Road Easement and HELP Update

[DennisArrow]

I also need to add is that the land above me that I just puchased is loaded with game, totally private and serene, on top of the mountain with a great view, the quarry is a great target practice berm, and once was FREE to use. Now that I own it and have shut it down I guess it is hard to accept...........Just my thoughts but THANKS........Dennis

 

[cowboy357]

Thats kind of what I thought Dennis , Thanks for clearing that up . It does get very upsetting I know .

We also have a river that runs through the back of our property Which the property owners Own to the center on both sides . but people canoing or floating down the river think its public ground.

I built a little park area down there I cant see from the house & People trespass & tear stuff up all the time even though its posted . Only when I can hear them yelling or playing do I know someones there & I run them off nicelly only to here this is a public river , which is not the case & puts me in not so friendlly of a mood . People just have little respect for others property or privacy these days its really sad.

I hope You get your problem resolved soon . It just isn,t right . Best of luck. Bob

 

[HCJtractor]

Thats kind of what I thought Dennis , Thanks for clearing that up . It does get very upsetting I know .

We also have a river that runs through the back of our property Which the property owners Own to the center on both sides . but people canoing or floating down the river think its public ground.

I built a little park area down there I cant see from the house & People trespass & tear stuff up all the time even though its posted . Only when I can hear them yelling or playing do I know someones there & I run them off nicelly only to here this is a public river , which is not the case & puts me in not so friendlly of a mood . People just have little respect for others property or privacy these days its really sad.

I hope You get your problem resolved soon . It just isn,t right . Best of luck. Bob

Cowboy I fully understand your concern but from what I have been told, a river cannot be private if it is navigable, and if canoes can be floated down it, it seems to be. I agree the shore line is your property. A buddy of mine was hired in our state to prove a river was not navigable (a property owner was trying to keep people out of his lake) He floated the river in a small kayak, and had to drag it and carry it in places, and he testified that no way could a boat float this river. The judge disagreed and declared the river navigable and allowed public access. I think that it is awfully hard to keep people from using a river. Historically the use of a river to navigate is protected by law, even if the navigation is for pleasure only. I also own river property, but I can't stop people from floating it, and doubt that you can legally do it either. I don't necessarily agree with this, but that is the law if I understand it correctly. Rivers are different than easements and roads.

 

[Tig]

I have heard the navigable waters discussion before. I think the detail is that SOME riverbeds are actually deeded, as cowboy mentioned. In that case floating may be OK, but don't step out of the boat or run it ashore. In that case a beaver felled tree may solve the problem.
Again, a local attorney will have the facts.

 

[JayCat]

DennisArrow
I had a similar situation to yours on a smaller scale. The wording of our deeds was key since it said the other owner had the easement provided "Access for ingress and egress." If it had said the owner had only "access" to the easement then they could camp out on it etc.

The useless township supervisor was trying to make me out to be unreasonable by "controlling" the side of my land where the easement was located. My answer to him was this: I was under the mistaken impression since the easement was included in the land description of my deed that it was my land. Since you say it is not &I have been paying taxes on it for 10 years....I would to be reimbursed with interest by the end of the month. Before he could react...I added: Since you say it's not my land and I know it's not the neighbor's land...it must be a township road....when can I expect the township to begin maintaining the road? There are lots of things it needs......etc

He changed his mind.

If you haven't already, document EVERYTHING. Don't leave this up to your attorney. Show a paper trail history of your efforts to reach out and solve this. It's a pain but keep notes on everything the county, township, power company.... etc tells you. I had my neighbor lie to the power company about the property line and one day I came home and there was a new power pole in my yard!

J

 

[dmccarty]

Regarding access to rivers via navigation rights. It depends on the state. From what I have read in CO if you own the stream bed you own the river. Floating on the river can be treated as trespass. I read this a good decade ago so take it with some salt.

And what is considered navigable is debatable as well and will depend on state and maybe Federal law. What applies in one state might not be the law in another. Check a local legal beagle.

Back to the main subject.

If your post is on his land I think you have a problem.

Our land has a gravel road up the middle of the property. The property was subdivided into lots of 5ish acres but the land does not perk very well so it can't be cheaply built on. The developer lost some money on this 20-30 years ago. The first thing I did when we close was to put up a cable to block access. Eventually I put up a more permanent fence and gate. Because of the lay of the land and the road two sections of board fence 8 feet long and two 10 foot pipe gates work to close of the road.

Where the gate/fence is located I own the land on both sides of the road. People can and do come up to the gate. If it is open they will sometimes drive up to our house even though it is a GATE with several posted signs.

But since We own all of the land past the gate nobody has a reason to be up on the road. And we own the road. The lot lines go to the center line of the road.

If your "neighbors don't own land off the road I don't see how they can use the road. If you own both sides of the road I would just gate it and move on to the next set of problems which will be keeping the idiots off your land. I have cleared some of the property lines and I have put in T posts to mark my corners. Someone stole my T posts. They did not tear down the posted signs but they stole the T posts.

I have not decided if I will buy longer Tposts, say 8 footers and drive them four feet into the ground or just buy long lengths of rebar to put in the ground. The rebar might be easier to drive real deep.

Good Luck,
Dan