Question on Buying Gold

[beppington]

I still don't understand why you wouldn't diversify: Hold some gold, some dollars, some groceries, can goods, some garden foods, water ... & sleep well at night knowing you've got all your bases covered whether your prediction of the future is right or wrong. You've done the best you can, knowing the future is as unpredictable now as always.

Why do you have to be "all in" on gold ... or on farm foods? To me that's being greedy. Or fearful. Or both.

You would all seem to be in position to vest yourselves in some of each of those categories right now, today.

 

[beppington]

I am diversified...
I brought this point up earlier, though. You can, in fact, own food, guns and gold at the same time.

Then what's being discussed here I guess is your opinion that peoples' holdings should be extremely gold-heavy due to impending doom?

 

[brin]

The gold coins I own are legal tender in the US
They have a face value stamped on them. They must be accepted if I did try to use them (face value is much less than intrinsic value, though....done on purpose by the gov't)

By the way, I also own "junk" silver...

click the link....people are, in fact, catching on.

Oregon Gas Station Accepting 90% Junk Silver as Payment | Provident Metals

Gas for "$0.20" in junk silver

I also own lots of junk silver ...We both need to keep in mind that deal at the gas station is now...but we are not saving our gold an silver for now..we are saving it for the worse imaginable...and that means folks will be desperate to have food an water, just the essentials of life, I wonder if anyone will still have use for shiny metals in a condition such as that...time will tell, I for one hope we don't have to find out.

 

[schoolsout]

Then what's being discussed here I guess is your opinion that peoples' holdings should be extremely gold-heavy due to impending doom?

I think a good portion of "savings" or an investment portfolio should contain gold, yes.

 

[schoolsout]

I also own lots of junk silver ...We both need to keep in mind that deal at the gas station is now...but we are not saving our gold an silver for now..we are saving it for the worse imaginable...and that means folks will be desperate to have food an water, just the essentials of life, I wonder if anyone will still have use for shiny metals in a condition such as that...time will tell, I for one hope we don't have to find out.

I'm not buying gold or silver expecting a complete breakdown in society. Could it happen? Anything is possible. I am protecting myself from the gov't doing all it can to devalue the dollar in order to make paying down debts easier

 

[brin]

I'm not buying gold or silver expecting a complete breakdown in society. Could it happen? Anything is possible. I am protecting myself from the gov't doing all it can to devalue the dollar in order to make paying down debts easier

I think more quantitative easing by Bernanke will create a breakdown in society...look at what folks have lost in the value of their homes and property, no interest income on their savings, prices for food etc. soaring...due to devaluation...I mean, society will only take so much of the their wealth being pillaged ...look at the Arab Spring...think it can't happen here ?

I know what you are saying and I bought my gold and saved my silver for the same reason....I am just wondering just who we will find that is willing to buy it and with what ? More fiat currency that will be worth even less 2 seconds after we sell and take it...and if we offer it for barter ..will folks not want something useful instead. ? Don't forget ..individual communities and states can and are creating their own currencies...there is no law against creating a currency..You yourself can do it...you just have to establish a value for it..put something of value behind it ...like corn, wheat, beef, water, medicine etc. Only time will tell...plus for all we know as I posted earlier ..the govt. may force us to exchange all the metals...who knows.

 

[schoolsout]

That's the thing...you don't hold fiat currency that changes value by the minute. When you do need to use paper money, you sell some gold and use that money then...Gold is just storing the value of your savings.

This guy tried to create a currency and was shut down...
Liberty Dollar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Utah is actually trying to (or has) legalize gold/silver as a currency


-------------

From the Liberty Dollar case...

The minting of Liberty dollars also appears to be in violation of 18 U.S.C. § 486:

Whoever, except as authorized by law, makes or utters or passes, or attempts to utter or pass, any coins of gold or silver or other metal, or alloys of metals, intended for use as current money, whether in the resemblance of coins of the United States or of foreign countries, or of original design, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than five years, or both.

While the US Constitution states that coins be made of gold/silver, yet they are now zinc clad or copper clad...or nickel (which is worth about what a nickel is worth)

Funny, eh?

 

[5030]

I think more quantitative easing by Bernanke will create a breakdown in society...look at what folks have lost in the value of their homes and property, no interest income on their savings, prices for food etc. soaring...due to devaluation...I mean, society will only take so much of the their wealth being pillaged ...look at the Arab Spring...think it can't happen here ?

I know what you are saying and I bought my gold and saved my silver for the same reason....I am just wondering just who we will find that is willing to buy it and with what ? More fiat currency that will be worth even less 2 seconds after we sell and take it...and if we offer it for barter ..will folks not want something useful instead. ? Don't forget ..individual communities and states can and are creating their own currencies...there is no law against creating a currency..You yourself can do it...you just have to establish a value for it..put something of value behind it ...like corn, wheat, beef, water, medicine etc. Only time will tell...plus for all we know as I posted earlier ..the govt. may force us to exchange all the metals...who knows.

Wasn't that tried in Indiana a few years back with the Ron Paul Dollar or something like that and was raided by the govermnent, assets confiscated, people incaecerated and all hushed up? All while the government mints token coins......

I'm all about the Second Amendment and the right to bear arms, all the while a segment of society is **** bent on taking them, but then there appears to be segments against just about everything today.

There is probably a segment against owning tractors, who knows.

Will be interesting how the 2012 elections play out.

I'm really on the fence and really non-partisan at this point.

I wonder if having 20 tons of structural steel makes me metals rich?

 

[schoolsout]

Wasn't that tried in Indiana a few years back with the Ron Paul Dollar or something like that and was raided by the govermnent, assets confiscated, people incaecerated and all hushed up? All while the government mints token coins......

I'm all about the Second Amendment and the right to bear arms, all the while a segment of society is **** bent on taking them, but then there appears to be segments against just about everything today.

There is probably a segment against owning tractors, who knows.

Will be interesting how the 2012 elections play out.

I'm really on the fence and really non-partisan at this point.

I wonder if having 20 tons of structural steel makes me metals rich?

See the Wiki link to Liberty Dollar

Incidentally, the guy's name is "Von Nothaus" Nuthouse? :laughing:

 

[brin]

See the Wiki link to Liberty Dollar

Incidentally, the guy's name is "Von Nothaus" Nuthouse? :laughing:

I wanted to add this about gold or silver...When everyone including the shoe shine guy is buying ..that is the time to sell...That is what Joe Kennedy said when asked how he was smart enough to sell his stock before the '29 crash...He had been getting his shoes shined when the fellow shinning his shoes gave him a stock tip and he immediately sold all his shares..otherwise he would have only had his boot legging business to fall back on.

I don't think now is the time to be adding to any gold or silver positions..with everyone doing it...smells like another bubble to me...just sayin"

 

[schoolsout]

Everyone isn't doing it
You ask 100 people on the street if they own gold and you may find 2 or 3 that say yes.

How many people own Apple? Google?

The fellow that got me started in buying gold goes by Jim Sinclair (James Sinclair) and his father was Bertram Seligman...why am I telling you this? Because BS was partners with Jesse Livermore (The greatest trader in history of Wall Street...they called him the Boy Plunger). Anyways, Sinclair is a genuine guy doing what he does (Jim Sinclair's Mineset) for free to help people hang on to what they have. He is the man in gold...read him daily and it will help you. We are nowhere near a bubble.

What you have to realize about the "high" prices of gold now is the gov't (Western World) has conspired to keep the price of gold (maybe silver, too) down. They can't hold it down any longer. Gold is pretty much where it should have been many, many years ago. Once people really start to buy it, it will go higher.

I see more people selling their gold for cash than people buying gold.

 

[forgeblast]

Western Massachusetts town starts printing its own money - DailyFinance

The Aftershock Survival Summit - YouTube

 

[JB4310]

I look at gold, platnium, silver and any precious metal like this....

It's really not worth anymore than it was 10 or 15 years ago. It's just that the dollar (and other world currencies are devaluing) so the price of precious commodities is merely keeping pace with the ever increasing worthlessness of the paper currency. The value of gold (and other precious metals) is relative to the rate of inflation/devaluing currency.

I said years back that at some point in the future, it will take a wheelbarrow full of worthless FRN's to buy a roll of toilet paper.

Wow! you guys have been busy here with this thread, good points made on both sides.
I wish I could articulate my ideas and feelings more efficiently, but it takes me half an hour to come up with 2 coherent paragraphs
I'm definitely in the pro gold camp, wish I had much more, but not confident enough to buy more at this price even though I do believe it will go much higher.
As was mentioned, when everyone (average Joe) starts talking about it, that's when a major correction could come. But as was mentioned also, that is not happening, the majority of gold is probably being snatched up by the big investors, fund managers, at these prices the average joe can't justify it, partly due to the lack of understanding what is happening in these uncharted waters.

The mention of the wheelbarrow full of currency reminds me of a teachers lesson about the weak value of the German franc at the end of WW2. A guy brought a wheelbarrow full of francs to town to buy what ever he could with it. Someone accosted him and dumped the money out and stole the wheelbarrow. That storey always stuck with me.

Come on now schoolsout....get real...what can you do with a 1 oz. gold coin right now except show it off, take it down to a coin shop and sell it or have it mounted in a frame for a necklace...give me a break..You cannot take it down to the store and expect them to accept it and give you $1,800 worth of groceries.

I strongly disagree,

If it was a wise store owner, he would take your gold in a heartbeat.

Why wouldn't he? I'm a contractor, you want to pay me in gold? Absolutely,
and you're gonna get better service than anyone else.
Sure a big box store isn't gonna know what to do with it, but any small businessman will, or should anyway.

The trick there is the small denominations, like the 1/10 OZ. coins, easier to barter with/ buy smaller quantities of what ever you need.

JB

 

[xtn]

I see more people selling their gold for cash than people buying gold.

Forgive me if I'm somehow being dense, but doesn't every transaction have a buyer and a seller? How can you see one more often than the other?

 

[5030]

Forgive me if I'm somehow being dense, but doesn't every transaction have a buyer and a seller? How can you see one more often than the other?

Not exactly. There can be multiple sellers and a lone buyer ot vice versa. .......stocks are a good example. You have one seller selling a block and multiple buyers dividing the block or the other way around.

I'm glad my avitar don't have my physical address attached.....:laughing:

I've been buying Persian Rugs as of late. Only handmade rugs in excellent condition. I like the feel of a Persian rug under my bare feet when I get out of bed in the morning. In an arcane way, I feel like I'm stepping on an Arab....lol

Interestingly, 10 years ago, the Persian rugs I buy for 300 fiat dollars were worth 30,000 dollars back then. Keep in mind that Persian rugs can't be impoorted into this country, they are banned from importation so they have become a fixed quantity, what's here is all there is.

The rugs are sort of like gold. When the supply is taken up by a select group and there are none available, the price will increase dramatically. Myself, or my children will reap the reward of the sale of now cheap rugs when they again become worth a great amount, besides, true handmade Persian rugs are works of art so unlike bullion gold, they can be viewed and admired and they make great throw rugs.......

Everything is cyclical. and everything's worth depends solely on supply versus demand.

Now, I also have a bit of gold and precious stones (another great investment because diamonds are at an all time low right now), so long as a person has the wherewithall and patience to weather the storm and of course the demeanor to protect their investement.... I do.

However, unlike gold, the government has no desire to limit the supply, other than ban importation (Persian Rugs).

 

[5030]

"If it was a wise store owner, he would take your gold in a heartbeat."
...and I disagree with your synopsis.

If it was a wise store owner that took a gold coin or coins in trade for hard goods, what avenue does he have to determine the value of the coin, other than it's face denomination which isn't a true indicator of it's worth?

Will the store owner have an accurate calibrated scale on hand to determine the actual worth at that minute (because gold fluctuates daily, if not by the hour).. I doubt it.

Legal tender aka FRN;s are much easier. We all know they aren't worth much but none of us can accurately determine what that said gold coin is actually worth other than the store owner taking it to a specialized gold exchange and cashing it in...with, I presume the customer tagging along.

It's too cumbersome for average barter. Besides, coins wear your pocket liners out from abrasion....Why everyone deals in plastic now days......

 

[schoolsout]

"If it was a wise store owner, he would take your gold in a heartbeat."
...and I disagree with your synopsis.

If it was a wise store owner that took a gold coin or coins in trade for hard goods, what avenue does he have to determine the value of the coin, other than it's face denomination which isn't a true indicator of it's worth?

Will the store owner have an accurate calibrated scale on hand to determine the actual worth at that minute (because gold fluctuates daily, if not by the hour).. I doubt it.

Legal tender aka FRN;s are much easier. We all know they aren't worth much but none of us can accurately determine what that said gold coin is actually worth other than the store owner taking it to a specialized gold exchange and cashing it in...with, I presume the customer tagging along.

It's too cumbersome for average barter. Besides, coins wear your pocket liners out from abrasion....Why everyone deals in plastic now days......

While coins can be shaved, sovereign issued gold coins are pretty reliable. It's hard to fake gold, but it can be done by sophisticated means.

 

[5030]

I have a certain undisclosed number of Credit Susse 1 ounce gold bars that if anyone tried to shave.... Well, they'd be shaving their last.......

Persian rugs are so much easier on the eye......

 

[grsthegreat]

That's just it. Gold preserves your wealth.

First ounce I ever bought was $600. I've held it for about 5 years. If I need to buy something, I sell it for $1850 and then buy what I need. The $600 you socked away in a bank account has earned you, what, $10? You have $610...I've got $1850. You do the math...

Your arguments are made of straw...

then again, if you were to have taken that 600 and bought 300 shares of ford 3 years ago..youd have had $4,200 now. your arguments are also made of straw... or better yet if you had bought Las vagas sands when it was at $4 about 3 years ago you would have $7.050.00 right now

I only quote these 2 as thats what i did with the money i had instead of buying gold......