2011 Superduty Specs Announced

[Duffster]

Yes but they limit the tow capacity to keep the GCWR within CDL specs. They are not making a couple of models with some 30k+ GCWR so they can spec out some 20k+ tow capacity for the advertisements.

What was your point again...

You still don't know what GCWR means do you?

 

[Duffster]

I'll repeat myself again since it's obvious your the one I need to keep clarifying for. :mur:
I never said you need a CDL to drive the truck alone, I said empty and meant an empty trailer which I clarified later and even reposted it again just now. You see it yet...?

I took empty as no trailer from post #1.

Moot point since a CDL would be required whether empty or loaded if the trailer is big enough for Dodge, Chevy or Ford.

The GCWR you keep referencing means NOTHING. Again.

 

[Duffster]

Dmace,

Can you give us an example of a truck and trailer combination using the new F350 specs that would require a CDL; one that wouldn't need a CDL if it was a Chevy, Dodge or previous year Ford?

 

[JB4310]

Well I heard back from my dot official, Lieut. B. He clarified the part I was having trouble with, it is just gvwr of truck + gvwr of trailer that has to be under 26k, that's when the trailer is over 10K.

But I guess you guys have already ironed that out and are in agreement

The new thing I don't get is, you could have a large 6 wheel dump truck (class 6 truck) with a GVWR of 26K, plus a trailer with a GVWR of 10K for a GCWR of 36K and not need a CDL. (I use the full weight limits instead of 25,999 etc, because the CDL requirements start a 1 pound over those ratings)

But you couldn't drive a F-350 with a 12.5K gvwr (class 3 truck) and tow a 13,501# trailer, (26001# GCWR) without a CDL, even though it would weigh 10,000 pounds LESS than the example above.

Kinda strange, I guess the thinking is it's much more dangerous to be towing a little heavier trailer with a lighter truck, than driving much heavier truck with a lighter trailer???

JB.

 

[Dargo]

Hey, my motor coach weighs 37,550 pounds, has air brakes, a tag axle and I legally drive it without a CDL. It weighs a lot more than that loaded for a trip!

 

[Duffster]

Hey, my motor coach weighs 37,550 pounds, has air brakes, a tag axle and I legally drive it without a CDL. It weighs a lot more than that loaded for a trip!

Now add a driver that is so old that they shouldn't have a license at all.

ps. I am not referring to you by the way.

 

[Dargo]

Now add a driver that is so old that they shouldn't have a license at all.

ps. I am not referring to you by the way.

Thanks for the clarification, but that's my point. Gees, talk about dangerous!!

 

[JB4310]

As for towing with needing a CDL what you guys here are missing is the exceptions. Most who would be over 26,000# would fall under these towing 5th wheel campers, ect. The others would be guys hauling heavy equipment and probably already have a DOT check and CDL anyway so it is no big deal.

What it is saying is the manufactures are listing to the consumers. We want trucks that can do the work they are capable of legally.

Chris

I think the only ones that would be exempt are the RV drivers, just cause a guy lives on a farm doesn't mean the enforcement people are gonna accept that he should be exempt when they stop him pulling a pc of heavy construction equipment and he tells them it's for farming. It may very well be true. not sure who the burden of proof would be on.

I don't think the average F-350 owner is gonna be a CDL holder, or is even thinking about one, when he plans on pulling a 20,000 pound stock trailer 200 miles to the state fair. So the truck may be legally capable but many/most of the drivers wont be IMO.

JB.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I think the only ones that would be exempt are the RV drivers, just cause a guy lives on a farm doesn't mean the enforcement people are gonna accept that he should be exempt when they stop him pulling a pc of heavy construction equipment and he tells them it's for farming. It may very well be true. not sure who the burden of proof would be on.

I don't think the average F-350 owner is gonna be a CDL holder, or is even thinking about one, when he plans on pulling a 20,000 pound stock trailer 200 miles to the state fair. So the truck may be legally capable but many/most of the drivers wont be IMO.

JB.

That does not hold water. Pulling a stock trailer with Farm Plated Truck and Farm Plated Trailer would be exempt in Indiana. Pulling a 21,000# RV is legal in Indiana. Pulling ones personal property not for hire is legal in Indiana. Pulling a dozer on a trailer that is Farm Plated along with the Truck being Farm Plated is legal in Indiana. Driving my neighbors dump truck with Farm Plates is legal in Indiana. Well, kind of.... I would have to technically be a employee or family member. Like I said before you can hire a 17 year old kid off the street to work on a farm and put him in a 18 wheeler in Indiana. No CDL required. Just a normal operators license.

I have called about my uncles boat. They consider it personal property/recreational vehicle. We have to get a over width permit due to it being 13' wide but my truck weighs 7,600# and the boat is 25,000# and nothing else is needed. Cost us $50 and we are done for the 30 mile trip in and out each April and November. We get this permit one day in advance from Indiana DOT office. It clearly states all the info about the truck, insurance, drivers, route, travel times, ect.

There are tons of exemptions. Its like doing your taxes. You stay within the law but right on the legal ragged edge!

Chris

 

[Dmace]

Dmace,

Can you give us an example of a truck and trailer combination using the new F350 specs that would require a CDL; one that wouldn't need a CDL if it was a Chevy, Dodge or previous year Ford?

You are not getting my point and I'm through wasting my time with your questions. One more time for the record, there is NO NEED for Ford to spec out these F-350 trucks with GCWR's over 26k lbs. They are only doing so to produce ridiculous tow capacities and "trick" customers into thinking their trucks are tougher for it. Any of the big 1-tons will need a CDL if their GCWR is over 26k, period! BUT GM and Dodge don't make you believe you can tow 20k+ with their trucks legally.

My whole point this entire thread was that the tow capacity rating and GCWR that Ford has placed on this F350 is a stupid marketing campaign that will mislead many uninformed buyers to thinking they can just load up a trailer with 21k lbs and drive off. If Ford is going to rate the F350 that high then what's the point of the F450 or even the F550?

The new thing I don't get is, you could have a large 6 wheel dump truck (class 6 truck) with a GVWR of 26K, plus a trailer with a GVWR of 10K for a GCWR of 36K and not need a CDL.

No you can't, the GCWR of that combination is now 36k which is well over the 26k limit of a CDL license.

 

[JB4310]

That does not hold water. Pulling a stock trailer with Farm Plated truck and Farm Plated Trailer would be exempt in Indiana. Pulling a 21,000# RV is legal in Indiana. Pulling ones personal property not for hire is legal in Indiana. Pulling a dozer on a trailer that is Farm Plated along with the Truck being Farm Plated is legal in Indiana. Driving my neighbors dump truck with Farm Plates is legal in Indiana. Well, kind of.... I would have to technically be a employee or family member.

There are tons of exemptions. Its like doing your taxes. You stay within the law but right on the legal ragged edge!

Chris

That's why I used the 200 mile distance, I thought those farm exemptions are only good out to something like 150 miles?

I do agree with you though, with these new higher ratings (not all that new, not just Ford) alot of guys are on the ragged edge :shocked:

JB

 

[Diamondpilot]

You are not getting my point and I'm through wasting my time with your questions. One more time for the record, there is NO NEED for Ford to spec out these F-350 trucks with GCWR's over 26k lbs. They are only doing so to produce ridiculous tow capacities and "trick" customers into thinking their trucks are tougher for it. Any of the big 1-tons will need a CDL if their GCWR is over 26k, period! BUT GM and Dodge don't make you believe you can tow 20k+ with their trucks legally.

My whole point this entire thread was that the tow capacity rating and GCWR that Ford has placed on this F350 is a stupid marketing campaign that will mislead many uninformed buyers to thinking they can just load up a trailer with 21k lbs and drive off. If Ford is going to rate the F350 that high then what's the point of the F450 or even the F550?


No you can't, the GCWR of that combination is now 36k which is well over the 26k limit of a CDL license.

We all need to get together and take a class. There is no 26,000# limit for the average guy. Look at my post above. It all has to do with the first letter, "C"... Commercial.

GM is now at 20,000# tow rating, just 1,000# behind Ford on the 1 ton Dually. There is no trick here. Its just the numbers.

Chris

 

[Duffster]

You are not getting my point and I'm through wasting my time with your questions. One more time for the record, there is NO NEED for Ford to spec out these F-350 trucks with GCWR's over 26k lbs. They are only doing so to produce ridiculous tow capacities and "trick" customers into thinking their trucks are tougher for it. Any of the big 1-tons will need a CDL if their GCWR is over 26k, period! BUT GM and Dodge don't make you believe you can tow 20k+ with their trucks legally.

My whole point this entire thread was that the tow capacity rating and GCWR that Ford has placed on this F350 is a stupid marketing campaign that will mislead many uninformed buyers to thinking they can just load up a trailer with 21k lbs and drive off. If Ford is going to rate the F350 that high then what's the point of the F450 or even the F550?

So I take it you know more about towing than the guys at Ford.

No you can't, the GCWR of that combination is now 36k which is well over the 26k limit of a CDL license.

Wrong again Dmace.

 

[Diamondpilot]

That's why I used the 200 mile distance, I thought those farm exemptions are only good out to something like 150 miles?

I do agree with you though, with these new higher ratings (not all that new, not just Ford) alot of guys are on the ragged edge :shocked:

JB

I did not catch the 200 miles thing. You are correct with the 150 miles thing. That is as the bird flies in Indiana, not sure about other states. Most of the time a farmer would not be traveling that far but in the rare case it would make them illegal.

It may be on the ragged edge but at the end of the day its legal.

While I do not have a CDL I know plenty of people who do. My neighbor used to work for the phone company and got his and a Ford E-350 van pulling a generator. He then went back in a bucket truck to get his air brake endorsement. Its not a big deal. If someone wanted a CDL just get your new F-350 or what ever and hitch up a car hauler and go get it. You will be legal to do most everything except drive air brake equipped stuff.

Chris

 

[Duffster]

That's why I used the 200 mile distance, I thought those farm exemptions are only good out to something like 150 miles?

That is true for many states.

 

[Dmace]

Wrong again Dmace.

Once again instead of making a point or any kind of factual post, you will just tell everyone their wrong or ask questions. Please feel free to explain to everyone how that is legal.

You yourself even agreed that GCWR is GVWR + GVWR. So that truck with a GVWR of 26k PLUS a trailer with a GVWR of 10k = 36k GCWR. That is over the limit, period!

 

[garydc]

buy the ford 350 with the big tow capacity, and if you have the need of that much load capacity get the proper drivers lic. if you don't require that much load capacity licence the truck for 25900 lbs or less as long as it covers your requirements and no special drivers lic. is required.

 

[dgl24087]

I'll throw another monkey into the CDL exceptions. USPS contract drivers are not required to have a CDL, any air brake endorsement, and can drive any box truck with a normal driver's license, regardless of GVWR, as long as the route does not surpass 75 miles from the postal distribution center. Yes, I have driven a 33k gvwr truck with air brakes with no special license or training. I generally drive a Mitsubishi Fuso rated at 25,995 gvwr with air over hydraulic brakes.

 

[joes_427_vette]

Skip the F-250 and get a F-350 SRW. I have one of each and $600 difference the F-350 is much more truck.

Chris

For $600.00.... what could you get ? A thicker spring package ? A little don't buy you alot.

 

[Duffster]

Once again instead of making a point or any kind of factual post, you will just tell everyone their wrong or ask questions. Please feel free to explain to everyone how that is legal.

You yourself even agreed that GCWR is GVWR + GVWR. So that truck with a GVWR of 26k PLUS a trailer with a GVWR of 10k = 36k GCWR. That is over the limit, period!

Over what limit?

26k GVWR truck (under CDL) + 10k GVWR trailer (under CDL) = 36k GCWR (under CDL) simple as that. Period.

Since you obviously think I am wrong please tell us what class of CDL would be needed to drive JB's example rig of 20k + 8k.