Shade Tree Mechanic nedds help

[cartod]

My 1972 820 was just having too much blow by for my liking. I know many say just run it until it goes but I want to fix it. Im hoping its not too complicated because as the title states Im more of a shade tree mechanic. I have never pulled the head on anything.

Anyway I pulled it in the heated basement to work on it. The first thing I did was pull the valve cover, I have not gone any farther as I need some advice on my next move. What I found was a lot of gray sludge packed all over the inside of the cover. It looks milky like moisture of some kind is getting in. Here are the pics of my first ten minutes of work, after I washed it first.

Thanks for any input.

 

[tjcarguy]

Condensation . Does it ever get run hard so it's up to temp ? ---Trevor

 

[leveled]

nice looking tractor.

 

[cartod]

Condensation . Does it ever get run hard so it's up to temp ? ---Trevor

Yes, but not much. Im hoping it just needs a head gasket or rings.

 

[s78wingrider]

If you haven't drained oil, need to, at least some. If oil looks like that, could be head gasket. Aaron

 

[cartod]

If you haven't drained oil, need to, at least some. If oil looks like that, could be head gasket. Aaron

I just drained the oil and it looks cloudy too. It also has a few green bubbles in it like coolant, what would that be?

 

[TomSeller]

Is this tractor stored in a heated location? Always, but particularly if not stored in a heated location, the engine needs to be brought up to operating temperature under load for a lengthy period of time to evaporate off any moisture condensing inside the engine. If not stored in a heated location, and the engine has a block heater, maybe use it to pre-warm the engine in the winter so it gets up to temp faster. Fewer starts with longer usage each time are better than more starts with little usage. Idling doesn't count.

 

[TomSeller]

I just drained the oil and it looks cloudy too. It also has a few green bubbles in it like coolant, what would that be?

Probably coolant, yes.

 

[cartod]

Is this tractor stored in a heated location? Always, but particularly if not stored in a heated location, the engine needs to be brought up to operating temperature under load for a lengthy period of time to evaporate off any moisture condensing inside the engine. If not stored in a heated location, and the engine has a block heater, maybe use it to pre-warm the engine in the winter so it gets up to temp faster. Fewer starts with longer usage each time are better than more starts with little usage. Idling doesn't count.

Stored in outdoor unheated shed. If it is a head gasket, should I just take it to the dealer and have it done? How much to replace the head gasket do you think?

 

[tjcarguy]

Change oil and filters , clean up the goop , put a can of stopleak in it and monitor ---Trevor

 

[cartod]

Change oil and filters , clean up the goop , put a can of stopleak in it and monitor ---Trevor

I like this MR. CARGUY. The radiator was dry and I refilled it with 50/50. I will add the stop leak and give it a go ....

 

[AKfish]

I don't think I'd do that if my 820 was as nice as your's... If you've got coolant leaking into the cylinder and combusting you'll note the white smoke in the exhaust plume. That's not "blow-by"! Blow-by is the trace smoke coming from the rubber vent pipe on the valve cover.

Even burning very small amounts of water/coolant can result in significant damage to the cylinder head, valves and piston. If the leak becomes big enough the engine could "water lock" and break the piston, a rod and/or the crankshaft. That's a "catastrophic" failure and could mean you sell your tractor for scrap value!

Figure out where the leak is coming from and go from there - IMO.

Good luck.

AKfish

 

[murphy1244]

I don't think I'd do that if my 820 was as nice as your's... If you've got coolant leaking into the cylinder and combusting you'll note the white smoke in the exhaust plume. That's not "blow-by"! Blow-by is the trace smoke coming from the rubber vent pipe on the valve cover.

Even burning very small amounts of water/coolant can result in significant damage to the cylinder head, valves and piston. If the leak becomes big enough the engine could "water lock" and break the piston, a rod and/or the crankshaft. That's a "catastrophic" failure and could mean you sell your tractor for scrap value!

Figure out where the leak is coming from and go from there - IMO.

Good luck.

AKfish

Yes I would like to know where its coming from too. My first guess would be head gasket and that not too hard to do.

 

[TomSeller]

I agree with AKfish.

1. Blowby is combustion gases from the top of the piston into the rest of the engine and gases and a little smoke comes out the vent tube on the side of the engine.
2. Coolant leaking into the combustion chamber produces white smoke out the exhaust pipe.
3. Coolant leaking into the engine oil results in gunk such as your picture and the green droplets you describe. Oil turns grey.

Which of these do you have? Or are you seeing something else? More info the better.

 

[cartod]

I agree with AKfish.

1. Blowby is combustion gases from the top of the piston into the rest of the engine and gases and a little smoke comes out the vent tube on the side of the engine.
2. Coolant leaking into the combustion chamber produces white smoke out the exhaust pipe.
3. Coolant leaking into the engine oil results in gunk such as your picture and the green droplets you describe. Oil turns grey.

Which of these do you have? Or are you seeing something else? More info the better.

I have all of the above!

 

[TomSeller]

I have all of the above!

Given what you indicated about your experience, I would take it to a trusted mechanic and get it fixed right. I am guessing $2000 to $2500. Curious what others think. Those are very nice tractors and a few K bucks is cheap compared to a new tractor.

 

[Tx Jim]

I think you have typical indication that your tractor has cylinder liner cavatation from previous owners not changing coolant often enough.I'd recommend pulling engine pan then pressurize radiator and look for antifreeze droplets exiting cyl liners. PS antifreeze is very detrimental to rod & main brgs on crankshaft.

 

[navistar505]

I think you have typical indication that your tractor has cylinder liner cavatation from previous owners not changing coolant often enough.I'd recommend pulling engine pan then pressurize radiator and look for antifreeze droplets exiting cyl liners. PS antifreeze is very detrimental to rod & main brgs on crankshaft.

This is what I would do.
Plus in my opinion if you end up doing the head gasket I would look into a full rebuild and clean the whole block out to get all the sludge out. or at least main and rod bearings. The lower end of the motor is the easier part of the project so if the head is off your more than half way there. Its really not as big of a project as you think

 

[4020deereboy]

Yes tex you are right. Sludge indicates liner and or o-ring failure. Good oils and engine temp. can take care of condensation and water but antifreeze turns to sludge plugs everything. and ruins cranks.

 

[Ken]

I think you have typical indication that your tractor has cylinder liner cavatation from previous owners not changing coolant often enough.I'd recommend pulling engine pan then pressurize radiator and look for antifreeze droplets exiting cyl liners. PS antifreeze is very detrimental to rod & main brgs on crankshaft.

Tx Jim I'm in agreement with you. Have a brother that runs a Farmall"B" clean and seldom burns a pint of gas at one running. Called me that has water in oil not sludge drains water before using . told him this is a probably 0 ring in liner and to not run until locate what is wrong. Didn't believe me because he takes care if the tractor,
Any way went to where he lives pulled pan and #3 liner was dripping. took off the head and pulled liner it was cracked and pitted looked like cavitation in a pump . inside water chamber was enough crud sludge to be able to scoop out by hand .so removed all liners and purchased new bearings and pistons rings and liners for less than 350.00 . engine now runs better than he can remember. All this to replace was less than 4 hours of work.
Told him either work the engine or sell and hire some one to putter around his yard.
Doubt he will do either.
ken