JUst about ready to pull the trigger on a CK30....except

[Yota_85]

The loader lift cap seems, well...sad. Though it does come with a QA.
1155 @ the pins translates into (roughly 880 lbs 500mm out) This is a pure guess based on specs from other tractors, since Kioti does spec this. Lift pins - around 20%)

The Woods loader is better 1200 lbs 500mm out, but both dealers I talked to in my area said the Woods loader is going to cost WAY more than the KL130.

Then there's Bobcats CT230, that has a lift of 1225 lbs 500mm out. More like the Woods.

I'd prefer the CK30 over the Bobcat, but after adding the Woods loader to the cost, it puts me near the cost of a Kubota L3240 w/724 loader. (within 2.5K) More lift capacity (1360 500mm out) and oval nicer tractor. (Little bigger too)

So I'm not sure what to do here..... Maybe a Bobcat loader on a CK30? That would probably cost $$$ too. Wish Kioti offered different loaders for a certain model tractor like Kubota does.

HELP!

 

[rimshot]

I can't figure the ratings on those CK30's with a KL130 loader either. The CK30 has got an engine 50% bigger than a CK20 and yet it supposedly bench presses only 50 lbs more when comparing loaders. So say the specs at Kioti's website. I think it has more to do with the hydraulic pump in each tractor but it doesn't make sense anyway. Common sense would dictate that one is figured too conservative or one is exagerated.

I don't think I am going to pay a whole lot of attention to those figures however conservative or exagerated they become. All I know is my CK20 with a KL120 loader recently clean lifted an ash log solid/green measuring 23" at the butt an 17" at the top and was over 8'. The log tables claim it weighs 960-1050 lbs. That was off the front end of a reinforced bucket and thats plenty for that little tractor but it did it. That CK30 and KL130 loader I know can beat that.

Oh, one more thing. When I actually tried counting the age rings on that stump it turned out to be more like 150 years old not the 90 listed below the picture. (See below picture) This photo is undoctored but taken at dusk so flash was used.

rimshot

 

[LBrown59]

The loader lift cap seems, well...sad. Though it does come with a QA.
1155 @ the pins translates into (roughly 880 lbs 500mm out) This is a pure guess based on specs from other tractors, since Kioti does spec this. Lift pins - around 20%)

The Woods loader is better 1200 lbs 500mm out, but both dealers I talked to in my area said the Woods loader is going to cost WAY more than the KL130.

Then there's Bobcats CT230, that has a lift of 1225 lbs 500mm out. More like the Woods.

*I'd prefer the CK30 over the Bobcat, but after adding the Woods loader to the cost, it puts me near the cost of a Kubota L3240 w/724 loader. (within 2.5K) More lift capacity (1360 500mm out) and oval nicer tractor. (Little bigger too)

So I'm not sure what to do here..... Maybe a Bobcat loader on a CK30? That would probably cost $$$ too. Wish Kioti offered different loaders for a certain model tractor like Kubota does.

HELP!

By this one then ;it's a no brainer.

 

[Loren49]

Goodmorning,
Concerning lift capacity - my loader easily lifts a full bucket of crushed stone or dirt. At times I drop off a bit of the pile to take a little strain off the front axle. My tires are not loaded but I usually have my tiller for counter weight (500lb). I have found lift speed and capacity very good.

Loren

 

[ToadHill]

I've found Kioti loaders more than capable. If you can lift and carry a full bucket of stone, what more would you want to lift. If you expect to carry something heavier than that you'll want a bigger tractor.

 

[Mark_G]

I have moved several very large logs with my 2006 CK30. I have a picture of a good-sized log from an earlier post here:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...126356d1239209179-pick-up-sticks-img_3151.jpg

But I have moved larger/heavier logs than this.

 

[Yota_85]

Yes, that's just it. With the QA loader I expect to use front forks with it.
No, I don't expect to move around 1 ton pallets of stone, but I do expect to move pallets of firewood. Which I do now with carry-all on my 3pt. with my Kubota B7610.

If I'm down to around 880 lbs 500mm (24") out, it'll be less than that @ 3ft out. Minus the forks.

Now, I'd expect this from a 1800 lb tractor like the B3030 (lift cap 1091 @ pins), but would expect more from a 3100 lb tractor like the CK30/35. (1155 @ lift pins)

Has anyone been quoted a decent price on the Woods loaders for the CK series?

And, yes I already looked at the DK series. (Which do seem to have an extremely capable loader) Tractor seems too big however to fit in the garage.

Thanks to all that have responded. I really do like the CK series. Like the look, layout, reputation, size & weight seem perfect. It's just this dang loader thing I'm hung up on.

 

[Westendorf-RR]

The loader lift cap seems, well...sad. Though it does come with a QA.
1155 @ the pins translates into (roughly 880 lbs 500mm out) This is a pure guess based on specs from other tractors, since Kioti does spec this. Lift pins - around 20%)

The Woods loader is better 1200 lbs 500mm out, but both dealers I talked to in my area said the Woods loader is going to cost WAY more than the KL130.

Then there's Bobcats CT230, that has a lift of 1225 lbs 500mm out. More like the Woods.

I'd prefer the CK30 over the Bobcat, but after adding the Woods loader to the cost, it puts me near the cost of a Kubota L3240 w/724 loader. (within 2.5K) More lift capacity (1360 500mm out) and oval nicer tractor. (Little bigger too)

So I'm not sure what to do here..... Maybe a Bobcat loader on a CK30? That would probably cost $$$ too. Wish Kioti offered different loaders for a certain model tractor like Kubota does.

HELP!

You are not the only one who gets frustrated when comparing specifications for loaders. Mfg are "supposed" to follow guidelines for consistency for comparison; what actually happens is they find ways to elevate the lift capacities so they "look" better on paper than they will actually perform. What really matters is the "full working capacity" of the loader. How much will it lift at the full height at the FRONT edge of the bucket.

Ways the numbers can be skewed:
Changing the hydraulic pressure capacities the loaders are tested at
(i.e. a 250 pound increase in pressure (2500 to 2750) resultsin 300 lb increase of lift capacity)

Cylinder size will also tell you a lot about how much the loader will lift.

How far the loader sits out front of the tractor is also a good indicator of comfort and eliminating that "pucker" factor you guys always talk about. The closer to the tractors front end, the more it will lift and the rear end will stay put. (i.e. see photos. The smaller loader (TA-111) sits back further on tractor and has nearly the same lift capacity as the one with the higher lift (TA-170))

Lift height directly affects the lift capacity.

CK30 with TA-111 at 8'3" lifts 1400# (2" cylinders)
CK30 with TA-170 at 10'2" lifts 1450# (2" cylinders)
CK30 with TA-175 at 10'2" lifts 2250# (2 1/2" cylinders)

 

[IslandTractor]

As a former satisfied CK20/KL120 owner I always thought it was weird that Kioti had a relatively wimpy upgrade in loader capacity on the CK25/27/30/35. The Woods is a good choice but will cost more and makes comparisons with other tractors necessary as you have pointed out.

When I decided to upgrade from my CK20 I considered the CK30 as the horsepower was probably enough but I couldn't get my head around the lack of loader strength as that was my primary motivation for upgrading. I finally decided on the DK40se with a more than doubling of loader capacity (nearly triple) over the CK series. Never looked back. 2700lbs of lift capacity and something around 3700lbs of breakout force is a beautiful thing. I sometimes regret losing the convenience of a smaller tractor size but then I go out and rip up a few stumps or drag a big rock out of the ground and know I made the right decision. Given the premium for Kubotas, I would imagine that a DK40se/KL401 would only be a slight stretch from what the L3240/LA724 costs SO LONG AS you get a competitive bid from a high volume Kioti dealer (Mom and Pop Kioti dealers are notorious for trying to get list price which never compares well against a discounted Kubota).

I don't think that the KL130 is weak it just is out of proportion to what is available from Kioti at the 20hp range (KL120) and the 40hp range (KL401). They should be able to mount a loader with 1400lb or better lift for those larger CKs and I'm surprised they haven't addressed it.

 

[Yota_85]

Yes, that is my point. If not for the weak(er) KL130 thing, I would have bought the CK30 instantly.

Wonder how many other buyers are/have wrestled with this same thing.
Also wonder how many more tractors Kioti could sell if they just upped this some. (Judging by the Rhino and Woods specs, it can clearly be done)

Also, thanks for the great response(s). The DK may be a little to large for (storage). Even slightly bigger than the Kubota L3240/3540 I think. But, at lease it has a great loader.

 

[Steve_Miller]

For what it's worth.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kioti-owning-operating/144635-nova-scotia-tractor-tests.html

Steve

 

[Yota_85]

Yes, Steve, that was informative. And now I'm further perplexed.

Yours clearly lifted 1600 lbs. May not have been to full height, but it did lift it.

Does Kioti rate their loaders like we rate pickup trucks.
ex. 1/2 ton truck generally has a weight capacity of 1500-1800 lbs.
Though I guess they mean that is the max, whereas it'll carry 1000 lbs all day long, safely.

So to transfer the analogy, the KL130 will safely pick up 1155 lbs to FULL HEIGHT, but may (as you tests show) pick up substantially more, just NOT to full height, and possibly (at least without proper ballast) not safely.

Anyone following this train of thought, or am I talking crackers here?

Either that or Kioti seriously UNDERRATES their loaders

 

[IslandTractor]

Kioti and all manufacturers rate their loaders to full height. As you noted they will lift substantially more to lower heights. As an estimate, I think it is fair to think that if a KL130 is rated at 1155lbs to full height that it would lift about 1500lbs to pickup bed height. The other loader specification that can help is the breakout capacity which is always higher than the full height lift capacity. Breakout is basically the max weight you can put in the bucket and get if off the ground. Somewhere between breakout and max lift would be about right for capacity to pickup bed height.

 

[JoelD]

Kioti and all manufacturers rate their loaders to full height. As you noted they will lift substantially more to lower heights. As an estimate, I think it is fair to think that if a KL130 is rated at 1155lbs to full height that it would lift about 1500lbs to pickup bed height. The other loader specification that can help is the breakout capacity which is always higher than the full height lift capacity. Breakout is basically the max weight you can put in the bucket and get if off the ground. Somewhere between breakout and max lift would be about right for capacity to pickup bed height.

I did not realize that was what break out meant, I thought it was curl force.

That is good to know.

Thanks,
Joel

 

[MtnViewRanch]

Before I bought my Mahindra 3215, I was about this !! close to getting a CK35, the loader was the deciding factor for me. Mahindra's ML111 loader has a lift capacity of 1410lbs at the pins to full height of 94".

 

[MichiganIron]

Brake-out Force is a rating of the bucket curl force at the cutting edge.

 

[MotorSeven]

Yota, the CK30 is a great machine. But, I traded mine in for a DK40se. My main reason was bucket size, lift capacity and the QA. I just ended up picking on things with the Ck loader that it just couldn't handle. It did pick up a wet 4x5 roll of hay on bucket forks(it made the CK grunt hard), which I thought was impressive. Anyway, when I traded, I swapped buckets on the DK for a Bush Hog brand, it is almost twice as deep as the standard Kioti bucket.

If you think you will need more lift capacity, go with a DK & never look back....imho. Sounds like you just need to build a tractor shed/garage

RD

 

[IslandTractor]

Brake-out Force is a rating of the bucket curl force at the cutting edge.

I always thought that too but just recently saw a pretty official document (cannot remember what exactly) that described it as the max lift force with the bucket on the ground. I also used to think that breakout was the combination of curl plus lift which intuitively makes the most sense as that would be a greater force than curl or lift alone. Does anyone have a reference for a technical definition of what breakout force is?

One problem with the definition that MichiganIron posts is that it would depend on bucket size which seems kinda odd. The skidsteer type flat long buckets would give a low reading while some of the short buckets (like Kioti supplies standard) would give a high reading. It would make sense if it was stated as at pivot pins or at 500mm as it would at least allow direct comparisons.

 

[SunnyJim]

Here is my CK25 with a set of howse forks (355lbs) lifting my F150 off the ground. It would have been easier with the bucket instead of the forks since the forks weigh quite a bit and are long placing the weight so far forward.

Howse Pallet Forks for Front-End Loader, Model# SXFLPF-R-NT | Forklift Forks + Extensions | Northern Tool + Equipment

 

[MichiganIron]

Manufacturers rate their equipment slightly differently. The KIOTI KL130 break-out force is listed as 2046 lbs. The KIOTI Break-out Force refers to the maximum calculated bucket rotation force at the pivot pins. The loader will seriously outlift the 1150 lbs it is rated to at full height, but won't lift 2046 lbs. with the boom cylinders alone. It would require a combination of the boom and bucket cylinders acting together to develop that force at the pivot pins, or break-out.