accepted the loader frame and 2 on top accepting the cylinders on an 8' bucket that was way too heavy to push around manually and you can only do so much maneuvering from the operators seat as far as getting things lined up to accept the pins. And then there was the fact that it used 2 cylinders and they never did extend the same distance. Real bear and usually I left it on as it was too much trouble to reinstall the next time I needed it and never was anyone around to help out. So with 9.00 or so x 15 or 16 front tires (2wd) I was always front end heavy.

In comes the Branson with a fast connecting Bobcat/Bearcat FEL plate. I painted a couple of white lines on both the plate and the loader so that I could see the proper alignment from the seat and it now takes about 2 seconds to get her connected and one trip from the seat to push the locking pins down. Good old technology at work again.

 

[Threepoint]

We sell a pressure gauge if you don't want to source the parts to build one for yourself, we also have a video posted showing how to use it.

Ken's Bolt on Grab Hooks <<Hydraulics>>

Ken, nice video.

 

[Tx Jim]

Okayeeee. On the subject of that loader, as I recall I had 4 connections to engage simultaneously, 2 at the bottom which accepted the loader frame and 2 on top accepting the cylinders on an 8' bucket that was way too heavy to push around manually and you can only do so much maneuvering from the operators seat as far as getting things lined up to accept the pins. And then there was the fact that it used 2 cylinders and they never did extend the same distance.

Although I agree SSQA is much easier to attach/detach attachments than removing/installing individual pins BUT installing bucket cyl pins can be made easier by after lower bucket pins are installed to attach bucket to boom frame then raise bucket high enough to clear ground/floor,extend both bucket cylinders fully then one can easily move bucket back & forth to install bucket cyl pins.

 

[kennyd]

Ken, nice video.

Thank you.

 

[Clipse3GT]

Thank you.

Kenny,

What is the accuracy grade on the gauge provided with your kit? Just wanted to know how it compares.

 

[kennyd]

Kenny,

What is the accuracy grade on the gauge provided with your kit? Just wanted to know how it compares.

Grade A, 1-2%

Compares to what?

 

[Clipse3GT]

Grade A, 1-2%

Compares to what?

Just various grades of gauges I wasn't sure since I couldn't find the information on the webpage.

 

[Texasmark]

Although I agree SSQA is much easier to attach/detach attachments than removing/installing individual pins BUT installing bucket cyl pins can be made easier by after lower bucket pins are installed to attach bucket to boom frame then raise bucket high enough to clear ground/floor,extend both bucket cylinders fully then one can easily move bucket back & forth to install bucket cyl pins.

Well that's real nice Mr. Coyote Flats (Grin) but I was in my Sophomore year at Hard Knocks U. at the time and I didn't have all that knowledge, experience and others in the field to guide me....... Makes sense. Sometimes you are just too close to see the forest. Happened to me a lot. Had a huge agenda and no money, help, or time to get it accomplished.....but it worked out.

 

[Xfaxman]

Although I agree SSQA is much easier to attach/detach attachments than removing/installing individual pins BUT installing bucket cyl pins can be made easier by after lower bucket pins are installed to attach bucket to boom frame then raise bucket high enough to clear ground/floor,extend both bucket cylinders fully then one can easily move bucket back & forth to install bucket cyl pins.

It also makes it easier if the attachment is on a dolly. :thumbsup:

 

[Texasmark]

It also makes it easier if the attachment is on a dolly. :thumbsup:

View attachment 450460

View attachment 450462

View attachment 450461

That is a perfect shot, showing how my JD 4910 loader bucket was attached to the bucket and allowed for me to bend the cyinder's rods when I put the bucket vertical and did the "back drag" movement with the wheels off the ground.......slightly.