Ground clamp is hot

[oliver28472]

My welder is just inside an open barn. Welded fine yesterday but today after a good rain I was getting set up to weld outside again. Started getting a tingle from the ground clamp after I turned on the welder. It is an old AC welder. How can I check my receptacle to see if it is wired properly? It is a three prong, 220 volt, almost like a dryer plug.

 

[yelbike]

Take a picture of it. I'll try and help. Likely a faulty or missing ground.

 

[oliver28472]

Sorry for the crappy quality but maybe you can tell enough. I think it's suppose to be two hots and a neutral??

 

[Soundguy]

might even be insuficient ground depending on how / where wired from.. how sub panel is run.

gloves wet?

 

[oliver28472]

Not wearing any.

 

[yelbike]

I had to laugh about the gloves!!!:laughing: PPE is always good!!

Very hard to see from that picture. It looks fairly old. Grounding code/standards have changed for the better over the years. Without seeing the whole installing, its hard for me to pin point the problem.

Is there a ground wire in the cable running from the panel to the welding receptacle? If so make sure the connections are good and solid. If there is no ground, well you could change the cable, but thats of no value useless the panel is properly grounded. Is the panel grounded?

 

[yelbike]

Two hots and a neutral? Likely not, is two hots and a ground.

 

[oliver28472]

I am sure the panel WAS grounded but now that you mention that, it was slightly moved a couple years ago. I will have to check that tomorrow. As for the ground from the panel to the receptacle, don't know, will check that too. Thanks.

 

[Lawnman TX]

You are dealing with an A/C welder ... the ground is as hot as the electrode holder.

Always wear gloves:mur:

 

[lwalsh]

Lawnman is correct, the input power ground has nothing to do with welding ground. If they were common you would have a problem.

 

[Mark @ Everlast]

You are going to find that is a "hazard" of welding, especially under an open barn after it rains. Getting an tingle is not uncommon, depending upon your shoes and the moisture present in the soil. You are becoming the path to the earth from the work clamp. AC is any issue as well for the output. Sweat will do it also.

 

[undercut]

The term "ground" is used incorrectly far too often and can be misleading. As Mark states, there is a work clamp which is different than "THE Ground". If there is an electrical difference between the two and they are connected by something that can conduct - even slightly like yourself, electricity will flow. I catch myself all the time - welder work clamp, not ground clamp.

 

[oliver28472]

Thanks everyone, I didn't have time to check things out today, will try tomorrow with a cheapie meter etc. I will let you know what I find out. As some have mentioned it may not be uncommon. It did not keep me from welding but more rain did.

 

[Believer]

So is it dangerous to hold the clamp on wet ground? What is the proper method of connnecting to the workpiece?

 

[undercut]

I'm no expert so I'm hoping someone will chime in if I'm missing something or downright wrong but you ALWAYS want to ensure you are not part of the circuit and the best way of doing that is being more insulated electrically than the things around you.

Some tips:

Wear rubber soled boots.
If the ground is wet, try to put something down on the ground to stand on that won't catch fire easily but is dry.
Always handle the work clamp with welding gloves on.
Try to keep your gloves dry (if you are sweating).

 

[Soundguy]

when I have had to lay or kneel on wet ground to weld.. I always drag out my creeper. old one was wood.. now i got one of them new molded plastic ones.. love it...

 

[kentuckydiesel]

Your ground clamp is hot? That's the only issue?

If so, you have one of two problems:

1) the cable connection on the ground clamp itself is loose and/or corroded.
-To fix this, take the cable loose from the clamp (if it bolts on), clean up the contact surfaces, then put it back together. If it crimps on, just crimp it harder and/or flow some solder into the connection.

2) you simply had a bad ground to the material causing a little bit of arcing where it clamped on. (this is a non-issue, just ground to cleaner metal)

Don't worry about anything else, these are the only two things that cause a hot ground clamp.

-phillip

 

[oliver28472]

Your ground clamp is hot? That's the only issue?

If so, you have one of two problems:

1) the cable connection on the ground clamp itself is loose and/or corroded.
-To fix this, take the cable loose from the clamp (if it bolts on), clean up the contact surfaces, then put it back together. If it crimps on, just crimp it harder and/or flow some solder into the connection.

2) you simply had a bad ground to the material causing a little bit of arcing where it clamped on. (this is a non-issue, just ground to cleaner metal)

Don't worry about anything else, these are the only two things that cause a hot ground clamp.

-phillip

1) I don't think a corroded connection on the work clamp (as I now call it) could cause a shock. If that were true, when you remove the corrosion there would be a better connection between myself and the clamp, causing a bigger shock.

2) Not relevant, I was getting the tingle before I clamped to anything.

 

[bcp]

Sounds like a confusion between "electrically hot" and "temperature hot."

Bruce

 

[undercut]

Sounds like a confusion between "electrically hot" and "temperature hot."

Bruce

Aha! OK, lightbulb on. Now, that makes the past few posts so much clearer. Yes, does sound like some crossed wires (sorry for the pun). I believe the OP is talking about electrically hot as in "tingly".