Buying Advice Which Kioti?

[PA hayseed]

That might be correct but note that the rock is well more than 24 inches out from the pivot pins too. I'd say it shows the loader lifts about what the specs say.

IT - not being snippy, but the tractor will lift a lot. Lifting and moving it are different issues. When I have had a ton in the bucket, moving super slow, bucket low, and lots of ballast on, the tractor did struggle. This is why I am saying the 2750 thrown around on this site cannot be right, outside of perfect conditions.

 

[Josh61513]

Impressive pictures of the boulder, IT.

Do you have really heavy forks PA? As i'm sure you're aware the weight of your attachment must be subtracted from your lift capacity. I believe the 2,700 lb. rating is to full height, you should have 20% or more additional capacity if only lifting to just above ground height. Ever checked your hydraulic relief pressure?

I would think that with 2,700 lbs. available at the pins, even when subtracting the weight of the forks, that a lifting a ton would be doable at least to a couple of feet off the ground. Could always take off your forks and try to lift something of a known weight from the QA carrier (carefully).

John Deere has thorough specs on their loaders which give various ratings for each loader, ie pins to full height, pins to 5' from the ground, xx inches from the pins to full height, etc. That could be useful for comparison

 

[IslandTractor]

IT - not being snippy, but the tractor will lift a lot. Lifting and moving it are different issues. When I have had a ton in the bucket, moving super slow, bucket low, and lots of ballast on, the tractor did struggle. This is why I am saying the 2750 thrown around on this site cannot be right, outside of perfect conditions.

I'd say it is pretty much par for the course that any vehicle will feel a bit iffy when operated right at the edge of it's limits. I moved this six foot Jersey barrier type concrete slab that must weight pretty close to 2400lbs if you go by 400lbs/foot estimates on Jersey barrier (some estimates are higher). It was real dicey mostly because I was on lumpy ground and had only my mower for ballast. The rear of the tractor was very light and I kept the load no more than 6-12 inches off the ground while moving slowly.

I am actually more interested in the power of the loader to rip stuff out of the ground and to carry big stumps and logs relatively short distances. I agree I would not want to use the loader to carry anything close to max loads more than a few hundred yards and ideally no more than a few hundred feet.

 

[Josh61513]

So that I am sure, you think the kioti 40/45 is carrying around 2750?

I feel bad for the OP as I am hijacking his thread.

My appologies as well for the hijack!

No, I would say it would be very unlikely to usefully lift 2,700 lbs. to full height with the DK40. That rating is at the pins and nearly everything we do to transfer the load to the loader takes away from the rating. First by pushing the load away from the pins via the quick-attach connection and thickness of the forks, and secondly by using a heavy attachment to latch onto the load. The only benefit we have is if you don't need to lift the load to full height-that the geometry of the loader/lift cylinders allows for more than 2,700 lbs. of lift (again at the pins) at lesser heights.

I helped a neighbor move pallets of concrete blocks with his NH TC35DA. It has a loader similar in strength to the Kioti D40. He was unable to lift a full pallet of the blocks so I suggested restacking the blocks on the pallet that were furthest away from the tractor (and thus loader pins) to above the blocks that were nearest to the tractor and violla! He was able to lift the pallet high enough to transport.

Instead of:
(tractor is left of the load)

|XXXXX
|XXXXX
|XXXXX


I restacked as:

|X
|XX
|XXX
|XXXX
|XXXXX

(To put the center of mass of the load closer to the loader pins)

I'm not well articulated today, I hope you're able to make some sense of that!

 

[IslandTractor]

Josh's point is also why the lift and curl are useful for popping things out of the ground if you can dig a grapple underneath. You get the "full" rated lift and curl only at the pivot pins so the closer you get the object to the pivot pins the more force you can exert.

 

[kraftykeltic]

That might be correct but note that the rock is well more than 24 inches out from the pivot pins too. I'd say it shows the loader lifts about what the specs say.

a boulder granite is 168 lbs a cubic foot. minimum size is 2X2X4= 16 cube
16 cube of granite is 2688 LBS. my take on the size is it is bigger than that.maybe in the 3500lb range.
for reference sandstone solid is 163 cuft.

 

[IslandTractor]

a boulder granite is 168 lbs a cubic foot. minimum size is 2X2X4= 16 cube
16 cube of granite is 2688 LBS. my take on the size is it is bigger than that.maybe in the 3500lb range.
for reference sandstone solid is 163 cuft.

That is what I thought too but even with the lower estimate it makes the point that the loader is not really overrated.

 

[PA hayseed]

My appologies as well for the hijack!

The only benefit we have is if you don't need to lift the load to full height-that the geometry of the loader/lift cylinders allows for more than 2,700 lbs. of lift (again at the pins) at lesser heights.

I helped a neighbor move pallets of concrete blocks with his NH TC35DA. It has a loader similar in strength to the Kioti D40. He was unable to lift a full pallet of the blocks so I suggested restacking the blocks on the pallet that were furthest away from the tractor (and thus loader pins) to above the blocks that were nearest to the tractor and violla! He was able to lift the pallet high enough to transport.

Instead of:
(tractor is left of the load)

|XXXXX
|XXXXX
|XXXXX


I restacked as:

|X
|XX
|XXX
|XXXX
|XXXXX

(To put the center of mass of the load closer to the loader pins)

I'm not well articulated today, I hope you're able to make some sense of that!

A pallet of 8x8x16 is 3000+lbs not including the weight of the forks and the pallet. If the blocks are wet, the weight is significantly higher. link: How much does a pallet of cinder blocks weigh - Wikianswers - Find and edit the best answers. How to? What? Is it? Can I? Where is?

According to Kioti, Approximate Weight with Bucket 1,082 lbs
Bucket Size Used for Specification 72"
Lift Capacity to Full Height at Pivot Pins 2,761 lbs
Breakout Force at Pivot Pin 3,727 lbs
Ballast Box attached to 3-Point 1,047 lbs

I note that kioti does not mention if 2761 takes into account the weight of the bucket or not.

contrast that to the 3 point:
3-Point Hitch
Standard Category (Optional Category) Cat. I (N/A)
Lift Capacity, 24" aft of hitch, lb(kg) 2,493 lb (1,131 kg)

so, according to kioti, the loader has about the same lift capability as the 3 point. IN IT's case, he needs the breakout force, which is significantly higher. I need more lift capacity. And not stationary lift capacity, but usable lift capacity.

I have watched a volkswagen tow an airplane. Doesn't mean you can do it everyday, and it had to be specially rigged to do it.

I think that my original point is valid, that your not throwing 2750 on these 40/45's and running around with it. Having hauled hundreds of full bucket loads of gravel, shale, topsoil, and concrete, I stand behind it.

I do understand the point about stacking the pallet load of blocks, but it essentially defeats the purpose.

 

[IslandTractor]

According to Kioti, Approximate Weight with Bucket 1,082 lbs
Bucket Size Used for Specification 72"
Lift Capacity to Full Height at Pivot Pins 2,761 lbs
Breakout Force at Pivot Pin 3,727 lbs
Ballast Box attached to 3-Point 1,047 lbs

I note that kioti does not mention if 2761 takes into account the weight of the bucket or not. .

I believe the measurement standard is with the stock bucket but I agree that none of the manufacturers makes that point explicitly. The stock bucket on a KL401 weighs about 300+lbs so that is not inconsequential.

I think with PAHayseeds issue though the biggest barrier to carrying more is that the stock bucket is not designed to carry a volume large enough to reach anything close to max lift capacity unless you fill it with granite or lead. Sand and gravel should not be hard to lift by the bucketful I would guess but I've never done it.

Travel with a loaded bucket is never supposed to be long distance. I don't know what the design assumptions are but the loader is just what the word implies and is not a "transporter". It is designed to load a truck or move material short distances so IMO the FEL specifications are reasonably accurate.

 

[mx5guy]

It took every thing I had to lift this off the ground, had to use incline of hill to be able to lift it off the ground so I could lift it. I recently lifted a rock made mostly out of quarts was barely able to lift it.:confused2: