Strongest Korean brand

[GManBart]

I do not understand the huge price differences in the mark up. When all of the tractors are all imports. With pretty much the same cost to build and offer more standard features than the same big name tractor.

I don't understand all of it, for sure, but I think there have to be some pretty obvious differences.

It seems Deere is only importing a few of their machines now, and a few are made at their factories overseas, which sort of changes things for them.

Then you have tractors made in India, Japan, and Korea. Tractors made in Japan are going to have a higher cost to build since Japanese companies have much higher operating costs than the other two (higher wages, and much higher costs to own land/factories). For that reason, the Japanese tractors should cost more for the same machine.

I don't know about operating costs in India versus Korea, but I do think the Korean companies are pushing harder to gain market share, where Mahindra already has the most global sales. For that reason, I think the Korean companies are likely operating on smaller margins and keeping their prices lower, somewhat artificially, which is why their prices beat everybody else's.

This is also what Korean car companies have done...and it's no coincidence that LS is a spinoff of LG with roots in Hyundai. I remember when a friend who lived in another state told me he just bought a Hyundai. I said "what is a Hyundai?" I didn't even know it was a car brand, and I'm a car guy! Now they sell $75K cars....I think we're going to see that happen with the Korean tractor companies to some degree, where their prices go up on the top models to compete with all the other brands.

 

[k0ua]

I didn't know that Kioti used a rocker pedal. My Kioti NX series uses side-by-side pedals, which I like because it doesn't require shifting my leg position.

The CK series uses the single rocker pedal, similar to a Kubota Standard L series. Of course all of the DK series and now the new NX series use the 2 pedal side by side system.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

The CK series uses the single rocker pedal, similar to a Kubota Standard L series. Of course all of the DK series and now the new NX series use the 2 pedal side by side system.

One of my take-aways from visiting Lano Equipment and looking at the Kubota L6060 HST was that I really did not like the rocker pedal.

 

[bajabum]

I have a Branson 2400H, and so far, It's a good'un!

I live right in the middle of 4 Branson dealers, all about 150 miles away...

My local Mahindra dealer (8 miles away) says he'd be happy to do NON-warranty work, but parts might take awhile.

 

[TomSeller]

I have a Branson 2400H, and so far, It's a good'un!

I live right in the middle of 4 Branson dealers, all about 150 miles away...

My local Mahindra dealer (8 miles away) says he'd be happy to do NON-warranty work, but parts might take awhile.

There are Branson owners on here that say Branson parts are pretty quick to get.

 

[k0ua]

Here is my take on rocker vs side by side pedals. It doesn't make any difference, you get used to either one, and they both work just fine. In a day or two I acclimated to the switch, and i love the side by side now, and I loved the rocker pedal. The secret to making fine movements with the rocker pedal is to place your foot flat on top of the pedal for all fine precise movements and rock your ankle. When you are transporting longer distances at higher speeds, then shift your foot to drop your heel on the floor and toe on the pedal extension. And when going longer distances and higher speeds in reverse drop your toes to the floor and mash the pedal back with your heel. All other back and forth and precise movements then foot flat on the pedal and do the rocky rocky thing. I could go back to a rocker pedal easily in a day or two of operation even though my two pedal response is so intuitive now. Guys it just doesn't matter even though it seems awkward when you are just testing a tractor at a dealers lot.

 

[Poopdeck Pappy]

+1. For a while now, I've been saying that either one is pretty easy to get used to. I have a side-by-side on my Kioti, and a rocker pedal on my BX23. I switch between them all the time and have no issues.

If I had to pick only one type and live with it for the rest of my entire life, I'd probably go with the side-by-side. But when I pick my next tractor, rocker vs. side-by-side won't be a major factor in the decision making process.

Here is my take on rocker vs side by side pedals. It doesn't make any difference, you get used to either one, and they both work just fine. In a day or two I acclimated to the switch, and i love the side by side now, and I loved the rocker pedal. The secret to making fine movements with the rocker pedal is to place your foot flat on top of the pedal for all fine precise movements and rock your ankle. When you are transporting longer distances at higher speeds, then shift your foot to drop your heel on the floor and toe on the pedal extension. And when going longer distances and higher speeds in reverse drop your toes to the floor and mash the pedal back with your heel. All other back and forth and precise movements then foot flat on the pedal and do the rocky rocky thing. I could go back to a rocker pedal easily in a day or two of operation even though my two pedal response is so intuitive now. Guys it just doesn't matter even though it seems awkward when you are just testing a tractor at a dealers lot.

 

[aczlan]

Here is my take on rocker vs side by side pedals. It doesn't make any difference, you get used to either one, and they both work just fine. In a day or two I acclimated to the switch, and i love the side by side now, and I loved the rocker pedal. The secret to making fine movements with the rocker pedal is to place your foot flat on top of the pedal for all fine precise movements and rock your ankle. When you are transporting longer distances at higher speeds, then shift your foot to drop your heel on the floor and toe on the pedal extension. And when going longer distances and higher speeds in reverse drop your toes to the floor and mash the pedal back with your heel. All other back and forth and precise movements then foot flat on the pedal and do the rocky rocky thing. I could go back to a rocker pedal easily in a day or two of operation even though my two pedal response is so intuitive now. Guys it just doesn't matter even though it seems awkward when you are just testing a tractor at a dealers lot.

I have used side by side pedals (on a Cub Cadet 3000 series GT) and I was always mixing up the forward and reverse pedals. Much easier (for me) to keep track of where my foot is on a rocker pedal.

Aaron Z

 

[paulfun9]

One of my take-aways from visiting Lano Equipment and looking at the Kubota L6060 HST was that I really did not like the rocker pedal.

Ditto on the rocker not being a comfortable set up! I actually have no problem operating them but after a few min of operation my knee starts to hurt! Why bother trying to get used to something thats simply never going to be as good as the 2 pedal system. Even my other half didn't like the rocker set ups at all and she dosnt have any problems with her knees. Simply put why bother putting up with or having to get used to something you don't like when you can simply buy something with a better set up from the get go?

 

[MtnViewRanch]

One of my take-aways from visiting Lano Equipment and looking at the Kubota L6060 HST was that I really did not like the rocker pedal.

Ditto on the rocker not being a comfortable set up! I actually have no problem operating them but after a few min of operation my knee starts to hurt! Why bother trying to get used to something thats simply never going to be as good as the 2 pedal system. Even my other half didn't like the rocker set ups at all and she dosnt have any problems with her knees. Simply put why bother putting up with or having to get used to something you don't like when you can simply buy something with a better set up (for you) from the get go?

Couldn't be said any better than that.

I would also like to add that the various 2 pedal or rocker pedal systems were not the problem for me when I was looking, just the CK rocker pedal. Everything does not fit everyone, that's why there are various choices available. I am a firm believer in why adapt when what I like is available for the same cost.

Just my :2cents:

 

[k0ua]

I guess I am just too adaptable

 

[Katahdin]

I
Then you have tractors made in India, Japan, and Korea. Tractors made in Japan are going to have a higher cost to build since Japanese companies have much higher operating costs than the other two (higher wages, and much higher costs to own land/factories). For that reason, the Japanese tractors should cost more for the same machine.

Korean companies aren't making the whole tractor. Take a look at this customer list that demonstrates Yanmar (japanese-made) drivetrain components are going into Kioti and Mahindra tractors.

Major Customers | About Us | Kanzaki Kokyukoki Mfg. Co., Ltd.
(Kanzaki is a Yanmar subsidiary)

TYMs are now using Yanmar engines as well.

Some of the Kioti engines are obvious copies of the Kubota engines. (look at the bore and stroke specs)

These are signs of weakness, IMHO. The Korean brands are assembling tractors, not engineering and manufacturing the whole kit and kaboodle like Japanese brands such as Kubota and Yanmar.

 

[jaydee325]

Korean companies aren't making the whole tractor. Take a look at this customer list that demonstrates Yanmar (japanese-made) drivetrain components are going into Kioti and Mahindra tractors.

Look at customer lists on websites with a grain of salt!

I've worked in the nuclear industry for over 30 years and still see the company I work for listed on vendor websites even though we have not done business with them for years.

 

[Katahdin]

Look at customer lists on websites with a grain of salt!

I've worked in the nuclear industry for over 30 years and still see the company I work for listed on vendor websites even though we have not done business with them for years.

Ok Bud, follow this link to a Kioti HST service manual and post back if it changes your mind.

www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kioti-owning-operating/321997-ex35-ex40-ex45-ex50-hst.html

 

[GManBart]

Korean companies aren't making the whole tractor. Take a look at this customer list that demonstrates Yanmar (japanese-made) drivetrain components are going into Kioti and Mahindra tractors.

Major Customers | About Us | Kanzaki Kokyukoki Mfg. Co., Ltd.
(Kanzaki is a Yanmar subsidiary)

TYMs are now using Yanmar engines as well.

Some of the Kioti engines are obvious copies of the Kubota engines. (look at the bore and stroke specs)

These are signs of weakness, IMHO. The Korean brands are assembling tractors, not engineering and manufacturing the whole kit and kaboodle like Japanese brands such as Kubota and Yanmar.

Where did you get that engine information? It seems very dated. If you go look at the current line of Kioti machines, the engines bear no resemblance, to Kubota engines. The current NX line of CUTs all use 1.8L turbocharged engines. Kubota's engines with similar horsepower are around 2.4L....no similarity. In the smaller machines the sizes are closer, but there are only so many configurations you can come up with in a 1.3L (or similar sized) engine for a tractor.

It's funny that you suggest using Yanmar engines in other brands makes them less of a tractor manufacturer, and more of a tractor assembler. Deere has done that for years, and nobody suggests they just assemble tractors.

TYM, LS and Kioti are all engineering, and building their own tractors. Suggesting otherwise is silly, and makes it look like folks are just trying to justify their brand of choice.

In some models Korean brands have used engines from other companies, but that's pretty accepted practice throughout the industry. Further, most companies are sub-contracting many parts of their machines to companies that specialize....nobody makes their own glass anymore, or rubber hoses, or tires, etc, etc, the way Ford built everything on site 100 years ago. How many companies make their own loaders, or hydraulic cylinders, or transmissions now? Not many.

 

[GManBart]

Ok Bud, follow this link to a Kioti HST service manual and post back if it changes your mind.

www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kioti-owning-operating/321997-ex35-ex40-ex45-ex50-hst.html

Big deal....Yanmar sources some of their mini-excavators from Kobelco. Very few companies make all of the machines they sell, and nobody makes all of the parts that go into their machines.

The newest agreement I've seen:

http://www.kobelco-usa.com/sites/ko...Kobelco expands OEM agreement with Yanmar.pdf

 

[TomSeller]

Where did you get that information? It seems very dated..

It says 2012 at the bottom

 

[GManBart]

It says 2012 at the bottom

I should have been more clear. I was asking about the comments he made about Kioti engines and Kubota engines, not the Yanmar major customer link.

 

[paulfun9]

Yes I should have put that (for You) in my post as that is the bottom line what you feel is the best for you. Funny thing is I felt the CK pedal was the worst of them as well.

 

[Katahdin]

Compare the Kubota and Kioti tractor/engine models that have a 83mm bore and a stroke of 92.4mm.

On the Kioti side I'm talking about the 4A200LWH engine found in the DK40. There may be others, I'm just picking this one.

This engine has the same bore and stroke as the engines found in the Kubota L 3200, 3800, and 4600s

That's the same engine displacement and internal piston movement down to a 10th of a millimeter, there can be no accidental coincidence of same internal combustion engineering.

Honestly I don't know which company or country came up with the bore and stroke first. You could say Kubota copied Kioti and I have no evidence to back it up, but lets be real, there is Japanese engineering and drivetrain components in most of these Korean brand tractors, and Japanese companies like Yanmar, Mitsubishi, and probably others are profiting from it. I'm did not say outsourcing drivetrain components to Japan makes a Korean tractor less of a tractor, but it does it play into the bigger picture when comparing brands and reading claims in threads like these that Korean tractors are built as good as Japanese brands and are cheaper to buy to boot.