woodpiles

[fractal]

I have the oportunity to pick up a half cord of not-quite cured oak for under market prices and figured I would build a wood pile to age it. Since a half cord is a stack of wood 8 ft long by 4 ft high by 2 ft deep, and most of what I have bought from this guy is much less than 2 ft long, I was kinda figuring on something about 12 ft long and 4 ft tall to handle the 12 to 18 inch logs. I have read that you should keep your wood pile a bit away from the house to keep vermin away, the wood pile should allow good ventilation but should provide protection from rain (snow is not a problem here in southern california). I have a nice spot picked out along the fence line for the pile about 25 ft from the house where the prevous owner had his wood pile on the ground. This is about where I decided to ask some advice from folk who may have done this in the past.

My thinking was to either to put down two 12 ft pressure treated 2x4's about a foot apart to allow air under the stack or maybe to get some old pallets and let them rot. The main thing I haven't worked out is how to contain the pile. I was thinking of digging a single post hole and planting a 4x4 at either end of the pile for support. I would do this center line between the 2x4's. On the other hand, the commercial wood stand I bought for the patio has two uprights just outside the horizontal supports which might suggest I put two uprights a little over a foot apart to keep the pile from "twisting" out of the verticals. I plan on using some old aluminum patio cover panels to keep the rain off the woodpile.

My questions to the forum is.. is a single pole sufficient to contain the wood pile? Is pressure treated wood that much better than old pallets for letting air into the pile? Lastly, can I reasonably expect the wood to dry enough to burn this winter even though it will probably start raining pretty serious around here in january time frame? I did buy a mixed cord (1/3 oak, 2/3 avo) to hold me a while but if last winter is any example, that won't hold me till spring.

I have tried to convince the CFO that digging these holes is a reason to buy a post hole digger for the kubota but she isn't buying it. I guess saving 20 bucks on the half cord by buying it green doesn't justify 500 on a power tool That means that any post holes will have to be dug by hand in our lovely clay, so I am hoping that a single pole on either end will work. Can anyone suggest a better solution?

 

[RPM]

Make sure you factor in the cost of getting your chimney swept out in the Spring if you burn it green. You'll also get plenty of entertainment from embers popping out of the fire!I'd suggest leaving it a year to dry - plenty of old-timers around me that won't burn for 2 years.

Regarding the 4x4 posts - depends on the wood you have. It should be fine. The wood I get delivered is usually all straight logs - so it stacks easily - but some guys will deliver you stuff where every piece is 'L' shaped. I generally don't ever use them again and it is a pain to stack.

Patrick

 

[Egon]

You can stack it without a post. At the ends lay each row at right angles to the previous row. Those in between just go across the the 4x4's.
Or if you use pallets stand one vertical at each end and brace it. Then stack the wood the width of the pallets in between the two vertical ones.

 

[ddl]

I use peelts to hold the "cord" of wood. I use steel posts, four at each end of the pellet, two for each 1/2 face cord. Then wire between the post the length of the pile to hole the logs in place and the posts. Make sure the wood is split, if it is split, it will be ready to burn in 6 to 8 weeks. If it is not split, it will be ready to burn in 6 years!!!

What you bought is called a face cord. 8 feet long, 4 feet high and the width is the as wide as the wood is cut. About the only way they sell wood any more. The cord costs more than you were charged.

Dan L

 

[ejb]

I agree with your boss, no sense spending $500 dollars on a post hole digger to save $50 on green-wood.

I couldn't even justify spending the $30 or $40 on the pressure treated 2x12's. Around here, pallets are cheap (free) and plentiful. If I can't find pallets I cut down some 3-4" hemlock or swamp maple to stack on, or even stack directly on the ground. If the goal is to save a little money, spedning money to stack the "sale" wood, doesn't make sense.

 

[Boondox]

Here in Vermont where we heat exclusively with wood we begrudge any money spent on the stacking of said wood. Generally old pallets (free) are used to keep it off the ground. I prefer Egon's way of standing end pallets on edge and bracing them upright with a hunk of scrap metal. You can also make the stack self-supporting by use of chimneys (sort of a cross-hatch of wood pieces on either end of the stack; described in Egon's message also), but if the chimney shifts the whole pile can go over. Being a lazy sort, I prefer not to repeat my work.

Oak is great firewood, but it's very dense. Around here we give it a full two years of drying before using it for heat. Otherwise the creosote buildup in your stove or fireplace can build up quickly and create a fire danger.

Pete

www.GatewayToVermont.com

 

[ejb]

Re: woodpiles/chimney cleaning

Speaking of chimneys, I need to clean mine this fall. Anyone have recommended approachs? My dad used to just use a long heavy chain and swing it back and forth in the chimney to knock off the loose stuff...is this still a recommended approach? I also have a 5inch wide brush on a ten foot pole that was made to clean dtove pipe, but it won't reach the whole chimney.

In previous times I would have called somone in to do it for me, but I am no longer spending any money I don't have to...

 

[Anderson]

I burn about 4 cords a year, and stack all the wood on pallets. the scrap pallets I get are low grade oak, and last at least 3 years.

I drive a steel T fencing post at each end, and brace that post with another T post driven in at an angle, and wire the intersection togethor with some scrap wire works great, and costs $4 per end support, and takes less than 5 minutes.

 

[Bird]

Re: woodpiles/chimney cleaning

ejb, when I lived in a house with a fireplace, I also had a swimming pool. I had a telescoping aluminum pole to which I could attach a brush or net for cleaning the pool. I found a big square wire brush that would also fit on that pole, let my drop light down the chimney at the same time so I could see everything down there and cleaning the chimney was no problem at all. Of course, I don't know how tall your chimney is, so I don't know whether that would work for you.

Bird

 

[fishman]

Fractal,

When I was burning a lot of wood, I used to stack it on two long poles cut from straight limbs or saplings. This works fine if you don't have access to pallets.

A couple of t-posts on each end will contain the pile. If a novice tries to make end-stacks they will usually fall over at the most inopportune time. Say, in the middle of a 6" wet snowfall./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[Egon]

Re: woodpiles/chimney cleaning

Cheap chimney cleaning:
Sounds like you can get up on your roof. If the chimney is straight a rope can be dropped down and then the brush pulled back and forth. If this can't be done get some more 10 ft. or so lenths of whatever and wire them together till you can reach the bottom with the brush. By the way a top off of a a green spruce that fits into the chimney works well as a brush.
Another much easier way is to burn some of that dreaded poplar [ dry of course ] every week at a real good rate and the chimney may stay clear of creosote. Note: a pound of poplar contains as many BTU's as a pound of good oak.
Egon

 

[PaulT]

Like some of the other posters here have said - if its really green (cut this summer) you probably shouldn't burn the oak this year. If its already a year old, split or not, you may still have time to cure it before you want to use it this winter. The key to aging this wood is air circulation. The rain won't bother it, as it is so dense that it won't soak in. Just make sure it has time to dry before you need to light the fire, just to make it easier. The guys that sell wood for a living here usually stack the green wood in a loose pile. This seems to create the most air gaps between the pieces. Sometimes they use more orderly teepee piles, with all of the split pieces oriented like a teepee toward the top. If your pile is laid out on a pallette or four (2x2 arrangement), you should be able to pile them loosely this way and get more air circulating around the wood. Then you can either restack it closer to the house when you get ready to burn, or just take them from this pile as you need.

When I heated my house with wood, one year my wood guy delivered a cord of green wood. I got him to deliver another face cord of cured wood for free. When I ran out of that wood, I tried to burn the green stuff (about 1 month later). I found that the stuff I had stacked as you have described was still green, while the balance of the cord that was still dumped in a pile from the truck cured at least to a usable amount. Of course that year I had a very intense (HOT) chimney fire that fortunately only cracked my inside chimney brick. It really should be sleeved now, but I switched to HWBB heat and don't use the wood stove anymore (little ones running around).

You said you are in southen CA. I'm assuming that you are not going to have a constant, hot fire like we would have here in the northeast throughout the winter. You may even have several days at a stretch that don't require heat at all - would that be correct? If so, then the creosote buildup concern is not such a problem, as you will probably not be burning anywhere near the rate, or heat intensity, that, say Pete in VT would.

Seems like all the agony of how to cure and store the wood til ready for use might be equal to the $20 you saved for buying green.

PaulT

 

[beenthere]

I've read so much misinformation in this thread, that I almost just left it alone (probably should still just delete this - but will see how carefully I can state what I have learned the hard way from burning red and white oak wood for the last 30 years). First, just cross every other layer at the ends of the pile as one person said to do. If the pile falls down, just stack it better the next time. Save the money and labor of end posts. Stack the wood on the ground - it won't dry as fast but if oak, it will not rot before you are ready to burn it in two to three years. THREE YEARS? Yes, the wood you have is likely CA white oak, which will not dry as fast as red oak (the pores are not open in white oak, as they are in red). Dry the split oak under a cover. Rain doesn't penetrate but neither does it help the drying process while the surface is wet. In CA, the covered, split white oak wood will likely be dry enough to burn well in two years. Wood dries at the ends, not the surface. Split wood will dry faster, but not appreciably. The wood will shrink when it dries, and the pile will shift some - more on the ends of the pieces facing the better drying conditions (sun). This shifting may require some restacking, but not likely a problem if the pile is only 4ft high. You should stack this wood for burning no less than a year from now, and better if two. If you can find wood cut and split two years ago to burn this year, that is your best bet. I burn six cords (full 8x4x4) every winter to heat my home. Feel free to take any short cuts you want to take, as it is your wood and your heat. Have fun.

 

[Egon]

Beenthere:
Them's that are into really burning wood have storage sheds for it. The drying time depends on the length of the wood, the time of year it was cut,the humidity of the area you live in and the type of wood. Stacking end walls just takes some knowledge.
Egon:
Been there and done it too!

 

[beenthere]

You are right on. My wood has always been in a drying shed. Although the last few years I have been converting it to a real shed, with floor and walls, and the future wood may be stacked outside with cover over the top. Wood has been a great heat source and I do not look forward to the day I cannot cut, split, and stack it for burning. What has been real interesting, is the few times I have brought wood in to burn that was stacked less than two years under cover, and noticed quickly how much less heat would come from the wood burner. Very dramatic and convincing. This is north central US, so we have high humidity in the winters and don't get a lot of air drying at that time of the year. CA is quite different, as you point out.

 

[banjobj]

I agree with what you say. There are no real shortcuts to wood burning, although I put about 5 full cords in my cellar near the old wood stove and it kiln drys whatever moisture there is left.

 

[jyoutz]

I have tried many ideas over the years. I heat mostly with wood and I go through lots of wood each year. The best solution I have found is to build a 3 sided chain link fence about 6 feet high. Then I put a sloping shed roof with metal sheeting on top of this. I use pallets on the ground and stack my wood in this enclosure. The open sides permit good air drying and containment, while the roof keeps it dry. Best of all this set-up is cheap to build and will not rot or deteriorate.

 

[jyoutz]

Re: woodpiles/chimney cleaning

There really is no good substitute for buying a chimney brush and a couple of fiberglass rod sections to reach the entire chimney. This stuff is really quite inexpensive and I've had my setup for years. Works fast and easy.

 

[fractal]

Re: chain link fence woodpiles

Now there's a thought. I was going to put the woodpile up against a 4 ft tall chain link fence.. Two more posts and some chain perpendicular to the existing fence would finish it off pretty cheap when topped with the old aluminum awning cover I have. Not quite as cheap as a couple of t-poles as I was going to try before I saw your suggestion, but certainly cheaper than buying a 4x4 pressure treated wood and will probably last longer.

It also got me looking at chain link web sites and I now have an idea how to patch that hole in the fence caused by the neighbors tree falling down that the chickens love to run through..

Thank you everyone for the great ideas.

 

[jyoutz]

Re: chain link fence woodpiles

I think you'll like this set-up. I've been using mine for 4 years now. Just a few suggestions: use the heavy duty chain link, it doesn't bend under the weight of the wood. And put a horizonal pipe section midway up (about 3' high) to make the sides more rigid. I did these things and even while supporting the wood, it has no sags or bends.