Voltage reducer for Glow plug?

[Michelxb]

Hello

I am restoring an Inter B414. (1964)
Near all wire are disconnected.

The wire between glow plugs are all "hand made with wire"
There is no glow plug switch.
Glow plug "light" and glow plugs are new.

Since the voltage for the glow plug must be 0.9 volt ( It is written on the glow plug), how and where the voltage pass from 12 v to 0.9 volt?
A 12 volts will burn the glow plug indicator (light) or even the glow plug.

In the glow plug switch?
By a special wire between glow plugs witch would drop the voltage?
It is not easy (until now) for me to find parts for the B414.

I am new in diesel things and would appreciate any help.

Thanks

 

[Soundguy]

I think you may be misreading or misunderstanding the glow pluig spec you are reading.

.9v wouldn't produce significant wattage for the purpose of a glow plug. it's an incandescent heating element... jigh current, low duty cycle. if the machine was originally 12v.. I doubt there is much fuss you need to make as long as the wireing is sufficient gauge.

soundguy

 

[Michelxb]

I think the same as you but.... 12 volt blow the plug and also the "light" incadescent r駸istor on the panel!

 

[DANOCHEESE]

.9 volt seems odd. take one of the plugs and hook it to a AAA battery I doubt you will get much heat. Glow plugs take juice to create heat.

Maybe .9k as in resistance of the plug.

What do you mean by they keep blowing? Are they burning the tips off?

 

[unimog_jason]

Do your plugs look like this:

http://img.eautopartscatalog.com/live/W01331632205BOS.JPG

Loop plugs are typically either 1.2V or .9V and must be wired in series. These plugs were very common in Mercedes diesels up to 1979 when they changed over to 12V parallel pencil plugs.

http://img.eautopartscatalog.com/live/W01331632882BOS.JPG

You are correct that you require a voltage dropping resistor on the front end otherwise you'll burn the plugs up in pretty short order.

The loop plugs are painfully slow, if you have the ability I'd recommend looking for a set of pencil plugs and upgrade. On some of my engines I've tossed the loop plugs and installed the parallel plugs and the engine will start quicker and easier.

Jason

 

[Michelxb]

.9 volt seems odd. take one of the plugs and hook it to a AAA battery I doubt you will get much heat. Glow plugs take juice to create heat.

Maybe .9k as in resistance of the plug.

What do you mean by they keep blowing? Are they burning the tips off?

Yes they burning the tips off when I try on 12 volt.
Sorry but english is not my first language so ...

It is 0.9 v.

Thanks

 

[Michelxb]

Do your plugs look like this:

http://img.eautopartscatalog.com/live/W01331632205BOS.JPG

Loop plugs are typically either 1.2V or .9V and must be wired in series. These plugs were very common in Mercedes diesels up to 1979 when they changed over to 12V parallel pencil plugs.

http://img.eautopartscatalog.com/live/W01331632882BOS.JPG

You are correct that you require a voltage dropping resistor on the front end otherwise you'll burn the plugs up in pretty short order.

The loop plugs are painfully slow, if you have the ability I'd recommend looking for a set of pencil plugs and upgrade. On some of my engines I've tossed the loop plugs and installed the parallel plugs and the engine will start quicker and easier.

Jason

In fact it is this plug.
I just bought 4 new and it is much $ so I will try to make them work even if they are slow.

I think that I need a resistor that will drop de 12v in 0.9v and let much watts through.

Thanks for advice.

 

[kenstrac]

Maybe I'M missing something here but how do you run those plugs in series?

The lower voltage plugs that I have used were in series with the indicator and that acted as the resistor.

 

[Michelxb]

Maybe I'M missing something here but how do you run those plugs in series?

The lower voltage plugs that I have used were in series with the indicator and that acted as the resistor.

Yes it is like this on the B414

I test the indicator alone to test it and it burn.
The circuit is :
battery to glow plug switch to indicator (a resistance that will be red when hot) to the first glow plug to the second one to the third to the fourth to the tractor body.
Is the resistence of all the plugs and the indicator will drop 12v to 0.9 volt?
Or do I have to put a resistor or something else that will do the job?
Is the swith (that I don't have has this "something" that will do the job?

I saw in book that on this tractor the body is connected to the PLUS of the battery but I connect it like we usualy do body (ground) to Negative. Curious!!!!

 

[Transit]

This is not a difficult problem to solve, however we need more information. What is the current in amps when the plugs are working?

 

[kenstrac]

Yes it is like this on the B414

I test the indicator alone to test it and it burn.
The circuit is :
battery to glow plug switch to indicator (a resistance that will be red when hot) to the first glow plug to the second one to the third to the fourth to the tractor body.
Is the resistence of all the plugs and the indicator will drop 12v to 0.9 volt?
Or do I have to put a resistor or something else that will do the job?
Is the swith (that I don't have has this "something" that will do the job?

I saw in book that on this tractor the body is connected to the PLUS of the battery but I connect it like we usualy do body (mass) to Negative. Curious!!!!

the power goes into a switch then to 1 side of indicator the other side of the indicator goes to the glow plugs YOU CAN NOT test glow plugs or indicator individual w/12Volts you will burn them up.
BTW it was pos to body from the factory if you change polarity you will have to flash the field on the generator and the regulator

How many terminals on each glow plug the one that Jason posted only has 1

http://cngco.com/wiring_diagrams/IH 3414-B414-B275.pdf

 

[Michelxb]

Thank you for the diagram.

Mine have only one "cable" from the glow plug indicator to the first plug and one wire goes to the second plug and so on.

There is no more generator it is an alternator now.

I must review my old electricity book.
I think that resistance add on all the circuit in series.
Perhaps, just connect all the plugs and the "indicator" and all will be fine. I just don't want to spent an other 50$ on that little wire (indicator) if it does burn again.


Transit, I don't know how many amps... the plugs were not working when I bought the tractor.

Thank all for trying an answer for MY problem.

Here it is when I received it:
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s137/michelxb/Tracteur/IMG_3280.jpg

 

[Transit]

Looking at the Loop Plugs again, each plug has only one terminal to connect to a power source. Current enters at the terminal and leaves by way of the plug body. There would have to be two terminals for each plug in order to connect them in series. The diagram shows the plugs in PARALLEL, connected with the terminals to a common bus and grounded in common to the engine block.

 

[Michelxb]

I just refreshed my electricity knowledge and in fact, we must add resistance when in series. So voltage is reduce bye each glow plug and the resistor of the "indicator" in the dash panel.

It seems that all I have to do is to put a switch in the circuit of the indicator and the 4 glow plugs that are in series and it will be fine. I am looking for explanation on Internet that will describe the plug Champion 155 but nothing for now.
On the glow plug we can see: Champion/ch28/0.9v/068//

 

[Michelxb]

Looking at the Loop Plugs again, each plug has only one terminal to connect to a power source. Current enters at the terminal and leaves by way of the plug body. There would have to be two terminals for each plug in order to connect them in series. The diagram shows the plugs in PARALLEL, connected with the terminals to a common bus and grounded in common to the engine block.

For mine Champion 155...
No, it is not by the body. Current enter by the end of the plug and there is ceramic and the other wire is there not having contact with the body. It is very near but it is not the body. I made the same mistake the first time when I take my multimeter.

 

[unimog_jason]

The way you have to wire a Bosch loop plug is a little tricky if you don't have the proper info close at hand.

These plugs do not ground through the body, there are two terminal at the top of the plug. There is a ceramic insulator that keeps the two terminal isolated, if you missing those insulators that's the first problem you need to correct.

http://img.eautopartscatalog.com/live/W01331638701BOS.JPG

If your books don't explain how to wire up the plugs I can likely get a diagram from one of my Mercedes engine manuals that will give you enough info to get the job done.

Tracking down a voltage dropping coil might be hard. I know it can be sourced from Mercedes, but I'm sure you could convert the system to parallel plugs for about the same amount of money and you'll get an automatic controller too. Google part # W0133-1606011 to see it.

If you want to go cheap you could just buy 4 plugs, part # 0 250 201 044 and use the old switch and completely eliminate the need for the dropping coil. That's all I've ever done on my engines and it works great.

Jason

 

[Transit]

Any chance of you posting a photo?

 

[Transit]

Try this diagram.

 

[Michelxb]

The way you have to wire a Bosch loop plug is a little tricky if you don't have the proper info close at hand.

These plugs do not ground through the body, there are two terminal at the top of the plug. There is a ceramic insulator that keeps the two terminal isolated, if you missing those insulators that's the first problem you need to correct.

http://img.eautopartscatalog.com/live/W01331638701BOS.JPG

If your books don't explain how to wire up the plugs I can likely get a diagram from one of my Mercedes engine manuals that will give you enough info to get the job done.

Tracking down a voltage dropping coil might be hard. I know it can be sourced from Mercedes, but I'm sure you could convert the system to parallel plugs for about the same amount of money and you'll get an automatic controller too. Google part # W0133-1606011 to see it.

If you want to go cheap you could just buy 4 plugs, part # 0 250 201 044 and use the old switch and completely eliminate the need for the dropping coil. That's all I've ever done on my engines and it works great.

Jason

I know, it is what I wrote. The plugs are new and the ceramic are there.

Thanks for information about the bosh in parallel. It would have been sheaper for me and more effective but like I said i have all new plugs and indicator now so I will install that in series.
Thanks again.

 

[Michelxb]

Try this diagram.

Yes, it is like that. Since I do not have original glow plug switch I will find something to replace it and try all that... but not tomorrow I go fishing...

Thank you.