Another weld critique plz.

[Jaylegger]

Haywires post is a great idea for a running thread, one solely for critiquing welds and advice for improvement.

Anyway, I have little to no welding experience but did weld up a small steel job last year for the blower and since have purchased a spool gun for some aluminum welding that I thought might be handy for my aluminum trailer. Haven't done anything with that yet but a buddy is modifying/adding a new leg lift system of his design for his aluminum boat lift and approached me to weld them for him. Any after much practice on some small scraps I gave it a shot but where failure of the welds could lead to potential property damage I want to run a couple photos of the welds past you guys for your thoughts. Do these welds look ok or are they destined to fail?

Each leg is about 4.5 feet tall and each of the four spacers welded to them are about 12" tall, the aluminum is 3/16" thick and welded with a Lincoln 180 on highest setting D and wire speed at around 430ipm. I decided to do the stop start method of welding as I found it easier to maintain a relatively straight run when compared to maintaining one continuously steady movement.

Thanks.

 

[k0ua]

Well I am pretty much still a novice welder, and I have never welded any Aluminum, but I am pretty impressed at how well it turned out. I think it looks great. Lets let some of the more experienced guys comment, but I like it.

James K0UA

 

[Jaylegger]

Well I am pretty much still a novice welder, and I have never welded any Aluminum, but I am pretty impressed at how well it turned out. I think it looks great. Lets let some of the more experienced guys comment, but I like it.

James K0UA

Hey thanks for that, Hopefully my buddy won't have the nicest looking weld on the bottom of the lake. I must say I really enjoy working with aluminum, just like the feel of it.

 

[Agrantina]

If I may- what kind of welder and spool gun? what wire dia?? What gas did you use? 100% argon?

AndyG

 

[Agrantina]

If I may- what kind of welder and spool gun? what wire dia?? What gas did you use? 100% argon?

AndyG

 

[Jaylegger]

If I may- what kind of welder and spool gun? what wire dia?? What gas did you use? 100% argon?

AndyG

The welder is a Lincoln 180(t) and the spool gun a Lincoln 100sg. .035 4043 wire and 100% argon.

This might be a good time to gripe about the tips included with the spool gun. The included tips were .035 to work with the spool of aluminum included but the tips were the ones used for steel. I was having a heck of time with inconsistent feed and burn backs and after some digging found the problem. Lincoln has a tip made for .035 aluminum wire which has an oversized hole which is far less likely to bind the aluminum as it expands when heated. An unbelievably stupid thing for them to include the wrong tips with the gun. Had to order in the tips from Lincoln as none of the 6 or so welding supply shops had them and instead recommended using the .045 tips that are used for steel, I opted for the tips specifically suited for aluminum though the .045 are often used for this application.

If anyone has this gun and is having problems with feed and burn backs take a look at your tip, the correct aluminum tip for .035 aluminum wire is KP2067 and that number is stamped on the tip. The incorrect tip (which again came with my 100sg gun) is KP11, which is the standard tip for the 100L gun (the one that's included with the welder).

 

[Chilly807]

Looks pretty good to me, I have limited experience with aluminum too.

Sean

 

[Jaylegger]

Looks pretty good to me, I have limited experience with aluminum too.

Sean

I appreciate the input, thanks. The best part of this endeavor is that I also am to weld those legs onto the lift but can only do this welding vertically. I've never done that before either, obviously, but appears an upside-down V pattern works well for that. I'm out of 3/16 scrap tubing to practice on too, darn.

 

[crazyal]

Just be thankful that the spool gun for your Lincoln is reasonably priced. I really wanted one for my 255 but the Lincoln gun is over $1200. They do have a lower end gun now for $700 plus $100 for an adapter. Still too rich for me so i can only dream of welding Aluminum.

 

[Jaylegger]

Just be thankful that the spool gun for your Lincoln is reasonably priced. I really wanted one for my 255 but the Lincoln gun is over $1200. They do have a lower end gun now for $700 plus $100 for an adapter. Still too rich for me so i can only dream of welding Aluminum.

You're right, thanks to Lincoln for marketing a low cost spool gun. Despite it's apparent lack of robustness, for a couple hundred it does the job.

 

[moored4]

Anyway,.... a buddy is modifying/adding a new leg lift system of his design for his aluminum boat lift ........ I gave it a shot but where failure of the welds could lead to potential property damage I want to run a couple photos of the welds past you guys for your thoughts. Do these welds look ok or are they destined to fail?

Each leg is about 4.5 feet tall and each of the four spacers welded to them are about 12" tall, the aluminum is 3/16" thick and welded with a Lincoln 180 on highest setting D and wire speed at around 430ipm. I decided to do the stop start method of welding as I found it easier to maintain a relatively straight run when compared to maintaining one continuously steady movement.

Thanks.

I do not understand where this leg goes are what it will be used for, maybe in a boat house to get a boat out of the water for storage, but with the start stop method I would question the penetration of the weld.

.

 

[Jaylegger]

I do not understand where this leg goes are what it will be used for, maybe in a boat house to get a boat out of the water for storage, but with the start stop method I would question the penetration of the weld.

.

I probably used the incorrect term, the start/stop wasn't referring to triggering, but a pausing then move forward, pause and so forth motion of the gun. The boat lift is a free standing device which you drive a boat on then raise it out of the water. something like this: The new legs are being added to accommodate a cranking system for leveling the lift.

 

[Shield Arc]

I probably used the incorrect term, the start/stop wasn't referring to triggering, but a pausing then move forward, pause and so forth motion of the gun.

Glad you posted this, I read your thread earlier this morning, but I didn't have time to reply. Here is what I just typed for you.

I've never done much aluminum Mig, haven't touched my Cobramatic in about three years. But I sure wouldn't use the "start stop" method! Years ago I worked with the best weldor I've ever seen. He got handed a job where he had to weld 10-GA to 3/4 inch think mild steel. He used the "start stop" method with Mig. This project was to be DPI, I never seen so much blood in my life. He had to cut it all apart and start over!

Dye penetrant inspection - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Jaylegger]

Glad you posted this, I read your thread earlier this morning, but I didn't have time to reply. Here is what I just typed for you.

I've never done much aluminum Mig, haven't touched my Cobramatic in about three years. But I sure wouldn't use the "start stop" method! Years ago I worked with the best weldor I've ever seen. He got handed a job where he had to weld 10-GA to 3/4 inch think mild steel. He used the "start stop" method with Mig. This project was to be DPI, I never seen so much blood in my life. He had to cut it all apart and start over!

Dye penetrant inspection - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I was having difficult getting sufficient penetration with cold edges when welding inside corners using a straight continuous bead so to the internet I went and found this:Mig Welding Aluminum with a Spool Gun scroll half way down page. After trying out the step and pause technique I found I had better control of the weld and overall it provided better penetration with better edges so I went with it. I assume the guy at welding tips and tricks has done a little aluminum welding so felt comfortable using the "step and pause" technique for this application.

Perhaps my trust was ill placed?

 

[Shield Arc]

What you're doing is what I call a whip. I don't necessarily whip everything, but I do move everything I weld except Tig. 7018, Mig, wirefeed I move the puddle to a small degree. 6010, 6011 I whip. Here again what little aluminum Mig I have done I whip it too.

This was done when I first got my Cobramatic, my power source doesn't have a hot start, as you can see the weld starts out cold, but then it gets going.:laughing:

 

[Jaylegger]

So to sum up your point which seems a little contradictory, iyo is the stop/start aka your whip outlined in the attached link suitable? Comparing my welds to the one in the link they look of similar quality on the surface anyway with no obvious cold edges though the weld depicted in the link is more consistent with less splatter. Your weld also looks similar to both mine and the links weld except for your cold edges. So are you saying your stop/start aka. step/pause aka. your "whip" weld is not suitable for joining to pieces of aluminum together?

 

[Shield Arc]

So are you saying your stop/start aka. step/pause aka. your "whip" weld is not suitable for joining to pieces of aluminum together?

Oh I think it's fine, doesn't really matter which method is used.
What I have a problem with is the "pop pop" method! A series of tack welds. Where the trigger is pulled for a split second, then let the puddle cool, and pull the trigger again, repeat as many times as necessary. Those cold starts will bite you in the butt. That was the reason I posted the story about the DPI testing. When you made the statement you did the "start stop" method, I thought that is what you were taking about, the "pop pop" method. When whipping, the puddle doesn't really have that much time to get too cold. X-ray pipe is welded everyday with the whip method.

 

[Jaylegger]

Oh I think it's fine, doesn't really matter which method is used.
What I have a problem with is the "pop pop" method! A series of tack welds. Where the trigger is pulled for a split second, then let the puddle cool, and pull the trigger again, repeat as many times as necessary. Those cold starts will bite you in the butt. That was the reason I posted the story about the DPI testing. When you made the statement you did the "start stop" method, I thought that is what you were taking about, the "pop pop" method. When whipping, the puddle doesn't really have that much time to get too cold. X-ray pipe is welded everyday with the whip method.

I get it now thanks, I at first thought the dpi story was using the whip aka my stop/start method. Perhaps the method should be called the "walker" method, pretty much self explainable.

 

[Chilly807]

Aluminum sheds heat so well you may be better using a long run, but if you're having trouble staying on course that's a problem too. Personally speaking, if you have a 12 inch weld to make, you may be better doing it in three 4 inch sections with a skipped area between the welds. Most jobs don't require 100% weld for strength, but it does look better.

I've never tried welding aluminum vertical, it'd take me some practice to decide which way was better for me. Usually down works better than up as far as puddle movement goes, but don't quote me on that.

You're pushing the gun, I assume? Better penetration and gas coverage when pushing, especially with aluminum.

I've got the basic Miller Spoolmate 100 gun that came with my 180 Millermatic, I've tried both 5356 and 4043 wire through it with good results.

Sean

 

[crazyal]

Glad you posted this, I read your thread earlier this morning, but I didn't have time to reply. Here is what I just typed for you.

I've never done much aluminum Mig, haven't touched my Cobramatic in about three years. But I sure wouldn't use the "start stop" method! Years ago I worked with the best weldor I've ever seen. He got handed a job where he had to weld 10-GA to 3/4 inch think mild steel. He used the "start stop" method with Mig. This project was to be DPI, I never seen so much blood in my life. He had to cut it all apart and start over!

Dye penetrant inspection - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Who did the testing? I've seen lots of plants who have people who read the can and think they know how to do the testing. I once worked at a company that made the high speed Amtrak train and watched a guy test one of the couplers. Needless to say when an untrained person decides he's going to test something in front of a level 3 inspector who also had to sign off in front of an government rep it didn't go well.