heat an air operation

/ heat an air operation #1  

heehaw

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2000
Messages
2,076
Location
russellville, arkansas
Tractor
Kubota M4900, B7510 and RTV
does anyone know which would be cheaper to operate, two 2.5 ton units or one 5 ton heat pump: considering the seer rating being the same on all units: my daugher an son in law are remodeling an trying to figure out which would be the best way to go: my "guess" is the two 2.5 ton units...nothing to back that guess up but it would seem like there would be times you might use just one of the units, which should save quite a bit??
heehaw
 
/ heat an air operation #2  
If the home is two story, you can regulate the conditions better with two units.
 
/ heat an air operation #3  
If the home is two story, you can regulate the conditions better with two units.

Since you can control better, you don't have to over cool or over heat one area to get the other one comfortable. Go with the two units and you will operate cheaper and be more comfortable.

Even if you only have one floor, it is better. I have four zones on my rancher.
 
/ heat an air operation
  • Thread Starter
#4  
they have added a two story section to the existing house: considering putting in a 5 ton unit to cover the entire lower floor: which would replace the existing 2.5 ton unit: then another 2.5 ton unit for the upstairs: i just checked prices at acdirect an a 5 ton unit would cost less than 5k, an a 2.5 ton unit is about 3.5k: so i guess as far as equipment cost goes, the 5 ton would be the way to go? the existing system is really old an uses resistance heat:
heehaw
 
Last edited:
/ heat an air operation #5  
Weigh the cost of one large and two small units against the operating cost of one vs. two.
You have a basic flaw in your logic.
The heat load for the original one floor house is, four walls + roof = 2.5 tons.

The heat load for the two story house is:

Top floor, four walls + roof = 2.5 tons.

Bottom floor, four walls + cool top floor = 1.5 tons.

The point is that the first floor AC unit dose not have to deal with the roof load.

Also look into two and three speed compressors which are more efficient to run depending on day and night time temperatures.
 
/ heat an air operation #6  
They must have added alot to that 1st floor to go from a 2.5 ton to a 5 ton unit. 5 ton = 2000 cfm's of air flow based on 400 cfm's per ton.. I would do a heat load calculation for the 1 st floor & 1 for the 2nd floor
 
/ heat an air operation #7  
I have a unit for upstairs and one for downstairs. Great being able to turn the upstairs up to 77 or 78 and the bottom on 70. We have a return air for the downstairs unit at the top of the stairs and so actually the downstairs unit does cool upstairs to some extent so it seems the upstairs hardly ever runs. But no question I would go with 2 units.
 
/ heat an air operation #8  
Some of the decision may depend on how the ducting is run. If you have one 5 ton to heat/cool then you would somehow have to split the ducting in half to let the two separate 2.5 ton work properly.
 
/ heat an air operation #9  
The point is that the first floor AC unit dose not have to deal with the roof load.

Kind of irrelevant. A load calculation will determine the size including the the "roof load". One system costs less than two systems, and if you have the proper airflow and duct layout, one properly sized system can handle the load just as well if there were two systems.

Some of the decision may depend on how the ducting is run. If you have one 5 ton to heat/cool then you would somehow have to split the ducting in half to let the two separate 2.5 ton work properly.

I'm guessing that there is NO ductwork in the new addition, which would add greatly to your cost, particularly if its being run in an unconditioned space (sheet metal, flex, collars, tape, mastic... adds up). Added if it's a heat pump, you will have to run electric for the aux heat which adds even more to the cost. Sometimes I scratch my head thinking what the builder thought as far as the space given to install an HVAC system.

The above then asks the question if a mulit zoned dutless mini split system would work?

I have a unit for upstairs and one for downstairs. Great being able to turn the upstairs up to 77 or 78 and the bottom on 70. We have a return air for the downstairs unit at the top of the stairs and so actually the downstairs unit does cool upstairs to some extent so it seems the upstairs hardly ever runs. But no question I would go with 2 units.

The house I bought has three systems. NOT the way I would of planned it, but it's what the contractor was "stuck" to work with. The one nice thing about three systems though is that if one goes down in the heat of summer, you can "live" in within another working system in the house while having the problem fixed.

Since you can control better, you don't have to over cool or over heat one area to get the other one comfortable. Go with the two units and you will operate cheaper and be more comfortable.

Overall, a properly sized system with the proper ductwork, zoned properly will work better IMO than two systems and most likely cost less to run than two seperate systems. Short cycling hurts todays equipment more than helps.

Problem is, no one ever seems to plan for adding on to their house.

I would do a heat load calculation for the 1 st floor & 1 for the 2nd floor

Doesn't that come with AC directs price? LMAO

considering the seer rating being the same on all units:

How old is the existing system? I'd guess probably a 10 SEER?

Is the addition finished or still in the process of building?

I would suggest that your daughter and son in law call three HVAC contractors to see what they propose. Take my word for it, don't always go with the lowest price. Problem is, the information given on the actual newly built space given here is limited and trying to determine the best course of action to take is best by eyeballing the job in person by a person who should know what they are talking about.
 
/ heat an air operation #10  
Not trying to be a smart a-- , but have you asked the contractor doing the work what he wants to install? He is going to have to back up the work. If you don't trust his judgement, get a different contractor.
 
/ heat an air operation #11  
What ever you do, do not oversize the units. Too much BTU capacity will cool the house quickly but will not run the units long enough to properly dehumidify the house leaving a damp felling. A 75 deg night with 85% humidity, too cool to run the a-c long enough to deal with all that water without making he house cold and too warm to have the windows open. That is why I suggested units with multi speed compressors.
What is the best brand for a home central air conditioning system?
 
/ heat an air operation
  • Thread Starter
#12  
no contractor involved: i've built several houses an never saw a need for a "contractor":
heehaw
 
/ heat an air operation #14  
Hmmm...

I'm guessing you use the beer can method for your pressure readings:D


Sorry but,
I have a patent pending on this method. I also have 1 when the large line sweats it's correctly charged:D
 
/ heat an air operation
  • Thread Starter
#16  
looks like we have different definitions of the word contractor: i use professionials that work: not ones the "co-ordinate and schedule". nothing against what i call a contractor, but i prefer to pick my own workers an professionals: not someone that is managing several different jobs at the same time: just a matter of preference.
heehaw
 
/ heat an air operation #17  
HVAC contractor- one who works in the HVAC trade and has the appropriate state license to practice that trade, and is licensed and insured.
 
/ heat an air operation
  • Thread Starter
#18  
i have never thought of any of the different professionals as being contractors when building a house, sub-contractors for sure, but i guess its just a difference in how its defined: but yes we do use licensed professional hvac folks: even then i am sure there are a lot of us that can quote some horror stories: as with all professions: sometimes i think we would be better off if we went back to wood stoves an window ac units.
heehaw
 
/ heat an air operation #19  
If no ductwork in the new upper section, have a look at the ductless minisplit units e.g. Mitsubishi "Mr. Slim". Have heat pumps and believe they even have multiple room units where one condenser runs 2 wall/evaporator units.
 
/ heat an air operation #20  
I've gone with the 2 unit deal and am glad I did. I really only use one at a time for heat and one and sometimes the other for A/C.

The heat situation means living where the heat is. I don't really need a lot of heat in the sleeping quarters, especially during the day, but sometimes it kicks on.

The A/C situation is sort of the same. We congregate where the cool air is (really the humidity is lower). I like sleeping in cooler air so the 2nd unit does its job, but at night the other A/C unit seldom runs.

The point is that both units seldom run at the same time, AND I have a spare unit in case one of them ever fails.

I have 4 large dogs. They generate a LOT of heat. So in the Winter, they sleep in the room with me. That's a good thing. In the Summer, they also sleep in the room with me. That's a BAD thing. And, they like it very cool all the time.
 

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