Weld on a tractor with electronics?

[mwayne]

I would like to weld a tool box bracket onto my tractor and am wondering if there is any risk to the ECM or other electronics. I've seen welding ruin instrumentation at work, usually because the instrument is between the ground clamp and stinger so I want to be most cautious. Can it be done without ruining anything? Lift the battery ground clamp first then don't worry? I could build a jig and weld up the bracket then bolt the assembly on but it would be so much quicker and easier to weld in contact with the tractor. Are there threads where this has been discussed already?
Thanks!

 

[RNeumann]

Technically you need to unplug the computer. It’s the high frequency in TIG that is the biggest threat. If it was my machine I’d DC the battery if I wasn’t TIG welding.....that’s only if the ECU wasn’t easy to get to. If I was TIG welding I’d DC the battery and unplug the ECU without question.

 

[Sonny580]

I was always told to make the ground clamp be right next to the weld area so it don't draw current thru the whole tractor. I weld on a few and so far never had problems. ---Still don't like to without disconnecting everything to be safe. thanks ;sonny580

 

[yomax4]

A welder repair guy once told me when in doubt, unhook battery and run a double ground. One to your work and a seperates cable from your work to an earth ground like a piece of re-bar pounded in the ground. I'v done that and had no issues. Have not used Hi Freq in this situation though. Good Luck !

 

[Bigfoot62]

Technically you need to unplug the computer. It’s the high frequency in TIG that is the biggest threat. If it was my machine I’d DC the battery if I wasn’t TIG welding.....that’s only if the ECU wasn’t easy to get to. If I was TIG welding I’d DC the battery and unplug the ECU without question.

I agree with this.

At the very minimum, disconnect the ground cable on the battery.

 

[PILOON]

I agree with this.

At the very minimum, disconnect the ground cable on the battery.

That, and clamp the welder ground on the largest piece of the two parts to be welded with the idea being to have the shortest return path possible.
Logically it makes sense to keep that path as short as possible, just think welding uses a lot of current and if that current has no choice but to travel via your computer board that uses 32 gauge wire for connections for sure you'll toast that microchip.

I cautiously have done a few welds on equipment using that theory and no problems.
Electricity will always seek the shortest path to ground!.

 

[LouNY]

I pull the ground cable off the battery,
clean all the paint off for my ground with the ground as close as practical to my work.
Another thing that is missed often is welding on a piece that is mounted with a bushing or bearing
and getting that bearing or bushing between the work and ground which will etch a bushing/bearing.

 

[mwayne]

Thanks all for your valuable advice! Will be using one of those IGBT DC machines with all the switching so I think I'm just going to build it using the jig and then beat it to fit the bolt patterns.

 

[metalbender]

So far I've managed to keep the arc off my tractor. While in the working world, we would clamp on a surge protector made for the purpose to the battery. Never had any problems, but if there was, I wasn't on the hook for the bill. The work clamp as close to the actual weld spot "should " make for an uneventful job. As mentioned, shortest path. I don't think I'd get on it with a high frequency tig start. I've been zapped by my Dynasty 200dx due to a poor ground clamp location, let's you know in a hurry things ain't right. My thoughts would be that the batt would act as a buffer to absorb stray voltage. Thoughts?

 

[Industrial Toys]

This has been brought up before. Ground well, as close to the work as possible, so the ground current doesn't look for another path.

I think, the electrical system powered up with a low impedence power source (battery) is safer than leaving it open. Just like you can destroy a CMOS chip in your hand (from static) but once installed in a circuit board, it's far safer.

I had a friend set fire to a tractor while welding with ugly consequences. Have a fire extinguish ready and have someone watching for fire. I like a CO2 extinguisher with chemicals ones on hand.

 

[ray66v]

If you are at all concerned about it, disconnect the battery.

I have heard the stories, in second and third hand accounts of electric welders causing issues. I will tell you in my career spanning decades of auto body repair, I have never actually seen it happen first hand, or worked with anyone who has.

And, that covers thousands of vehicles, which I either repaired personally, or were repaired by others I was associated with.

 

[grsthegreat]

Ive had 2 occasions to weld on my DK45 and both times i unplugged rhe computer module and unhooked the ground on battery. Better safe than financially sorry. Just yesterday i had to reweld the tow hook on the tractor. Kioti didnt place it originally on a very sturdy part of the frame. They welded it to part of the thin metal battery support pan. It tore free when pulling a car out of ditch last winter. I welded it to part of the main frame up front. Its not going anywhere now. The original tow hook was welded to the 16 ga battery pan and one slight tack weld to frame.


the new location is on the 3/8" thick frame.

 

[TractorGuy]

I might be flirting with disaster but I have been mig welding on my loader bucket without disconnecting anything. I am attaching my ground near the point of the welds.

 

[mwayne]

Thanks all for your expertise and experience! Good to know that welding like described has been done without any damages.

 

[aczlan]

I might be flirting with disaster but I have been mig welding on my loader bucket without disconnecting anything. I am attaching my ground near the point of the welds.

I rebuilt the bucket on our B7500 the same way...
The key is getting a good ground right near where you are welding.

Aaron Z

 

[dragoneggs]

I rebuilt the bucket on our B7500 the same way...
The key is getting a good ground right near where you are welding.

Aaron Z

Or install a QA :cool2:

 

[muddstopper]

As easy as it is to unplug the ecm or the battery, why even risk it. I am one of those few that has seen a welder destroy $10grand worth of computer circuits, twice, so I know its possible. Had the equipment down for days waiting on parts. The second time it happened, I warned the supervisor not to have the welder working but he ignored my warnings. One arc and the equipment shuts down in the middle of a scheduled project. Higher up where pizzed, but I warned them what could happen, rush rush rush , spend money and wait.

 

[mwayne]

At work a few days ago:

Had an outfit come out for a load bank test on this 250 KW genset. While looking around found the tag inside the machine. I thought I have seen those before but wasn't sure. Side note, the air being blown out of one of the load banks was 431 degrees F! Twenty more and we could have caught paper on fire.