When did 2 stage clutches......

WilliamBos · Sep 12, 2009

Hi All,

When did 2 stage clutches make their appearance on tractors, and who was the first? I thought maybe the early 1950's, but wanted the check on here.

Farmwithjunk · Sep 13, 2009

Cockshutt Model 30, in 1945.

WilliamBos · Sep 13, 2009

Farmwithjunk said:
Cockshutt Model 30, in 1945.

Thank you Bill!!

RickB · Sep 13, 2009

Farmwithjunk said:
Cockshutt Model 30, in 1945.

Not true. The Cockshutt 30 WAS arguably the first tractor with INDEPENDENT PTO. But it does not have a two stage clutch. There is a live shaft running to the rear of the tractor which powers a separate, hand operated PTO clutch. Similar setup to an Oliver which debuted the same feature at about the same time. The Cockshutt 30 was Nebraska tested in 1947.

First double clutch could have been in 1955; the Ford 660/860. Or possibly the Ferguson Deluxe 35, whenever that came out. Probably we need to look to European tractors of the early fifties for the real answer.

dbear · Sep 13, 2009

I'm pretty sure our Golden Jubilee ('53 NAA) had a two stage.

Farmwithjunk · Sep 13, 2009

dbear said:
I'm pretty sure our Golden Jubilee ('53 NAA) had a two stage.

If it did, you have the ONLY Jube with a 2-stage clutch......

Farmwithjunk · Sep 13, 2009

RickB said:
Not true. The Cockshutt 30 WAS arguably the first tractor with INDEPENDENT PTO. But it does not have a two stage clutch. There is a live shaft running to the rear of the tractor which powers a separate, hand operated PTO clutch. Similar setup to an Oliver which debuted the same feature at about the same time. The Cockshutt 30 was Nebraska tested in 1947.

First double clutch could have been in 1955; the Ford 660/860. Or possibly the Ferguson Deluxe 35, whenever that came out. Probably we need to look to European tractors of the early fifties for the real answer.

Cockshutt 30 was Nebraska tested in 47, but was first sold in '45. (Not sold in USA until '47)

You're right about the 30 though, it's listed in several books, including "FArm Tractors, 1950-1975" authored by Lester Larson, Chief Engineer in charge of Nebraska TEst Labs back in the day, as "First tractor tested with INDEPENDENT PTO".

Deere Inc offered ind pto in 1952, on the 50, 60, and 70.

Larson also settled this question in the same book. The 1955 Ferguson TO35 gasoline was the very first tractor with a 2-stage clutch. I shoulda known ol' Harry had the jump on everyone else!!!! The first Fords with 2-stage clutch were almost a year after the Fergies.

Farmwithjunk · Sep 13, 2009

dbear said:
I'm pretty sure our Golden Jubilee ('53 NAA) had a two stage.

If it did, you have the ONLY Jube with a 2-stage clutch......cause they didn't have 'em from the factory

Soundguy · Sep 15, 2009

dbear said:
I'm pretty sure our Golden Jubilee ('53 NAA) had a two stage.

Negative on that.. as the others said.

there was an upgrade available.. a pinion clutch could be added and gave you a 'workable' setup that let you clutch the driveline with the 'hand clutch' while leaving the pto going.. to shift gear or engage pto, you still had to press the foot clutch.

hyd version that ran of fthe nose of the tach drive was available for the naa, and a manual version for the N series.

660 was the first ford with a true 2 stage clutch.

soundguy

DonWorrell · Sep 15, 2009

We owned a 1951 Allis Chalmbers CA which had a hand clutch which gave it a Live PTO but it didn't have a 2 stage clutch. Actually I don't like a 2 stage clutch I prefer the hand clutch like the WD-45 and John Deere A had.

Don

dbear · Sep 15, 2009

Soundguy said:
Negative on that.. as the others said.

there was an upgrade available.. a pinion clutch could be added and gave you a 'workable' setup that let you clutch the driveline with the 'hand clutch' while leaving the pto going.. to shift gear or engage pto, you still had to press the foot clutch.

hyd version that ran of fthe nose of the tach drive was available for the naa, and a manual version for the N series.

660 was the first ford with a true 2 stage clutch.

soundguy

Just realized it was probably the '58 841 we had that had the two-stage. Been too long since I was on either one...

Soundguy · Sep 16, 2009

Negative on that one as well.. the '4' in the 841 denotes a 4 spd trans.. single stage clutch.

a middle digit of '6' denotes a 2 stage clutch.. and on the later XX1 models.. a middle digit of 7/8 is the independent pto model

soundguy

Hemorrhage · Dec 25, 2010

Is it possible to install a 2 stage clutch on a jubilee? Thanks fellas

RickB · Dec 26, 2010

Hemorrhage said:
Is it possible to install a 2 stage clutch on a jubilee? Thanks fellas

The short answer is no.

Hemorrhage · Dec 27, 2010

Sorta assumed that might be the case. I'm a complete tractor rookie but have some friends involved in machining and hydraulics so any info is greatly appreciated

Ford tractor · Dec 27, 2010

RickB said:
The short answer is no.

And the long answer is YES. Just change the transmission from the Jub's 4 speed to a later model x50, x60, x51 or x61 transmission. You will probably need the differential too as the brake cross over was different in different years.

The "change is more of a fairly large swap of parts, but if you keep the fenders and paint correctly it will be very "jub-esque". A big PLUS is the later tractors have a much stronger rear end (Jub was known to bust pinion supports).

RickB · Dec 28, 2010

Ford tractor said:
And the long answer is YES. Just change the transmission from the Jub's 4 speed to a later model x50, x60, x51 or x61 transmission. You will probably need the differential too as the brake cross over was different in different years.

The "change is more of a fairly large swap of parts, but if you keep the fenders and paint correctly it will be very "jub-esque". A big PLUS is the later tractors have a much stronger rear end (Jub was known to bust pinion supports).

Add the correct hydraulic manifold to the required component list. The short answer is still no, but it doesn't surprise me that someone had to come along and point out the theoretical inaccuracy of the practical answer.
By the way, an x50 or x51 transmission housing won't provide the means to provide live PTO or a double clutch, and installing a transmission housing with a later model and serial number stamped in it makes the tractor a 661 or whatever with an NAA engine and fenders.

Soundguy · Dec 28, 2010

I agree.. swapping the back half of an *60 or *61 is really just an engine transplant. ya might get a beefier rear axle if the donor was an 860 or 861.. but it's alot of work. better to just start with the correct tractor model needed..

soundguy