Weird John Deere L130 Transaxle Issue

[JDL130]

Last summer I purchased a very nice used JD L130 for a few hundred bucks from the backlot of my local JD dealer. It had just under 300 hours on the clock and aside from a little bit of deck rust was in excellent shape.

I mowed with it for most of last summer at a house we rented after ours sold and before we settled on a new one, and at about 316 hours I had everything together to completely redo it -- deck belt, 5W50 for the transaxle, spark plugs, all relevant filters, etc. So I "overhauled" it at that time, including replacing transaxle fluid, cleaning the magnet, etc. and things worked great.

Fast forward to this summer, new property, more hilly than the rental property which was a dead flat 1 acre. I'm mowing a mostly flat with some hills/slopes 3/4 of an acre now with the rest in pasture/garden/etc. Tractor was great until this past weekend when I noticed a weird "thunk" that would intermittently happen coming from the passenger side rear either in the transaxle or the wheel. It is most pronounced when switching from reverse to forward, but will occasionally happen randomly during prolonged forward drive.

The transaxle has plenty of power and it usually takes about 1 hour to mow the property we have now (lots of broken up yard, trees, around obstacles, etc.) It does not exhibit any slowing of operation during this time and is as peppy going back into the garage at the end as it is coming out to start mowing.

At first it seemed like the deck was hitting something, or perhaps a spindle problem, but I removed deck, checked all spindles, and have been riding around with just the tractor and nothing attached to it and the problem is still there. I don't pull or tow anything with it as I was well aware of the potential weakness of the K46 when I bought it, so it's a dedicated mower. Plus I have a Kubota B1750 for the heavy lifting/tilling/etc.

I replaced the traction drive belt, thinking perhaps the $22 solution might work -- that the original 330-hour belt was slipping and then catching and slamming the trans. It continues to exhibit the problem although less severely. The pulley on the transaxle appears to be OK and not worn down or otherwise compromised.

I removed the wheel on that side and checked the key, axle shaft, etc., and there's nothing amiss. Might be some more play in the hub area than I'd like but I suppose a washer or two would fix that and honestly, the wheels never mounted on really tight with that c-clip setup they have.

Any thoughts? I'm guessing it must be internal to the transmission, I've checked all external linkages, etc., for binding, proper securing with push nuts/cotter pins etc. and can't seem to find anything amiss. Anything I might have overlooked or any thoughts?

I think I can limp it through this season but not really anticipating spending the $$$ for a new tractor anytime soon. Everything seems to have the garbage K46 now (at least everything in a reasonable price range) and I'm not sure it's really worth it to spend @ $1700 on putting a K-66 in this tractor. The idea of throwing another K46 in for $629 (Amazon price) is getting more attractive.

The Kohler 23HP engine is in excellent shape and I'll probably sell it on Ebay if I do end up junking this one, or keeping it.

 

[Teachu2]

I'm dealing with one that came with the property. The hills here are killing it, If it didn't have the Kohler in it, I'd have dumped it already. I"m considering a K-66 or a new Husq or Kubota or a finish mower to use the Kioti instead. My tiny lawn is handled by a Honda walk behind.

 

[s219]

Honestly, I wouldn't even put $629 into it. That mower barely cost double that when new. The basic L mowers are not well made. Something else will probably fail soon after you replace the transmission.

What might be better is to fix or rebuild the K46. And I'd probably cap the investment at $200 if it were me. You can get parts and rebuild kits from the manufacturer.

 

[JDL130]

That's kind of where I'm at right now. Even $629 seems like a lot, as you say, based on the quality of what it's going into. It's been a good tractor but I don't want to throw good money after bad. Any suggestions on a good replacement? I'm not keen on throwing @ $5k at another JD to get the next level of trans, and $4500 is about the lowest price for one with a K58, which isn't really THAT much better.

I'm just afraid I'll spend 2k+ on something and only get another 300 hours out of it. I thought about a cheap gear-drive Ariens but really, I think hydrostat with a foot pedal is a must for the way our lawn is laid out -- lots of little trees, etc., that you can mow partially under but then have to back out, etc.

 

[JDL130]

What's odd to me is the atypical nature of this failure -- @ 99% of the L130 transaxle threads I've read in the past year or so reference sort of a slow, painful failure cycle where the trans gradually loses power until it just won't do anything anymore. I haven't read of any that made banging/knocking/etc. noises.

 

[s219]

Well, if it doesn't noticeably impact mowing, maybe run with it as long as you can. Normally when they really fail, you'll start to notice slipping on hills, etc.

Another option is to tear it down and see if you can find the source of the noise. Could be a broken piece of metal floating around. If you find and fix the problem now, it could avoid the whole thing grenading in the future.

 

[JDL130]

It's more of an annoyance than anything -- you'll be riding along and *thunk*. Jarring, but not mission critical. I'm thinking of running it the rest of the season and either tear it down over the winter or think about a replacement next year.

 

[JDL130]

I took a look at the drawings and really the most likely thing would appear to be some problem with the differential gears on that side, perhaps a missing tooth or whatever. I might tear into it and see if I can get parts for less than $200. A complete rebuild kit is out of the question as it is now $361 + freight which is a bit high IMO.

 

[RUSSELL SHETTLE]

I just bought a new D130 with the same trans and recently learned about the problems with it. After the initial 8 hours I did the recommended maintenance but I went deeper than that and voided my warranty by removing the K46 trans and replacing its oil with 5W50 synthetic hoping that this will prevent future problems I've read so much about.

Heat is the issue with these trans as I'm sure you all know and is why Tuff Torq recommends 5W50 synthetic. Most people are not going to remove the trans just to change the oil and most of the failures are due to a trans never seeing an oil change let alone giving it a better oil.

I don't care about the warranty. There's nothing I can't fix myself and with the right preventive maintenance (PM) it shouldn't fail but the trans is not a serviceable component and it is not an item listed for any periodic PM to be given by the owner. Why they put in crappy oil to begin with is beyond me, knowing it's weakness to heat.

I took a chance and decided to remove the trans in order to replace the oil after only 8 hours of initial use. It was not difficult, for me anyway. So now I'm using a quality 5W50 synthetic at the beginning in the hope and belief that I can run this trans with zero future problems.

The warranty won't allow you to do this so I can't recommend what I did to new buyers of JD lawn tractors.

The Problem: If you don't already know, is heat. These trans generate so much heat that it breaks down the the crappy oil to where you lose viscosity, not to mention other problems as a result. Much of the problems I've read about have to do with a loss of power after so many minutes of use. This is because the oil has heated up to the point where the loss of viscosity has affected the pump and motor and the tractor slows considerably or ceases to move entirely. I've also read that when this happened to some users, they changed the oil and that brought new life to the trans. That's fine but a late oil change can't put back worn material.

The thing is: The oil in the trans should have been a synthetic from the beginning but JD would rather take you money to replace it or sell you a new tractor and they know most people aren't going to touch it during the worthless warranty period. So I said: "Screw the Warranty" I'm going to replace the oil right away as is recommended by Tuff Torq.

Changing the oil was very easy. The hard part was removing the K46 and reinstalling it but it was not all that complicated.

Ideally, the trans should be designed with a radiator, oil reservoir and pump to keep the oil as cool as possible. There is a YouTube clip out there where someone did just that of their own design but that takes a lot of ingenuity. Like I said, heat is the problem and regular oil they use can't take if for very long.

I wish I could tell you what your "thump" is but I can't.

 

[s219]

The thing to keep in mind is that the transmission does fine if you use the mower for what it's designed for. Where people run into trouble is on hills and in other situations that exceed the transmission's duty rating. This is a basic box-store mower, engineered for it's price point. You can spend more and step up to a higher model Deere for mowing hills and other heavier-duty workloads.

 

[jenkinsph]

Good luck with it.

 

[RUSSELL SHETTLE]

The thing to keep in mind is that the transmission does fine if you use the mower for what it's designed for. Where people run into trouble is on hills and in other situations that exceed the transmission's duty rating. This is a basic box-store mower, engineered for it's price point. You can spend more and step up to a higher model Deere for mowing hills and other heavier-duty workloads.

I fully agree with your statement and yes people will push their mowers beyond their design limit not realizing it's limit. I cut about one acre total and my yard does have a slight 5% grade of a hill but I only cut grass with my D130. I don't intend to plow snow or do any hauling though they sell the attachments for that.

Still, I think the transmissions should have been supplied with a synthetic. Tuff Torq states that they ship their transmissions dry to the various companies and they will put in conventional oil to save money. You have no idea what they are putting in them. Plus, the transmissions will be made (not all) without drain plugs per company specifications.

When I drained the oil from the transmission after only 8 hours of use the oil had a dark film. There was no discernible metal collected on the magnet, just a blackish film. The oil was still yellow but not clear. It looked similar to the oil I drained out of the engine crankcase. The 8 hours is a break-in period, as I'm sure you know. I'm sure a similar break-in takes place as well with the transmission yet you (the owner) is not suppose to nor can you service it during the warranty period and would cost you to have JD do it it they were even willing by no failure. I wanted to do it. I wanted the protection of a recommended synthetic regardless of my careful use of the mower. I had no problem voiding the warranty to do this for myself. These low level tractors are very easy to work on. Even the transmissions of the K46 line that come with drain plugs (2 plugs in fact), it would be very difficult to add the oil back in with it being mounted. There are no drain plugs on mine of course so I had no choice but to take it out to change the oil.

I intend to change it again after the first 50 hours, then 200 hours after that as recommended by Tuff Torq, and that with the use of a synthetic. The rest of the maintenance requirements are very easy. I expect pulleys to eventually fail and they are easy to replace.

The steering assembly is weak but also appears to be easy to replace. I've looked it over quite thoroughly.

I'm not unhappy with the unit in any way, just a little disappointed in a product that is supposed to be JD tough but then again, I've realized how common the assembly overall is to other riding mowers in it's price range.

 

[jenkinsph]

The thing to keep in mind is that the transmission does fine if you use the mower for what it's designed for. Where people run into trouble is on hills and in other situations that exceed the transmission's duty rating. This is a basic box-store mower, engineered for it's price point. You can spend more and step up to a higher model Deere for mowing hills and other heavier-duty workloads.

The interesting thing I found out while researching the Deere mowers a few weeks ago is that while I hear about this quote, "if you use the mower for what it is designed for". If you go to Deere website and use their mower selector and enter 2 acres, some slopes or hills, mower widths from 42 to 62 inch cuts, some trees, mowing and bagging, then Deere recommends everything from the D140 and larger. Then select the carrying and hauling term and see where it leads you. If you select 4 acres Deere recommends the x300 and up.
It would help if Deere would adjust their literature to reflect what is reasonable to expect.

I recommend anyone who is interested in the k46 debates play with the Deere selector application to see what I mean. The key word is "challenging" when you select that it recommends the x500 and up.

 

[RUSSELL SHETTLE]

Jenkinsph,

I did just what you suggested and went to the JD site and played with their selector application. I chose exactly what my requirements were, 1 acre, slopes and hills, a few obstacles, grass cutting only. It came back with only one suggested model.... the exact one that I bought, the D130.

So, if I use it only as intended, keep it "CLEAN", do all the maintenance, change the oil in the engine AND the trans with synthetic every year.... this mower should last forever!

I'm going to make this into a personal science project. I will change the oil in the K46 (TLT200)* trans with 5W50 Synthetic every 50 hours or once a year, whichever comes first, and see how far I can take it. It's new, has 8 hours now and the oil was just changed to 5W50 Syn. I figure I should live long enough.

* Note: My manual shows the model TLT200 for the Trans. It appears to be identical to the K46. I have no idea what actual difference it is.

 

[jenkinsph]

Russel,
It will be interesting to see how this works out, good to have an unbiased experiment on this. If I have time this winter I plan on repairing my L130 and refilling with synthetic oil. When the mower works it has a nice cut imo.

 

[RUSSELL SHETTLE]

Russel,
It will be interesting to see how this works out, good to have an unbiased experiment on this. If I have time this winter I plan on repairing my L130 and refilling with synthetic oil. When the mower works it has a nice cut imo.

Jenkinsph,

The thing is:.... I was fortunate to have discovered early the potential failures. Searching around the net for other reasons I ran into several YouTubes of people rebuilding their Trans. It got me thinking and curious as to why?????? This is a component part of my mower that is supposed to be unserviceable??? Then I read I should expect having to replace it before the rest of the mower wears out. That got me inspired to do even more research. I went to the Tuff Torq web site, etc. I just learned a lot and realized that it is serviceable and you can service the trans yourself if you have the ability and the tools, which I do.

I would have NEVER given the trans one single thought, seriously. NOTHING in the manual about it. It was simply not an item I needed to maintain.... or so I thought!!!!

Thanks to the many YouTube clips of people who have successfully rebuilt their trans and the Tuff Torq instructions, I decided to consider replacing the oil with the recommended 5W50 synthetic. That should be simple compared to a rebuild. But I have to admit, I was hesitant to just jump right in not knowing what I might be up against because I know I would have to remove it from the chassis along with the thought that I would also be voiding my warranty. I must have spent 2 or 3 days laying underneath the tractor with the bed removed looking over everything mechanical, planning my approach. "**** with the warranty! I'm jumping in and doing it.

It turned out to be a "piece of cake"

Brand new, and only 8 hours of use, the first engine oil change "break-in period" was due. I changed the oil in the engine first. I really, really wanted a good synthetic oil in the trans as well for the beginning of its life. Having learned what I did up front, this was the golden opportunity time frame to make an up-front difference for the trans.... I hope!

How many people have done this?

How many K46 Transmissions have had synthetic oil in them from the start?

What caused Tuff Torq to recommend changing to a 5W50 Synthetic oil in the first place? That's a huge difference from a 10W30 Conventional grade.

I have so many questions still but it's done now and we'll see how well it continues to perform in the future. I do plan on changing the oil each year or at least every 50 hours. ****, it's only 2.3 quarts!

 

[beenthere]

Russell
Enjoy the ride.

 

[Topcat14]

Russel,
It will be interesting to see how this works out, good to have an unbiased experiment on this. If I have time this winter I plan on repairing my L130 and refilling with synthetic oil. When the mower works it has a nice cut imo.

I doubt a refill of tranny fluid will help your transaxle, you let it go too long, you ‘ll probably need to rebuild it, or if you don’t have time ship the k46 to Duane at Tuff Torq – you can even have Duane upgrade your k46 to k57 - K57 adds a charge pump to improve oil flow and some other parts enhancement. Oil can be drained and replaced without removing transaxle- now that your property is leveled a k57 upgrade would last years

 

[Topcat14]

I fully agree with your statement and yes people will push their mowers beyond their design limit not realizing it's limit. I cut about one acre total and my yard does have a slight 5% grade of a hill but I only cut grass with my D130. I don't intend to plow snow or do any hauling though they sell the attachments for that.

Still, I think the transmissions should have been supplied with a synthetic. Tuff Torq states that they ship their transmissions dry to the various companies and they will put in conventional oil to save money. You have no idea what they are putting in them. Plus, the transmissions will be made (not all) without drain plugs per company specifications.

When I drained the oil from the transmission after only 8 hours of use the oil had a dark film. There was no discernible metal collected on the magnet, just a blackish film. The oil was still yellow but not clear. It looked similar to the oil I drained out of the engine crankcase. The 8 hours is a break-in period, as I'm sure you know. I'm sure a similar break-in takes place as well with the transmission yet you (the owner) is not suppose to nor can you service it during the warranty period and would cost you to have JD do it it they were even willing by no failure. I wanted to do it. I wanted the protection of a recommended synthetic regardless of my careful use of the mower. I had no problem voiding the warranty to do this for myself. These low level tractors are very easy to work on. Even the transmissions of the K46 line that come with drain plugs (2 plugs in fact), it would be very difficult to add the oil back in with it being mounted. There are no drain plugs on mine of course so I had no choice but to take it out to change the oil.

I intend to change it again after the first 50 hours, then 200 hours after that as recommended by Tuff Torq, and that with the use of a synthetic. The rest of the maintenance requirements are very easy. I expect pulleys to eventually fail and they are easy to replace.

The steering assembly is weak but also appears to be easy to replace. I've looked it over quite thoroughly.

I'm not unhappy with the unit in any way, just a little disappointed in a product that is supposed to be JD tough but then again, I've realized how common the assembly overall is to other riding mowers in it's price range.

Russell
I have no idea why JD doesn’t put 5w50 in transaxle- heat is enemy of k46 and quite simply synthetic handles heat much better it’s only a couple liters so cost can’t be that much more.

With 1 acre basically flat land your D130 should last a long time( I have a La135se predecessor of d130) that I changed to synthetic and have had no problems. Good luck !!

 

[jenkinsph]

Russel,
If you change the oil every 50 hours that should keep everything clean for sure. Should also help longevity too. But it should not be necessary to change the tranny oil every year or 50 hour interval. If that is needed to get reasonable life expectancy then it should have accessibility to fill and drain ports.

Looking forward to your reports on this in the future but it may take several years for you to get enough hours on the mower to form an opinion. Keep us posted.