Problems with Massey 124 Baler

[nwwy]

Hi -

I'm brand new at this forum, and I hope this is the right place to ask for help. I have a Massey 124 baler that used to be very reliable. I broke a needle and decided to go ahead and buy two new ones since the other needle was showing a lot of wear. I put in the needles, made the usual adjustments, ran the cycle manually (without hay) and everything lined up perfectly. Then, I went to the field today to try baling some oat straw. The first few bales weren't very good, but I thought it would be fine if I made a few 'field adjustments'. I didn't even get the chance, though, since one of my brand new needles just broke!! Can anyone give me a clue as to what may have caused this? I'm at my wit's end. Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[flusher]

Hi -

I'm brand new at this forum, and I hope this is the right place to ask for help. I have a Massey 124 baler that used to be very reliable. I broke a needle and decided to go ahead and buy two new ones since the other needle was showing a lot of wear. I put in the needles, made the usual adjustments, ran the cycle manually (without hay) and everything lined up perfectly. Then, I went to the field today to try baling some oat straw. The first few bales weren't very good, but I thought it would be fine if I made a few 'field adjustments'. I didn't even get the chance, though, since one of my brand new needles just broke!! Can anyone give me a clue as to what may have caused this? I'm at my wit's end. Thanks in advance for your help.

My baler is also an MF124.
"Usual adjustments" ------ which adjustments?
Did you go through the plunger safety stop adjustment procedure?
How about the needle brake adjustment?
Is the needle swing frame returning to the home position correctly?
How about the trip clutch on the knotters--is it operating correctly?

Sounds like your needles are not timed correctly and/or are not returning to the home position properly.

 

[nwwy]

Yes, I checked everything you mentioned before trying to bale the straw. I am wondering if it's possible that the needle just wasn't tight enough??? The other needle looks fine.

 

[zzvyb6]

It looks like your presumption is that the needle(s) were broken by the plunger. I presume the same thing that broke the needles the first time is breaking them now. Sooooo...

Either the baler is out of time (the plunger is misphased with the needle lift via the knotter drive), or, the needles are hitting something on their way up or down when the needle lift bar is being pulled (retracted) or pushed. Look for a shear pin broke in the needle lift bar/tube.

What tell-tale marks are on the needles? Did the plunger strike them? Does the knotter frame show a massive strike or rub? Are they the correct needles for this machine?

Take off the needle thats still good and lay it on a piece of cardboard or plywood. Then spray paint from the top to get its outline. Compare the old needles to this image and see if you can tell where they were struck. You can also use this image to have the old needles welded back into shape. All 3 of them!

The real question is why are the plunger stops in operation (or not) when they shouldn't be needed if the machine is timed properly.

 

[nwwy]

Thank you very much! I'll try that. I really appreciate the help from both of you!

 

[banjodunn]

G'day as stated check for signs of the needle hitting something it is possible that you may have just had a faulty needle. Is it poss to take a close up pic of the break and post it?? might be able to see something


Jon

 

[nwwy]

Hi again -

I really thought I had this thing solved, but another needle just bent. I worked on the timing, and everything was perfect when I ran it manually in the yard. Then, I went into the field and tried making a bale - and on the first one, the left needle bent! (If it helps, it's always the same needle that bends.).

It seems like getting material (straw) in the chamber causes something to get out of line. I'm having the needle welded this time since it's just too expensive to keep buying new ones!

I'm about ready to just burn the straw! Please help...

Thank you.

 

[JasG]

When you are timing the needles on the baler are you doing it with the plunger coming forward or going backward.

I have seen something like this before on a Deere 336 baler. The instructions tell you to cycle the baler by hand till the (I'm going by memory) needles just start to enter the chamber, then measure the distance from the needle to the plunger face. The plunger should be coming forward still. One guy did it with the plunger going backward. So as the needles came up they were hitting the hay in the chamber. On the 336 the needles should come up through slots in the face of the plunger. The plunger should be fully forward right when the needles are up in the knotter. It kept happening to him on 1 side due to the one side didn't have a dogg to hold the hay, the other side did. Took me a while to figure out what was happening. Hit needle that broke had no marks on it other than the break.

Is it possible you have a similar situation?

 

[nwwy]

I'm not sure, but I'll check it out! Thank you very, very much.

 

[flusher]

I'm not sure, but I'll check it out! Thank you very, very much.

Yeah, check the dogs on the baling chamber.
Do you have hay wedges installed in your baler?

 

[nwwy]

Thanks to everyone for your help. I think JasG has hit the nail on the head. It sure looks like that's what's happened. I wonder what "The plunger should be fully forward right when the needles are up in the knotter" means though? Why 'fully forward RIGHT'?

I didn't actually run the baler backwards, but the timing chain apparently was off - even though it looked correct according to the book. I think it causing everything to be off so much that the needles were still in the chamber when they should have cleared it.

I will work on it again tomorrow and let you know! Thanks again. I really appreciate the help.

 

[JasG]

Thanks to everyone for your help. I think JasG has hit the nail on the head. It sure looks like that's what's happened. I wonder what "The plunger should be fully forward right when the needles are up in the knotter" means though? Why 'fully forward RIGHT'?

I didn't actually run the baler backwards, but the timing chain apparently was off - even though it looked correct according to the book. I think it causing everything to be off so much that the needles were still in the chamber when they should have cleared it.

I will work on it again tomorrow and let you know! Thanks again. I really appreciate the help.

I will try and expalin better. When I say the plunger is going forward that is towards the hay in the chamber. Backwards is going away from the hay in the chamber, but still turning the baler in the correct direction. The reason the needles come up to the knotter through grooves in the plunger face (at least on JD balers) is so the hay is held by the plunger and can not touch the needle or twine. When the needles are at there highest point, the plunger should be very close to its furthest forward position into the chamber holding the hay. As the needles pull out the plunger is on it's back stroke going away from the hay in the chamber.

What was happening on the baler I described earlier. The needles were coming up while the plunger was moving away from the hay in the chamber. The hay in the chamber was sliding back and pushing on the needles as they were coming up. This made for poor ties and after a few bales the needle on the left side (as looking from the back of the baler towards the tractor) broke.

 

[cornshucker]

check the plunger for foreign matter in the slot that the needle travels thru. We had a small stick to get in this one time and bent a needle but was lucky and found it the first time.

 

[JasG]

I will work on it again tomorrow and let you know! Thanks again. I really appreciate the help.

Just wondering how did you make out and what did you find?

 

[nwwy]

Hi again -

Sorry for the delay posting a reply. I've just been so busy in the field I keep forgetting! Anyway, the baler is knotting pretty well now. It misses a knot occasionally, but it's old, so I suppose I should expect that. The problem I'm having now is that one of the knives isn't cutting the twine every time. It will miss some bales, which of course causes a real mess. I think I need to order a new knife, but maybe it's just not lined up perfectly. I plan on taking it apart to see what I can do. I can't tell all of you how much I appreciate all the help you've given me!

 

[flusher]

Hi again -

Sorry for the delay posting a reply. I've just been so busy in the field I keep forgetting! Anyway, the baler is knotting pretty well now. It misses a knot occasionally, but it's old, so I suppose I should expect that. The problem I'm having now is that one of the knives isn't cutting the twine every time. It will miss some bales, which of course causes a real mess. I think I need to order a new knife, but maybe it's just not lined up perfectly. I plan on taking it apart to see what I can do. I can't tell all of you how much I appreciate all the help you've given me!

Keep that knife sharp. Then follow the alignment procedure in the operation manual.

 

[banjodunn]

G'day take to the knife with an oilstone or diamond plate and keep them sharp enough to shave with ( ok so maybe not that sharp but you get the idea ) and align as per the manual a missed knot every hundred/2 is nothing to worry about on an old machine


Jon

 

[MBMassey]

This must have been a common problem on these balers...my 124 did the same thing...was doing good then all of a sudden broke the l/h knife...I welded it but I didn't time it properly so it bent...had to fix it again and then I timed it with the other side, but mine will sometimes pull the twine out of the needle and will only make about 1 or 2 bales then either misses cutting the twine or the twine slips out of the needle as I said before and doesn't tie anymore.

VERY frustrating..but I'll look at some of the ideas on here....I hope this will get resolved soon or I'll have to borrow the OP's lighter

 

[Ken A]

I just bought a baler that someone had given up on. Check the slots in the plunger that your needles pass through. It could have a wad of dryed up hay or mud in it which keeps bending the needle. Make sure they are cleaned out. That's what it sounds like to me.