PTO???

gordyy · Apr 29, 2009

haha the gear versus hst is almost as good as the joystick versus 4 valves
I remember back in the days they were just introducing the joystick
the owner of the company I worked for showed up the second day I was working a brand new white TLB walked to the side to watch seen me with a hand on each control and went ballistic.
and I still know a guy or two who will spend thousands to change out the valves on a new TLB

Soundguy · Apr 30, 2009

Altex said:
In case you didn't know, The point here is NOT comparing different Operators. The point is comparing equipment, Gear vs. HST. The same Operator in a Gear Tractor vs. the same Operator in an HST Tractor. This is what Operator/Buyer wants to know when buying a tractor. Which is faster, more effcient.

.

I got the point just fine.. I think the point you are not getting is that either machine will perform just fine at mowing.. so long as the operator's brain is engaged before he starts touching the tractor controls.

It's common sense.. if you are on a gear machine, you don't choose a route that makes you backup and change directions constantly.. if you are on an HSt.. you CAN backup and change directions alot. I'd wager that the small amount of overlap on the 'forward only' gear machine isn't too much more of a time waister than the stop and direction change on the hst, when you boil it all down at the end of a large job.

Also keep in mind My idea of a mowing machine is a 15' batwing mower... Backing and making kick turns isn't my idea of the best use of that mower.. thus i plan accordingly. If there was a tree in the way.. due to the size of the mower, either machine is going to have to make a few extra maneuvers to get all the grass knocked down... for an hst that might mean a series of back and forths.. for a gear.. it might mean a single pass at the end of the job in a direction perpendicular to the tree to catch the leading and trailing cone sections that could not be picked up head on.

I'm not sure why ou think gear mowing tractors suddenly became obsolete as soon as hst machines were invented??.. for that application with the specifics i mentioned.. there ain't alot of difference. If there are tons of obstacles and blind aeas to cut.. etc.. I won't be mowing it with a batwing anwyay!

soundguy

Gittyup · Apr 30, 2009

I think the OP probably has enough info on HST v. gear to make up their own minds.

MMagis · Apr 30, 2009

Altex said:
So with Gear, you have that spiral effect where you run over ground that has already been cut on the ends of the field.

Add trees or other obstacles to Gear and you're running over more ground that has already been cut.

With HST you don't have to run over ground that has already been cut.

So which is faster?

I have to say, it seems you've never actually used a gear tractor. I wouldn't say that one is better than the other, but your sketches make absolutely no sense. Why in the world would anyone mow in those patterns? Did you make those up to prove a point? If so, I don't get it I guess.

greenmule · Apr 30, 2009

Not only have at least a couple of these guys not ever used a gear tractor before to cut with,they probably ain't cut over a 1/2 acre at a time with their hst's.[probably just their yards].

They can't even argue the facts.Because a few here evidently,don't know the facts,but they keep on yipping anyways.

Soundguy · Apr 30, 2009

greenmule said:
Not only have at least a couple of these guys not ever used a gear tractor before to cut with,they probably ain't cut over a 1/2 acre at a time with their hst's.[probably just their yards].

They can't even argue the facts.Because a few here evidently,don't know the facts,but they keep on yipping anyways.

Heck what do we know!

.. I mean.. some of us use our tractors primarilly to mow. I know my NH 7610s and 15' batwing, and my ford 5000 and 10' mower.. those tractors don't do anything -BUT- mow...

soundguy

phyxer · Apr 30, 2009

Personally I think we've reached the point where we all whip 'em out and see who's is the biggest! Clearly there is no longer any education going on.

Troy

greenmule · Apr 30, 2009

I'm in trouble than.

Altex · Apr 30, 2009

Soundguy said:
Heck what do we know! .. I mean.. some of us use our tractors primarilly to mow. I know my NH 7610s and 15' batwing, and my ford 5000 and 10' mower.. those tractors don't do anything -BUT- mow...

soundguy

Focus guys. Fact: The Original Poster needed info for a tractor on 12.5 acres to do other things besides mowing, like FEL, PHD, Backhoe, etc... So with your statement above are you suggesting them to get a big Gear Tractor with a 15' Batwing or 10' Mower? How's that going to help with the other tasks?

Ever heard of "It's not what you know. It's how you use, what you know." Or, "Right tool for the job."

Seems like if someone asked you advice for tools/hammer to built a small dog house, you'd say "Get a Sludge Hammer. I can out Hammer any other kind of hammer with it."

greenmule · Apr 30, 2009

When we going to show them,wanta get this over with.

polo1665 · May 1, 2009

greenmule said:
When we going to show them,wanta get this over with.

If you really want to, I think you'll have to find a different website

I tend to think that the nice lady who posted the original question is reading all of this thinking "What have I started now".

Mark

greenmule · May 1, 2009

He started it.

greggh · May 1, 2009

I think the issue will not be solved in this forum.

It all revolves just like the color discussion, or the HP discussions, or the R!, R4 tire discussion. Every one has their favorite choice because of the work they do. HST is probably good for a CUT or the weekend user, and the gear with a shuttle shift is better for a full time farmer. I don't know that one any is better than the other, I don't have HST so I can't really compare. They both will do the job I guess. Probably the question is most of your work going to be contractor type work (Backhoe and FEL) or is it to be farm work (haying, tilling soil, etc). Once that decision is made, I think the choices are the brand and size of the tractor and that's another fight to begin.

Just my 2 cents.

Soundguy · May 2, 2009

The mower / tractor combo sugestions came later, in response to different comments other than the original poster.

besides.. the ability to use a larg(er) mower on a piece of land is an individual situation... flat open land.. even smaller parcels can use larger mowers where being nimble isn't a requirement.

if I had 12ac of forest and wanted to mow walking trails.. I might think a kubota BX / SCUT sized tractor and 44/48" mower was the right deal...

If I had 12ac of fallow pasture that needed brush beat down, and I had to do it often and had little time.. then sure.. 10+ is fine.. .. I mow my 13.2 ac with that 15' or 10' mower.. havn't had a problem yet.. my main concern was time.. I had to quit waisting a day a week on mowing fields.. had to drop that to a 'before lunch' job so I could get other chores done on my farm in a timely manner.

again.. choose equipment based on application...

soundguy

Altex said:
Focus guys. Fact: The Original Poster needed info for a tractor on 12.5 acres to do other things besides mowing, like FEL, PHD, Backhoe, etc... So with your statement above are you suggesting them to get a big Gear Tractor with a 15' Batwing or 10' Mower? How's that going to help with the other tasks?

Ever heard of "It's not what you know. It's how you use, what you know." Or, "Right tool for the job."

Seems like if someone asked you advice for tools/hammer to built a small dog house, you'd say "Get a Sludge Hammer. I can out Hammer any other kind of hammer with it."

Soundguy · May 2, 2009

phyxer said:
Personally I think we've reached the point where we all whip 'em out and see who's is the biggest! Clearly there is no longer any education going on.

Troy

If you think no 'education' is still occuring by the peacefull discussion of what machine fits what application.. then you might have missed the boat at the dock...

still plenty of value in this thread... from all involved parties..

soundguy

Altex · May 2, 2009

Soundguy said:
The mower / tractor combo sugestions came later, in response to different comments other than the original poster.

besides.. the ability to use a larg(er) mower on a piece of land is an individual situation... flat open land.. even smaller parcels can use larger mowers where being nimble isn't a requirement.

if I had 12ac of forest and wanted to mow walking trails.. I might think a kubota BX / SCUT sized tractor and 44/48" mower was the right deal...

If I had 12ac of fallow pasture that needed brush beat down, and I had to do it often and had little time.. then sure.. 10+ is fine.. .. I mow my 13.2 ac with that 15' or 10' mower.. havn't had a problem yet.. my main concern was time.. I had to quit waisting a day a week on mowing fields.. had to drop that to a 'before lunch' job so I could get other chores done on my farm in a timely manner.

again.. choose equipment based on application...

soundguy

I understand and agree with ya for the most part. The original poster did say they had "numerous trees", with a 2 pond project to improve on and "digging trenches and burying lines for water, spetic and electric". For a 10' cutter and tractor to support that, knowing that they had numerous trees, might be a little big for a total of 12.5 acres which includes the 2 ponds and house area.

I think a SCUT(Sub-compact utility tractor <25HP) is too small. For something between a forest and flat open land I believe a CUT(Compact utility tractor 25-50HP) seems like a better fit. But you could go even bigger if you perferred. The reason I suggest HST over Gear was because of the trees when mowing, and the other tasks of diggin.

Soundguy said:
If you think no 'education' is still occuring by the peacefull discussion of what machine fits what application.. then you might have missed the boat at the dock...

still plenty of value in this thread... from all involved parties..

soundguy

I agree also. There may be Way Too much information that the Original Poster wanted. But, better too much than not enough. It's all about the info.

Peace.

greenmule · May 2, 2009

Trees don't bother me none when mowing,you just make passes [this side this pass,this side this pass],if I had a hst wouldn't do it any different.

I got alot of trees in my yard,my lawn mower is hst/hydro,never back up with it unless you just have too,always maintain speed and make passes with it,just like a gear tractor.

Talk about wasteing time,if you back up with anything,hst or gear,you waste time,its like soundguy said,you got to plan your route,figure out your most time saving way to mow,backing up is not it.
Think you need a little more time in the saddle,myself,before you tell us how to mow grass.

Altex · May 2, 2009

greenmule said:
Trees don't bother me none when mowing,you just make passes [this side this pass,this side this pass],if I had a hst wouldn't do it any different...

Mowing and mowing, I get your point of view.

*But, how about the other things they need: Maintaining 2 Ponds, improve swampy areas, digging Post Holes, "digging trenches and burying lines for water, spetic and electric" probably with backhoe, FEL and Boxblade and other tasks. I'm saying HST would be better than Gear for all the work needed.

greenmule said:
Talk about wasteing time,if you back up with anything,hst or gear,you waste time...

Really? So when you pick up a load with your FEL, you then run over the pile you get it from? And after you dump it, you again continue forward over what you dump? And this saves time?

Oh I see, I guess you are only talking about mowing again. Here's an example that saves time backing up with mowing. Towards the end of cutting a section or a section with obstacles, have you ever had a long small strip maybe 3'-4' wide left over? With Gear you have to turn your tractor all the way around and come back to hit that. With HST just pedal back with your foot (reverse) as you turn the wheel sightly and it's gone in seconds. No changing hands and no shifting. This really does save time and if you have more obstacles, the more time you save.

greenmule · May 2, 2009

Well,well,well, And well, again. you don't think a gear tractor can post hole drill and use a backhoe,just as well as hst,??

Like I said,you ain't got enough time in the saddle,bet you ain't ever put 500 hours combined on any type tractor,just guessing from your remarks,me and you have talked enough about this,I'll give you the last weird tirade.