You gotta read this!!

point · Mar 29, 2004

I called Gary from Emerybuilt and asked him if he had heard of any problems with the jinma front end breaking when you attach a FEL to the 400 series
He sent me this reply
Apparently Koyker put a FEL on a 400 serise
they put 3000Lbs in the bucket and let the bucket down as fast as they could
Then stopped the bucket before it hit the ground
And the front end broke
Let me knoew what you think
Point

SPIKER · Mar 29, 2004

hmmm 3000 lbs into the bucket of a tractor that weighs a little over 4K. well I'm impressed that it lifted that much! and if you dropped it fast and stopped the weight of inirita (spelling?) would mean if the 3K weight was dropping at 3 feet per sec then the stoping weight would be problably closer to 7K load applied on a JOLT and probably I would assume would break a hyd line or blow a valve but snapping the front end if it was done this way may not be out of the question.

not to mention there can be manufacture defects on just about anything.

Mark M

Soundguy · Mar 29, 2004

That's the point.. the FEL probably can't lift 3000# ( or even close to it ).. but can hold it if placed into the bucket that is already lifted.. Ive seen this with large construction fel.. that couldn't lift a large tree stump laying on the ground.. but the backhoe could lift the stump into the bucket.. and then the loader operator drove it over to the burn pile and curled the bucket and let the stump role out..

Soundguy

Bob_Skurka · Mar 29, 2004

No big surprise. You abuse any piece of equipment and it will fail.

However, I question the ability of the event to have even occured, or if it did occur, then we don't have the whole story. 3000 pounds of weight in a loader bucket that is not capable of lifting that amount of weight, placed in front and over the front end of a fairly small tractor will simply lift the rear tires of the tractor and tip the entire machine forward. Or, presuming that there was a couple thousand pounds of counterweight on the rear end to hold it on the ground, we are back to the extreme abuse concept because we are taking a tractor that might weigh a couple thousand pound, we are putting a couple thousand pounds of ballast on it, and we are loading the loader with 3000 more pounds? So we have more weight on the tractor than the tractor actually weighs.

Somehow I question the event. But if it did happen, then the surprise is the operator of the tractor is not in the hospital, not that the tractor broke.

rockinmywaypa · Mar 29, 2004

I think it reminded me of when I was a teen and driving one of our tractors down the road. this was one that had a pretty quick road gear and I had it wound out, probably around 25 mph. Well the stub on the front axle broke, front end dropped on that side and dug in, swung the tractor across to the opposite side of the road and into the ditch. By the time I got it stopped I was a ft from a big maple that wasn't about to move.Boy it scared the living daylights out of me and all I could think of was how much trouble I was in for breaking it.

bluechip · Mar 30, 2004

It may be that somebody wanted too large a loader installed on the 400 sereis but if the standard 160 can lift 1500 lbs the 245 can pick up quite abit more (My book is at the office) testing at 150 to 200% of spec is not out of line.

Koyker does test each loader installation that they design. Breakout forces typically exceed lift capacities of loaders. I doubt they did anything unusual on the 400 sereis Jinma. I know when they engineered the kits for our KAMA tractors, they recommended a larger pump, and we have now made that standard. (The factory was already using a larger pump when they installed their loaders anyway).

I don't think we can blame Koyker that the tractor broke, just MHO.

point · Mar 30, 2004

Bluechip
so is it the tractor or the FEL?

Tractors4u · Mar 30, 2004

Is the 400 series a new model? Koyker doesn't typically install loaders unless it is a new model tractor that they would like a frame template of in order to develop mounting brackets for. A friend of mine imports Yanmars and Jinmas and is currently Koykers biggest customer. At one time it was common for Koyker to pick up one of his tractors when they made a delivery to him and take it back to South Dakota to design a bracket for a model they had never laid hands on before and then return the tractor with his next load. I don't see Koyker being in the loader installation business other than for R&D. There may be more to this story.

JohnS · Mar 31, 2004

Yep, 400 series is new and imagine it was being fitted at their location for just what you said. They once contacted me, thinking I was a factory rep, to try to get in the loop with new changes on existing and new series of tractors. They seem to be very proactive.

JohnS

bluechip · Apr 1, 2004

Is it the tractor or the loader? THat is not as easy as it sounds,
Should a 45HP tractor be able to lift and handle 2000 lbs with a 50% safty margin?

I guess I lighter loader would be one solution. If the factory has since beefed up the axle housings, than that is another, maybe someone should try it again.

I understand it is was a prototype installation, koyker does not install as a normal course of business. we recently sent KAMA tractors for fitting the same way.