Dealing with Mr. Monkeywrench--need advice

[JDgreen227]

Two months ago my wife paid $415 for a repair job at the local GM dealer that dealt with a malfunctioning coolant sensor and seal replacement, (drivability concern that triggered the check engine light) and because the repair was in a restricted area it required labor time to R&R the parts. The car is now leaking coolant atop the engine transaxle and from my careful inspection it appears to be leaking from the area they just repaired. Now, if we return the car to the dealership, how do we avoid getting screwed over and paying a second time for the work that was carelessly done the first time? I know they are going to tell us, "oh, we didn't do anything wrong, the leak might be near the area we fixed right but it's another problem".

Yeah, right. It wasn't leaking when we took it in, and according to their inspection there wasn't any leak to fix then. Any advice? Thanks.

 

[joemd11]

Take it back to them and let them see what is wrong. If they have an ounce of integrity they will stand behind the repair. Frustrating situation for sure.

 

[LD1]

Gotta talk to them first and foremost.

Just call them up. Let them know the situation and that it is leaking where (or near) what they just worked on. They may agree to look at it for no charge, and fix it for no charge if it is related to what they did. But if it really did have nothing to do with what they worked on and is just a coincidence, then do you honestly expect to not have to pay??

Wouldnt that be like taking in a car and having new tires put on, and then a week later the wheel bearing goes out??

I understand that you dont want them to feed you a line of crap and tell you it is un-related just to charge you, but in all honesty, unless you do your own work, or at least dig into this far enough to know for SURE where the leak is comming from, you are at their mercy. weather it be right or wrong.

 

[JDgreen227]

Gotta talk to them first and foremost.

Just call them up. Let them know the situation and that it is leaking where (or near) what they just worked on. They may agree to look at it for no charge, and fix it for no charge if it is related to what they did. But if it really did have nothing to do with what they worked on and is just a coincidence, then do you honestly expect to not have to pay??

Wouldnt that be like taking in a car and having new tires put on, and then a week later the wheel bearing goes out??

I understand that you dont want them to feed you a line of crap and tell you it is un-related just to charge you, but in all honesty, unless you do your own work, or at least dig into this far enough to know for SURE where the leak is comming from, you are at their mercy. weather it be right or wrong.

Should the leak be unrelated to what they recently did I have no objection to paying...but, repeat BUT....I have inspected the area carefully with excellent lighting and a small mirror and after drying off the coolant that was exposed, I observed the leak is coming the area they just fixed. Yes, I do question the honestly of the shop, dealership owned or not. I do 90% of maintenance and repairs to our vehicles for that reason.

 

[LD1]

If you are POSITIVE that it is the same thing they just fixed, call them. Tell them that whatever sensor or whatever they just did is leaking coolant. 99%of shops out there will stand behind their work. Good chance they will just ell you to bring it in and they will take care of it no charge.

IF they determine it to be something else, they are obligated to contact you before they proceed to run up a bill you did not agree to.

IE: They agree to take a look and correct the problem in the area they just worked on. They determine it to be something totally different. They will call you and say "Mr. JDgreen227, we looked at your car and determined that it is NOT part x (that we just replaced) that is leaking, rather it is part Y, totally un-related. If you would like, we can fix it for you but it will cost Z to do so. Would you like us to do that repair or not?

If you choose NOT, there should be no charge if they are a good shop. Allthough they could still charge you a minimum diagnostic fee (that they would have waived if it was their faulty work or part from prior).

I guess I just dont know what you are asking and dont know what you are wanting us to say. Call the shop, go from their.

 

[joemd11]

^^^^What he said. Don't know till you ask.

 

[JDgreen227]

If you are POSITIVE that it is the same thing they just fixed, call them. Tell them that whatever sensor or whatever they just did is leaking coolant. 99%of shops out there will stand behind their work. Good chance they will just ell you to bring it in and they will take care of it no charge.

IF they determine it to be something else, they are obligated to contact you before they proceed to run up a bill you did not agree to.

IE: They agree to take a look and correct the problem in the area they just worked on. They determine it to be something totally different. They will call you and say "Mr. JDgreen227, we looked at your car and determined that it is NOT part x (that we just replaced) that is leaking, rather it is part Y, totally un-related. If you would like, we can fix it for you but it will cost Z to do so. Would you like us to do that repair or not?

If you choose NOT, there should be no charge if they are a good shop. Allthough they could still charge you a minimum diagnostic fee (that they would have waived if it was their faulty work or part from prior).

I guess I just dont know what you are asking and dont know what you are wanting us to say. Call the shop, go from their.

Basically what I am wondering is just how I am going to know it's not the parts they just replaced UNLESS I am standing right there watching the mechanic work, which is not permitted. So easy for them to tell me "well it's not what we just fixed" when it actually is. GRRR....I hate modern cars, all the stuff crammed into the smallest possible space and you need a $10 grand machine to diagnose any problem. Which is why I love my tractor !!

 

[Rock knocker]

I once with much careful deliberation, used the threat of small claims court on a dealer. Their claim was that the extended warrenty, which they sold, did not cover the extensive replacement of a "idler assembly bolt". The warrenty clearly stated that the "idler assembly" was a covered item. They repeatedly claimed that broken bolts were not covered.

I calmly told the young women who was a service writer that we will pay for it, and then possibly seek redress in small claims court. TSHTF!

 

[Diamondpilot]

My experience is always the opposite side of good. It seems like none of the shops around here want to fix the mistake they made and instead do just what you said and blame it on another part. I fix everything myself now. If its too bad and beyond my capability I let a friend do it. Luckily my vehicles are very trouble free but we do have a BMW that seem to like to go to the shop about once every few months for something silly. Last week it was red headlights. Yes, they were glowing red???? Its covered under warranty till 100,000 miles.

In the past I had some trouble vehicles and the dealers were always a issue with the exception of the local Dodge guy. I had so much trouble with that truck I thought they were just going to give me a new one. They literally bent over backwards to make me happy. I can not say that about the others I had issues with. It took a lawyer twice to get it fixed. They are now out of business and I could not be happier. I made sure everyone I knew heard about how I was treated.

Chris

 

[JDgreen227]

I once with much careful deliberation, used the threat of small claims court on a dealer. Their claim was that the extended warrenty, which they sold, did not cover the extensive replacement of a "idler assembly bolt". The warrenty clearly stated that the "idler assembly" was a covered item. They repeatedly claimed that broken bolts were not covered.

I calmly told the young women who was a service writer that we will pay for it, and then possibly seek redress in small claims court. TSHTF!

Reminds me of the experience I had with a new 1985 LTD Crown Victoria, I purchased the extended factory warranty and when I needed the power door lock actuators (an electric motor) replaced during the period of the extended warranty the dealer tried to tell me they (actuators) were not covered and gave me a hard time about it. The warranty stated that "MAJOR PARTS OF THE ELECTRICAL SYSTEM WERE COVERED" Told my friend who was a GM engineer who said: "WTF do they mean not covered....THE ACTUATORS ARE THE LOCK...."

 

[deerehunter/operator]

As a service manager at a GM garage my only advice to you is to try and remember that not every dealership is out to get you and there are lots of honest folks working at dealerships. If you go in there with the accusations and an attitude you are going to get treated as such. If you give them a chance to remedy a situation that MIGHT be the result of poor workmanship, they may do so no problem.

 

[Diamondpilot]

My GM dealer tried to tell me that the injectors were not covered on my 9 month old 2005 Dmax. They claimed they were part of the emmisons system and that was not covered.

Chris

 

[JDgreen227]

As a service manager at a GM garage my only advice to you is to try and remember that not every dealership is out to get you and there are lots of honest folks working at dealerships. If you go in there with the accusations and an attitude you are going to get treated as such. If you give them a chance to remedy a situation that MIGHT be the result of poor workmanship, they may do so no problem.

Before retiring I was in the customer service type of work and would never come right out and accuse a shop of doing careless or sloppy work UNLESS I was positive it was their doing. Perhaps ten years ago we took one of our cars to a GM shop (not the one I have an issue with) and when my wife drove it home I found much of the work carelessly done, many missing fasteners on the firewall, loose heater hose clamps (screw type), the air filter plenum hose was permitting unfiltered air to enter the fuel injection system, and other slipshod things from a too-hurried mechanic. I took the car back the following day and gave them a REALLY hard time and they took it back in and fixed the issues and gave me a coupon for a free oil change (WOW BFD) like I would go back there again? Never did.

For what one pays for service work today it had d*** better be 100% right, problem is that 95% of the people who work on cars are in such a hurry they don't care about doing good work, all they care about is beating the flat rate time so shops make more profit.

 

[JDgreen227]

My GM dealer tried to tell me that the injectors were not covered on my 9 month old 2005 Dmax. They claimed they were part of the emmisons system and that was not covered.

Chris

WTF???!!!! Emissions systems should have a warranty as good or better than the warranty on mechanical components !!!

 

[deerehunter/operator]

If you thought that "95% of the people who work on cars are in such a hurry they dont care about doing good work" then why in the world did you take it somewhere to have it fixed. Sounds like you know more than enough to fix it yourself. Or did you think you found a mechanic that fell into your other 5%?

 

[dfkrug]

Luckily my vehicles are very trouble free but we do have a BMW that seem
to like to go to the shop about once every few months for something silly.

Oh, my condolences, Chris. Our 98 BMW M3 had all sorts of bizarre failures. Fortunately, I
was able to fix them all. The only time I dealt with the dealer was when I found a service
bulletin and tried to get them to honor it. Despite escalating it to the service manager,
I could not get it fixed, so I lived with it. :thumbdown: No more B-Ms for me.

As for emissions warranties, the Feds require major components to be covered for 8y/80K
mi on post-95 cars/light trucks. And fuel injectors are NOT emissions components.

 

[JDgreen227]

If you thought that "95% of the people who work on cars are in such a hurry they dont care about doing good work" then why in the world did you take it somewhere to have it fixed. Sounds like you know more than enough to fix it yourself. Or did you think you found a mechanic that fell into your other 5%?

BECAUSE today's cars are so (censored) complicated with electronic gizmos and doo-dads and computerized crap you need specialized diagnostic equipment to tell what makes the "check engine" light come on. For what it is worth, this was the first time since 2003 ANY of our four vehicles have gone to a shop for work, we have a 1993, a Y2K, and a pair of 2004's (all GM) and I have done all repair and maintenance work on them I possibly can. Really hard to track down a lot of what can go wrong on today's cars. The repair manuals I have for the car in question (2004 Saturn L-300) list 135 Diagnostic Trouble Codes that can be accessed by a home do it yourselfer, but here are many, many more than can only be accessed by a dealership. Frickin' inane. WHY ARE VEHICLES SO COMPLEX????

 

[kenmac]

You can buy an inexpensive scan tool. I have 1 and repair all of my vehicles using this tool

 

[JDgreen227]

You can buy an inexpensive scan tool. I have 1 and repair all of my vehicles using this tool

Thank you, but although I have such a tool, it did not register one of the 135 DTC's listed in my manual...meaning the car had to go to a repair facility.

 

[Bird]

As a service manager at a GM garage my only advice to you is to try and remember that not every dealership is out to get you and there are lots of honest folks working at dealerships. If you go in there with the accusations and an attitude you are going to get treated as such. If you give them a chance to remedy a situation that MIGHT be the result of poor workmanship, they may do so no problem.

Well said.