The conversation IS about the light diesel market in CUT and light highway vehicles.
Still no response form you about the extra cost of the diesel option.
Still no response from you about the cost of keeping a Tier IV diesel operating after warranty runs out.
Why do you keep bringing up diesel vs gasoline 20,30,40,50 years ago? Those non emission diesel engines, those carburated gasoline engines and the diesel vs gasoline prices are all long in the past never to return. Talking 2015 here.
Run the CUT on a DI gasser with the cheaper fuel per BTU vs diesel. The gasser is going to come out ahead with lower fuel costs, lower purchase price and lower service costs.
The DI gas with adjustable cam timing at part load drops the effective compression ratio to 3 or 4 to 1 but still keep the expansion ratio of up to 12 to 1. No un-used air being pumped through the combustion chamber as the diesel does at part load, cooling the combustion process and dropping the combustion chamber pressure. Power and efficiency on the crankshaft is the pressure difference between the compression stroke and the power stroke..
Ever notice the price of an ATV or RTV increases with the diesel option over gasoline version in the light duty market? Why is the gasoline engine cheaper and the diesle more $$$?
As long as HD operators are forced to use diesel. The price of ULSD won't drop below gasoline. The oil companies don't mid selling over priced ULSD to light duty operators if they will pay for it. Cause I'm gettin me self a diesel by gum cus thar better.
Wrong (again)....you're the one adding in the whole "light duty" nonsense. We're talking about engines in tractors. Just because you think a CUT isn't worked hard doesn't make that reality.
I've already addressed all the things you say I haven't addressed, but I'm not surprised you've missed them...you're missing a lot.
I do find it funny you don't realize that a big part of why the diesel option for cars like the Cruz cost more is that so few of them are purchased. As Americans get more familiar with diesels, and buy more of the, that will lower the price per unit, but they have to start somewhere.
Still, if I was buying a Cruz tomorrow, I'd get the one with the diesel because it would perform better...even if it costs a bit more to operate. Some folks like performance and are willing to pay for it, even if a lower performing gasser that gets worse fuel economy is less expensive to purchase. I keep cars/trucks for a long, long time, so a couple of grand difference in purchase price doesn't matter to me if it's something I'll be happier with. If it saves me fuel costs in the long run, that's great...I'll find out in a couple hundred thousand miles.
I haven't brought up old diesel engines, or old gasser engines....only talked about the most modern of both. Remember how many times I've said the most efficient gassers max out at around 35% thermal efficiency and the most efficient diesels at 50% thermal efficiency? Those are the newest, not something old....but you missed that, right?
Your entire argument revolves around one thing you can't change....right now diesel costs more than gas In fact, I noted the station I passed tonight had regular gas at $2.11 and diesel at $2.69, since you asked about actual prices. That price reversal only happened when refineries were forced to spend a whole bunch of money to convert to ULSD. That cash outlay will be paid off before long, and diesel will go back to being less expensive than gasoline, just like it has in the rest of the world.
HD operators aren't "forced" to used diesel, they use it because it's the best tool for the job. Further, in the rest of the world the price of ULSD is lower than that of gasoline because they've already paid off the expenses required to make that change (years ago in most of the world). We're not any different, just a few years behind them. Again, you're arguing that they won't lower the price because they don't have to, but we've seen that isn't the case with the recent huge drops in the price of gasoline...and it's the same companies involved. By your theory, we'd still be paying $3.74/gal for gasoline, but we're not....bad theory it seems.
It's actually pretty funny watching you try to talk about how superior gas engines are, but you can't change the mechanics of when the pressure peaks relative to the crankshaft position, and it doesn't favor gassers. Nothing you do to a gas engine will change that. Sure, you can put a gasser in a tractor, and you'll have to make it a really big one to even come close to what a far smaller diesel will do when it comes to actual work, but that will kill any fuel economy savings you were trying to take advantage of.
If tractor manufacturers could make a case for making more money by building gasser CUTS or SCUTS they would have already done so....hasn't happened, and isn't likely to do so. You really don't think they studied the concept when faced with increasingly difficult emissions standards??? Nah, there's NO way that would have ever crossed their minds. :confused2:
