Problems with Trespassers

Creamer · Jun 17, 2013

I would go one step farther. Put up a big sign that basically states that this is private property and any use thereof constitutes agreement to the usage fees below. List the usage fees below. (There are detailed signs on the internet regarding this issue.) Make sure the usage fee is large - minimum $5k per person - so that it is worth going after. Then set up a trail camera in a hidden location that will record any activity near the sign. Now when you pursue your civil matter in court you will get compensated for your efforts.

One very important detail - make sure the sign is far enough on your property that there is no way they can tear down the sign without being on your property, i.e. ten feet or so from the line. You want to be very sure they are on your property when they destroy the sign as I am sure they will.

This is legal and there is legal precedent for it as long as they are over 18, i.e. legal consenting adult.

greasemonkeyok · Jun 18, 2013

Creamer said:
I would go one step farther. Put up a big sign that basically states that this is private property and any use thereof constitutes agreement to the usage fees below. List the usage fees below. (There are detailed signs on the internet regarding this issue.) Make sure the usage fee is large - minimum $5k per person - so that it is worth going after. Then set up a trail camera in a hidden location that will record any activity near the sign. Now when you pursue your civil matter in court you will get compensated for your efforts.

One very important detail - make sure the sign is far enough on your property that there is no way they can tear down the sign without being on your property, i.e. ten feet or so from the line. You want to be very sure they are on your property when they destroy the sign as I am sure they will.

This is legal and there is legal precedent for it as long as they are over 18, i.e. legal consenting adult.

Interesting concept. Have thought about using that approach myself in Oklahoma. Can you point us to the legal precedent?

greasemonkeyok · Jun 18, 2013

mikehaugen said:
The fact that he can't at least arrest someone is bull crap. Back in my younger days, I was in a bar and I guess I got a little mad at someone. I started going after them and 4 people drug me outside. When the cops arrived they asked the guy that I supposedly "threatened" if he wanted to press charges. Of course he said "yes" and I got hauled off ....

Hate to disillusion your idea of what a citizen's arrest is, but that wasn't one.

The officer arrested you on the complaint of the "victim". I would venture a guess that the "victim" had to sign a complaint, either at the scene or at the station.

Midniteoyl · Jun 18, 2013

How To Perform A Citizen’s Arrest, And Why You Really Shouldn’t | Stuff You Should Know

MotorSeven · Jun 18, 2013

It depends on the state, most misdemeanors not committed in an Officers presence are not arrest-able. The victim must first file a Police report, then go to the State Attorneys Office and file battery charges. The S/A will review the case and decide whether or not to prosecute, if so, then the bad guy is served with a arrest warrant or subpoena to show up in court. Once in court both parties & witnesses testify and a judge/jury decide. I don't know the law in KY, but it would be a good idea to research this and be informed. That way if the Deputy is hesitant to act, letting him/her know that you are aware of the law might make a difference.

MotorSeven · Jun 18, 2013

Primogeniture....I had to look that one up. For the rest of you............:

Primogeniture is the right, by law or custom, of the firstborn son to inherit the entire estate, to the exclusion of younger siblings (compare to ultimogeniture). Historically, the term implied male primogeniture, to the exclusion of females. In the absence of children, inheritance passed to collateral relatives, in order of seniority of their lines of descent. The eligible descendants of deceased elder siblings take precedence over living younger siblings, such that inheritance is settled in the manner of a depth-first search.
The principle has applied in history to inheritance of real property (land) and inherited titles and offices, most notably monarchies, continuing until modified or abolished .
Variations on primogeniture modify the right of the first-born son to the entirety of a family's inheritance (see appanage) or, in the West since World War II with the wider promotion of feminism, eliminate the preference for male over female siblings. Six monarchies in Europe have eliminated male preference: Sweden, Norway, Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark and Luxembourg. The type of marriage prevalent in each culture plays a crucial role in the adoption of differing primogenitures.

mikehaugen · Jun 18, 2013

greasemonkeyok said:
Hate to disillusion your idea of what a citizen's arrest is, but that wasn't one.

The officer arrested you on the complaint of the "victim". I would venture a guess that the "victim" had to sign a complaint, either at the scene or at the station.

I was not referring to a citizen's arrest, I was talking about the responding officer making an arrest at the beginning of all of this.

DB Pilot · Jun 26, 2013

Thought it was interesting to note the number of posts and views this topic has produced. Really shows the disrespect to the land owner by so many trespassers across this country. Calling the landowner selfish is a cr**head argument

. People have a RIGHT to privacy that brings about happiness after a long day in the rat race. The landowner who takes care of his property or has a hay field to maintain doesn't need picnickers leaving paper, styrofoam plastic and cans on the property. We don't need ATVers making new twotracks where they want and doing donuts so that years later it isn't worth very much because the land is just an old eroded out weed field. And don't forget the fishing they like in your stocked pond.
Seems to be a trespasser underground that when one gets on your property he is obligated to tell all his friends and family "go here because that guy doesn't care". Make it cost the trespasser money. That is what he is doing to you in time, fuel, property value, TAXES and work to repair grounds and put up posted signs.
And finally SHAME on the Legal system that takes this problem so lightly. try talking yourself out of a parking ticket by saying "I just needed to stop there for a little while". Maybe I will go over to the judges house and have a picnic on his front lawn. When the LEO shows up I can just say "the property is not posted correctly"!!!!

unch:

Well it has stopped raining here so I have to go and take care of some grapes that come October the trespassers like to pick. :irked:

Robert_in_NY · Jun 26, 2013

DB Pilot said:
Thought it was interesting to note the number of posts and views this topic has produced. Really shows the disrespect to the land owner by so many trespassers across this country. Calling the landowner selfish is a cr**head argument . People have a RIGHT to privacy that brings about happiness after a long day in the rat race. The landowner who takes care of his property or has a hay field to maintain doesn't need picnickers leaving paper, styrofoam plastic and cans on the property. We don't need ATVers making new twotracks where they want and doing donuts so that years later it isn't worth very much because the land is just an old eroded out weed field. And don't forget the fishing they like in your stocked pond.
Seems to be a trespasser underground that when one gets on your property he is obligated to tell all his friends and family "go here because that guy doesn't care". Make it cost the trespasser money. That is what he is doing to you in time, fuel, property value, TAXES and work to repair grounds and put up posted signs.
And finally SHAME on the Legal system that takes this problem so lightly. try talking yourself out of a parking ticket by saying "I just needed to stop there for a little while". Maybe I will go over to the judges house and have a picnic on his front lawn. When the LEO shows up I can just say "the property is not posted correctly"!!!! unch:

Well it has stopped raining here so I have to go and take care of some grapes that come October the trespassers like to pick. :irked:

What grapes do you have?

I have enough acres that I wouldn't notice any missing unless one of my neighbors starts a roadside stand selling grapes when they don't own any. Then it might make me notice :-D

My view these last few days, finishing spraying the Catawbas today.

GGB · Jun 26, 2013

DB, I fall into your camp. It's amazing to me how many people expect you to "share the wealth" by trespassing, taking a few grapes or other items because "no one will miss them" or fishing out a pond they do not have permission to fish.

Then there is the liability issue-these are the same people who will be suing you if they get hurt on your property.

And you are absolutely right about the word spreading among this ilk if you don't nip it in the bud. I won't go into the detail, but I no longer will permit fishing from my pond unless I'm with the group that wants to fish. I got very tired of coming home to find people who had no permission from me fishing in my pond who claim to have had permission from a neighbor to fish MY pond. And then there was the issue of trash. I got really frustrated having to pick up trash these people left behind.

I got tired of trying to be a nice guy about it. So now it's only family and friends who ask permission. Period. End of rant.

DB Pilot · Jun 26, 2013

Hello Robert and GGB, I have 80+ acres mostly field and wooded with a few acres of grapes (growers co-op). Robert I think I have gone by your place many times. Being a local here I know people who have, every year, stopped by the side of the road and picked grapes for there homemade wine or Table. While it is true that it would not be noticed much by the owner, It is just something I wouldn't do. I know you will like this story... I sit from noon until dark Deer hunting but at 4:00pm a couple of trespassers walk right up (on my property, right past my posted signs) to ask if I've seen deer. Well that's one afternoon wasted. But my response from now on will be "I'm armed and I have a backhoe"

. My tree stand has been stolen as well as other items but the strangest was a few thousand feet of plastic tubing for tree tapping, all fittings and hangers on the maple trees, gone. Are You Kidding ME!!!! :confused2:
I'm not ranting but I am amazed at the behavior of some. And thanks to GGB for letting me know I'm not alone with these problems. When I allow anyone else on the property I state "I am talking to you and only you".

Timm250 · Jun 30, 2013

I found out on Friday that the 2 of them were served warrants for 3rd degree criminal trespass. The arraignment is set for July 8. So I guess we'll see what happens. The mom has been taking pictures of my land from the road.

J F · Jun 30, 2013

Nice. Good luck. :thumbsup:

DT86 · Jun 30, 2013

That seems like a step in the right direction.

daveshoot · Jun 30, 2013

Thanks for the update. It has been vexing just to read about. Looks like the charge only has a max penalty of $250 plus court costs, but might be a legal warning shot.

DB Pilot · Jun 30, 2013

Try to have the judge ask them "why they are taking pictures". If they get a lawyer and you lose the case don't fret about it. Remember Lawyers aren't cheap. First they will postpone because they are looking for a lawyer, then their Lawyer will ask for at least two postponements for time to familiarize himself with the case. They are hoping you will give up, DON'T. Also their Lawyer may ask you unnecessary questions. You Don't have to answer any of his questions! Saying you don't want to answer is fine "you are not the one on trial'. The arresting officer is there to help you and the judge may be trying to help you but they can't if you say the wrong thing.
If you get the chance Tell the court. Your client has proven to me that he is a real tough and dangerous guy. I don't want him or his friends and family on my property for any reason.
All my best and good luck.

wedge40 · Jun 30, 2013

daveshoot said:
Thanks for the update. It has been vexing just to read about. Looks like the charge only has a max penalty of $250 plus court costs, but might be a legal warning shot.

I wish Tim luck, but do doubt these people will understand the legal ramification, jail time maybe but $250, not so much.

Wedge

brin · Jun 30, 2013

Tim - I know you probably know this...but keep in mind these folks may just be NUTS...They make seek revenge...I would tell your attorney or the DA about the picture taking going on and try and take pics of her doing that...I would ask for a restraining order where they have to stay off your property ....I am just saying...when darkness falls you never know what evil folks will do ...Vengeance is best served cold....They may subscribe to that...:2cents:

I wish you the best with this and hate you having to go through it...

newbury · Jun 30, 2013

Tim - Glad you updated. Seems you are going in the correct manner. Please don't post to much of what YOU are doing for your side of the battle here. But please continue to inform us of the progress of your case. Sounds more interesting than Zimmerman.