What add to Clay to make better topsoil

[wawajake]

My 30 x 30 vegetable garden is 3 years old now, it started with 14 yds of black loam rototilled into the existing clay base (the location grew grass and weeds very well before it was garden)
Each year in fall would add half dozen bags of peat moss and any straw we used between the rows to keep down weeds was also rototilled in for the winter.
Last year it also got maybe 4 yds of horse manure and sawdust mix ( stall sweepings from my neighbors barn) rototilled in fall and roto again in spring.

But we continue to get fist size clods of hard clay that make planting a pain with rake and hoe.

Any suggestions on what other add in I could make to the existing clay based topsoil I have to make it more workable or does it take ten years to get decent ?
What about sand ? or gypsum ?

 

[jonyyuma]

Your clay may be different, but last year I added lime, gypsem, and this year sand. It is looking better, but i use a tractor tiller now too.

 

[Chuck52]

After all that, I'd think you'd just about have the clay subdued. I also have a clay-like soil, but it has a fairly high organic content. My local city composts dry wall with the yard wastes and that compost is good for loosening up the soil. It gives you the gypsum and organics together. I've been adding that and various manures to my garden for a few years now. About the only time I get lumps when tilling is if I till when it is really too wet. That happens just about every year now because the springs have been so rainy. I usually end up re-tilling to break up the clods before I can use my little Earthway planter. Now-a-days most of my garden is raised beds, however, and those beds have been so heavily amended that I can stick my bare hand in several inches before I get to the base soil below.

Chuck

 

[Duffster]

My 30 x 30 vegetable garden is 3 years old now, it started with 14 yds of black loam rototilled into the existing clay base (the location grew grass and weeds very well before it was garden)
Each year in fall would add half dozen bags of peat moss and any straw we used between the rows to keep down weeds was also rototilled in for the winter.
Last year it also got maybe 4 yds of horse manure and sawdust mix ( stall sweepings from my neighbors barn) rototilled in fall and roto again in spring.

But we continue to get fist size clods of hard clay that make planting a pain with rake and hoe.

Any suggestions on what other add in I could make to the existing clay based topsoil I have to make it more workable or does it take ten years to get decent ?
What about sand ? or gypsum ?

Manure, manure, manure and some more manure. Just about when you think you have about enough manure add some more manure. :thumbsup:

 

[Egon]

Just keep adding the Organics.:thumbsup:

 

[randy41]

if you compost your manure first and then add it to the garden and don't till it in you will stop bringing the clay soil to the surface. after a few years of piling the compost on top you will have a nice rich soil.

 

[KennyG]

I'll take a bit of a counter position here and suggest some sand. If you've put that much organic material in and still have clay clumping, I think some sand would help.

 

[bp fick]

Not much to add to what's already been advised. Yup, cutting agents like gypsum and sand, but organics and more organics. It'll come around.

I am "making" soil here too, just starting from the opposite end of the soil spectrum, sand, Pure sand. Amend, amend, amend. The difference, now on our third year, is miraculous, really. Keep the faith.:thumbsup:

 

[seymojo536]

I'll take a bit of a counter position here and suggest some sand. If you've put that much organic material in and still have clay clumping, I think some sand would help.

There are a few things I remember from my days in soil science class. One that always stayed with me is the amount of sand needed to be added to a clay soil to "improve" it. Unless you can put enough sand in the gound to make up 50% of the soil composiition, it is not worth the time and money. The soil much be uniformly mixed to a depth of 18 inches. So if you can put 30*30*1.5/27*3000/2000 = 75 tons of sand. You could cut that in half if you first remove the top 9 inches of soil and repalce it with sand. But it still must be mixed to at least 18 in. to provide an optimal growing zone.

 

[wawajake]

Lots of great suggestions ,...thanks.

and BP considering your upper michigan location just across the St Mary's river from me maybe I should ship you one barrel of clay a week , and you ship me back it filled with sand. We will have optimal soil in 15 years and we will be broke....smile

Looks like I gotta get more manure from neighbors and maybe some sand where I want to plant the carrots