HoyeTractor
Gold Member, Approved Advertiser
The lawsuit specifically targets the sale of "Zen-Noh" tractors as well.
Comparison Yanmar lawsuit.
- Thread starter georgia tractor company
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So is it just me or is this a direct result of Yanmar USA selling US spec tractors in the US again and not wanting to compete with itself with the gray market tractors? One thing I see in the suit is they dont include a tractors age that is a problem in other legal areas as well besides trademark infringement IMO. Looks like UTDA dealers will be ok?
Gale Hawkins
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I do not have or ever driven any Yanmar.
Of all the well supported used tractors on the market today what drives someone to buy a grey market or non gray market Yanmar in the USA?
The ones that I see look to be about 18 HP but I assume they are great tractors in some types of farming.
Of all the well supported used tractors on the market today what drives someone to buy a grey market or non gray market Yanmar in the USA?
The ones that I see look to be about 18 HP but I assume they are great tractors in some types of farming.
California
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John Deere quality at 1/3 the price. (Yanmar built Deere's smaller models for a couple of decades).
These aren't well matched to the sort of farming you likely need the MF 265 for. They are more in the smaller chore tractor category. One of my US Yanmars was originally bought for chores around a riding stable when it was new. The other one was last used only for snow removal at a long rural driveway. Think of the applications for a skid steer instead of a farm tractor; these fit more in that category rather than plowing etc. (But excellent for rototilling, with their high HP/weight ratio.)
The models that Yanmar used to sell here, and most of the gray models brought over subsequently, are extremely simple durable designs. They run years before they need anything and then repairs are about as simple as fixing a flat tire. Many don't have, and don't need, a water pump. Few have a fuel lift pump or fuel shutoff solenoid. The earlier ones don't have thermostats. The gas gauge is generally a float built as part of the fuel fill cap. (or often a transparent tank and no gauge). I used to do my own auto maintenance 30 years ago before cars became complicated. The maintenance and minor renovations I've done on my 30 year old Yanmars matches my (amateur) skill level. Parts have never been a problem, but the new owner should recognize that all parts are mailorder so these aren't suitable for use where it is critical to have replacement parts the same afternoon.
Your topic of 'Why Yanmar' really deserves its own thread, since this new issue of dealers being sued is critical to the continued use of Yanmars already imported here.
Marauderer
Bronze Member
I have a new Yanmar 2012 Sc2450 and I really like it. I picked Yanmar because of the dealer. The other SCUT dealers were not friendly and why pay more for a unit just to have a different color. I live in Powder Springs which is less than 50 mi from the Yanmar USA assembly Factory in Adairsville, GA. I bought my Yanmar from the Cub Cadet Dealer in Cartersville, GA. If I had bought it last year it would have been the same unit but all the manuals, decals and paint would have said Cub Cadet Yanmar (CCY). It is my understanding that all the Cub Cadet Dealers will now be also Yanmar dealers for the same units that use to be sold under the CCY name. The only dealers that Yanmar USA is going after are those dealers that are selling the gray models as a new unit and are not a Yanmar authorized dealer. If I was a corporation and I had US exclusive rights to a product I wouldn't want anyone else horning in on my territory.
JMNSHO!
JMNSHO!
Gale Hawkins
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Thanks. I to like simple things at do the job year after year and it sounds like Yanmar got it right many years ago.
Simplicity and reliability is what sells them and thats by word of mouth from a Yanmar owner normally. Unless a person is doing a lot of research they will most likely not run across the Yanmar name or even see one up close. I am in JD country and most of them dont know what Yanmar is they dont even know their JD CUT has one powering theirs until I tell them after they ask me about mine!
The smaller gray market units like say 18 hp are excellent for landscapers and small property owners who dont want to spend $20 grand on a green garden tractor.
I cant disagree with the competition idea except there aren't any authorized gray market dealers never were the grays are completely on their own. The US spec Yanmars are supported by Yanmar still is my understanding but grays are specifically discouraged at the US Yanmar dealers and JD for that matter.
And we are ALL disgusted at the dealers that represent these 30 yo machines as new low hours tractors I expect the VN dealers to get slammed next. I realize Big Red was selling VN imports but I mean the actual VN dealers jmho.
clemsonfor
Super Member
I too think its crazy casue most of the ones selling Greys dont have Giant yanmar signs out front or anything. Its the same thing as the guy with a used car lot or the mecanic that rebuilds old chevy trucks or cars and sells them. There new looking but not new, even when putting a new gauge cluseter in its still not new, nor does it look new. Same with my 1979 tractor, other than new looking paint which really was not all that good, the thing dont look new? I mean looks nothing like a 2009 tractor when i bought mine.
But to yanmars defense, it worked for Kubota. No more (grey market)Kubotas can be imported into america, they will stay at the dock in impoundment when opened. The ones here were before the lawsuit.
But to yanmars defense, it worked for Kubota. No more (grey market)Kubotas can be imported into america, they will stay at the dock in impoundment when opened. The ones here were before the lawsuit.
California
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Vina of Texas was named as a defendant in one of the summaries I found from Aaron's Google link. I wouldn't be surprised if Vina wholesales one third or more of the VN "New Rebuilt only 18 hours 2009 model" type of imports.
The ability of a trademark holder to absolutely control use of that trademark is established in US law. Most firms don't go overboard on this, but it seems Yanmar has decided to wipe clean the public image of their brand, ie to prohibit the 'rebuilt' vendors from using their name. There is some justification in this. The Vietnam rebuild factories have no access at all to genuine Yanmar parts so all of their 'new rebuilt' tractors are assembled out of God-knows-what. Or not rebuilt at all.
It will be interesting to see if the UTDA dealers are included in these suits. (They pledge to modify their Yanmar gray imports up to US safety standards before sale.) Also the vendors of replica replacement parts for Yanmars. Does anybody here know about that?
Marauderer
Bronze Member
No, only those that are seriously misrepresenting the product. RTFT!!
I would be having my lawyers looking at every piece of paper on this lawsuit now if I was a dealer and getting ready for the hammer to fall just sayin...sucks for us guys with these decent old tractors and the dealers that did it right. Seems a bad apple spoils it for everyone like it usually goes. They cant control the aftermarket or the used parts market I am pretty sure of that just trademark stuff with Yanmar etc on it. maybe wrong
(were we not just talking about repro Yanmar emblems and decals D'OH!!!)
(were we not just talking about repro Yanmar emblems and decals D'OH!!!)
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Quite frankly I wish I could walk into a local Yanmar dealer now and see my next brand new tractor or find a good 10 year old Yanmar tractor on the lot and be able to trade mine in etc and get parts at a moments notice like JD etc.
There are advantages for manufacturers and folks having US spec tractors and granted it will be awhile but its coming and it will be an interesting race for consumers dollars look at Toyota and Honda. my .002
(and I didn't buy my tractor at the wholesale price like lots of people do which makes these attractive either keep that in mind. I paid what I could have bought a 6 yo 45 hp JD mfwd w/loader for which says I am a Yanmar fan)
There are advantages for manufacturers and folks having US spec tractors and granted it will be awhile but its coming and it will be an interesting race for consumers dollars look at Toyota and Honda. my .002
(and I didn't buy my tractor at the wholesale price like lots of people do which makes these attractive either keep that in mind. I paid what I could have bought a 6 yo 45 hp JD mfwd w/loader for which says I am a Yanmar fan)
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tb8100
Silver Member
I wonder why they're nailing resellers and not just importers. Curious if their purpose is to shut dealers down, change the labels, or just quit selling the product. And then the question is, do dealers have recourse against VN?
Read The Freaking Title? Text? = whatever... Used is Used and will always have a prior name. Refurbished is still Used. Why stop it at OUR Boarder after they have been paid? Tell them stop shipments from leaving their ports, they can destroy and use them for scrap, not much money that way hugh.
only gives me the thought that Yanmar is muscling its way over the YANMAR Grey Market popularity for its New line and debut.
There is NO forum here on TBN for the YANMAR 2012 and future tractors. (maybe there will be, or NEW LINE owners will squeeze in) J.D. SCUT and CUT (YANMAR) guys ask questions once in awhile.
Are they going to wipe out the grey owner posts because they claim YANMAR? This part of the forum would be emptied.
YANMAR makes a real nice, fuel efficient Diesel Outboard Motor that cannot be purchased in the US, why? YANMAR Diesel Inboard motors abound. This marketing stuff has me looking into ordering from Indonesia in spite.
Makes me think about the Mattress and Pillow tags that took years to finally claim it is OK for the buyer to remove it.
I should have stayed away from the keyboard and submit reply button, but the "RTFT"........
Marauderer
Bronze Member
Sorry if I offended you my reference acronym was "Read the **^%$ whole thread first. Not just the title. And yes I have an 012 Yanmar and I have a lot of respect for the Grey Market as it provides good tractors at a modest price which is really great in this day and age. But, there are points to be made and we could get into a big discussion on the import/export laws of our country vs. other countrys and it is another bag of worms.
Again sorry if I offended you but it didn't seem like you had read the complete thread before your comments.
Again sorry if I offended you but it didn't seem like you had read the complete thread before your comments.
clemsonfor
Super Member
Will ford or massed be sued next, how about IH, or AC, JD? There are hundreds of old tractors restored each year, many sold. They dont have PTO shields on them some do not have an internal PTO clutch (so they need ORC) or roll bars?
houstonscott
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I don't think Yanmar understands US market. Just paint them red and cream, and bring them into the country. We have waited 50 years for this to happen. No one will care a bit about used machines when the new ones hit the shore in the right color scheme. Dumb that yellow/black cub color and bring them in, we are all just waiting to get our hands on them. As for the outboards bring those too. And slip that BMW/Yanmar 6er into a tractor for me.....
HS
HS
I wonder if there might be another motive for the suit. Is it possible they don't want to win, but instead just want to establish court records saying that they denounce the grey market products so that they won't be held liable in the future for any damages caused by such non-compliant products?
xtn
xtn
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