Your Thoughts on Cutting this Tree

[hunterridgefarm]

I have cut a lot of trees but wanted to get another opinion on this one.

A few weeks ago I have this large oak split at the forks and fall across the secondary road I use to get to my field with the truck. I have another access I use with the tractor and mule.

When the tree fell the top rested on a tall bank to the right, out of view in the picture. The lowest point where it was still attached to the tree was about 5' with the top about 8-9' off the ground. I was able to take a few large limbs off and cut the fork free from the main tree, then cut a few logs off. I was a little concerned about which way the fork would fall but it all worked out and I was extra careful, considering the size of the fork. The 20 bar on the Sthil would only reach about 3/4 of the way through. Gonna be fun splitting this up.

My question concerns the part still standing. You can see where the split happened and it took half or more of the total diameter of the tree. The lowest point where the fork split is about 4.5 off the ground and behind the tree is about a 10-12 drop off to a creek. The tree leans towards the drop off but I am going to try and drop it on the road bed.

The split is what concerns me. With the weight of the tree leaning and half the diameter missing I don't think I can cut the area that is split without the cut causing the tree to split or twist and splinter, if you follow me. The part below the split is around 40" across which will require notching from both sides, which will be difficult due to the drop off.

And I cannot cut at the split area without standing on something.

What is the best way to attack this?

 

[Tractor Seabee]

A cable and snatch block plus that crawler in your picture and you should be able to drop it in line with where ever you have a deadman point for the snatch block.

Ron

 

[square1]

Had a couple similar situations. I dropped them where they wanted to go and pulled them out of the creek with the tractor (or in your case up & out of the drop off). I certainly wouldn't cut up in the split for the reasons you already mentioned.

After notching, plunge cut & bore out the center leaving a hinge and trigger. Then cut the trigger & watch her go.

 

[Cord]

What you could try is preloading the tree with a rope that is strong but will stretch. A bungee if you will. Take your time and get the line as high as possible so you have maximum leverage. Next, make a shallow birds mouth cut on the uphill side. Now tension the line with a tractor that far enough away that the tree won't reach it. The idea is to start to pull the tree in the direction you want it to go. Pull as hard as you can. Here is the trick part: make a plunge cut with your saw a couple of inches away from the back cut. Bring your saw towards the back cut taking the time to make it parallel. Stop this cut about 1" from the birds mouth so you don't pinch your saw. This will become the hinge. Now with the saw WFO, cut in the opposite direction and out the side of the tree. This will release all the tension at once and hopefully give the tree enough inertia so it will swing in the correct direction.

With that much lean, I don't think you'll get the tree to fall towards you (in the picture), but maybe you can get it to swing to the right and land next to the tree line. Be careful because these leaners can barber chair.

This video parallels what I was trying to say, but I like the use of the wedges to stabilize the tree when the back cut is made. I would have tied the line higher in the tree so there was more leverage. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_z9Lkw8sbI

 

[Coyote machine]

I'd fill in the area around where the stalk could be flush with the road with fill or the cut sections to give you a place to cut from, and then cut it and let it fall the way it's leaning and wants to fall. Where it split is rotten, (blackish color of remaining stalk), and the mass of what's left wants to go to the creek, NOT where you want to force it to go.
You can cut up the fallen stalk after dropping it down the hill and winch the pieces. That stalk is too risky and too much mass, too high off the ground to try and force it to go where you want it. You want to be safe, then read the tree's position and act accordingly.

 

[hunterridgefarm]

Well the dozer I no loner have access to.

But you guys are thinking alone the same lines as I was. My biggest concern was the "barber chair" split. I will cut as low to the ground as I can with the birds mouth and do the plunge cut, I have done this before.

I am afraid to rope and pull simply because of the way the fork split off. I think the pressure would cause it to split in half. I'll stay low and use much caution.

 

[CobyRupert]

When pulling on a tree, you run the risk of it barber-chairing if you put too much tension on it. A plunge cut with a holding strap can help this. Also consider wrapping a chain around the trunk above where you're cutting so if it does barber chair it doesn't vertically split & open up above your head.
Use wedges, cut strap then run and pull like ****.

 

[square1]

But you guys are thinking alone the same lines as I was. My biggest concern was the "barber chair" split.

I am afraid to rope and pull simply because of the way the fork split off. I think the pressure would cause it to split in half.

Great minds think alike, and some times so do ours
Stay safe!

 

[hunterridgefarm]

When pulling on a tree, you run the risk of it barber-chairing if you put too much tension on it. A plunge cut with a holding strap can help this. Also consider wrapping a chain around the trunk above where you're cutting so if it does barber chair it doesn't vertically split & open up above your head.
Use wedges, cut strap then run and pull like ****.

I hadn't thought about wrapping the trunk with a chain:thumbsup:. I have done that on some trees in the past but it did not enter my mind this time.

I have about two days of cutting and splitting the part that fell so hopefully I can get this one down in the next couple of weeks. I have some time off this week but would like to hunt a few days...seems like all I ever do is work!

 

[ksluy]

I think your on track square1 I would rather chance getting off the drop off than having it bow split with my saw on it.

Had a couple similar situations. I dropped them where they wanted to go and pulled them out of the creek with the tractor (or in your case up & out of the drop off). I certainly wouldn't cut up in the split for the reasons you already mentioned.

After notching, plunge cut & bore out the center leaving a hinge and trigger. Then cut the trigger & watch her go.

 

[s219]

Cut it below the split area, but no need to go super low. Google "Coos Bay Cut" for a suggestion, or see this old post of mine:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/235723-skidding-logs-7.html

Scroll down to #64 for a sketch and some notes.

I always use that cut in barber chair scenarios, and it works like a charm every time. Much easier/safer than plunge cuts, and doable with small bars.

 

[Mace Canute]

Or...you could use a binary explosive such as Tannerite.

 

[TomSeller]

I guess I am not seeing why I would bother with it unless you want the wood. The other half fell to the road, what would this half fall on?

 

[CobyRupert]

Cut it below the split area, but no need to go super low. Google "Coos Bay Cut" for a suggestion, or see this old post of mine:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/235723-skidding-logs-7.html

Scroll down to #64 for a sketch and some notes.

I always use that cut in barber chair scenarios, and it works like a charm every time. Much easier/safer than plunge cuts, and doable with small bars.

I see how a Coos Bay might make it easier to control the release when you do the back cut, but I don't see how doing a back cut (Step 4) from outside the tree, towards the hinge eliminates barber chair.
Without a holding strap on the outside edge of the trunk, farthest from the hinge, it would seem the tree is in danger of barber chairing.

 

[Gary Fowler]

I have cut a lot of trees but wanted to get another opinion on this one.

A few weeks ago I have this large oak split at the forks and fall across the secondary road I use to get to my field with the truck. I have another access I use with the tractor and mule.

When the tree fell the top rested on a tall bank to the right, out of view in the picture. The lowest point where it was still attached to the tree was about 5' with the top about 8-9' off the ground. I was able to take a few large limbs off and cut the fork free from the main tree, then cut a few logs off. I was a little concerned about which way the fork would fall but it all worked out and I was extra careful, considering the size of the fork. The 20 bar on the Sthil would only reach about 3/4 of the way through. Gonna be fun splitting this up.

My question concerns the part still standing. You can see where the split happened and it took half or more of the total diameter of the tree. The lowest point where the fork split is about 4.5 off the ground and behind the tree is about a 10-12 drop off to a creek. The tree leans towards the drop off but I am going to try and drop it on the road bed.

The split is what concerns me. With the weight of the tree leaning and half the diameter missing I don't think I can cut the area that is split without the cut causing the tree to split or twist and splinter, if you follow me. The part below the split is around 40" across which will require notching from both sides, which will be difficult due to the drop off.

And I cannot cut at the split area without standing on something.

What is the best way to attack this?

Cut it close to the ground and I don't think it would split. I would plan to let it fall in natural direction of lean though. Then cut it to what ever lengths needed to pull the pieces up onto the road. A large CUT might pull the whole thing out at once if you had a skid pan under it.

 

[cqaigy2]

Regardless of your method, make sure you have a very clear path of escape. Watch that tree closely and if it starts to looks the least bit spooky. You might want to think about putting a strong slack line up high, in case you don't get it all the way down. You might need to finish the job by yanking things down the rest of the way.

 

[DT86]

Or...you could use a binary explosive such as Tannerite.

There it is, problem solved! :thumbsup:

 

[rd_macgregor]

I guess I am not seeing why I would bother with it unless you want the wood. The other half fell to the road, what would this half fall on?

Actually, this was my first thought, too. If it isn't a hazard or nuisance (eg. blocking the road), would it hurt anything to leave it standing?

 

[CobyRupert]

Cut it close to the ground and I don't think it would split. I would plan to let it fall in natural direction of lean though. Then cut it to what ever lengths needed to pull the pieces up onto the road. A large CUT might pull the whole thing out at once if you had a skid pan under it.

Seems like the trees tendency to split (barber chair) is a function of how much side tension (lean or rope pull) there is versus the adhesion strength between vertical grains of the tree. Perhaps I wrong, but I don't see where how it's dependent on whether you cut it high or low, other than if you cut it low it would give the top of the tree more leverage to split the grain.

 

[hunterridgefarm]

I don't think I will have much of an issue cutting the tree. I will get some more pictures this weekend and post next week to show all the angles, and the drop off behind the tree.

As far as not cutting it down...that's not an option for several reasons. I don't like hazards hanging over my head and the creek/spring this would fall in the direction of is one we pump water out of in the spring and store in a 1200 gal container for use in the greenhouse. So it is too close for comfort.

Also depending on the wind it could fall close to the road that I use often. The part that broke off showed no signs of disease and broke off early one morning no wind. I just felt lucky it did not fall while I was driving under it.