Water Well Drilling Rotary or Pounder

[ponytug]

Who would be the ones wanting to do that? and why?

Basically, it reduces water losses due to evaporation by reducing the surface area from two reservoir surfaces to one.

I would not characterize it as a political move, although with more than one person, I think you always have some amount of politics. It is an engineering / hydrology move in my view. The dams were built in a time of relatively wet years and low demand. Now that we know more of the hydrological history of the Western US, we now know how unusual the early 1900s were from a rainfall perspective.

By allowing the water to bypass lake Powell, less of water would be lost to evaporation, resulting in more water for the residents in the area, the ecosystem, and downstream users.

There might be an extended discussion about the wisdom of growing irrigated water intensive crops like alfalfa and cotton in deserts, but in a few decades, it will be moot as the desert air evaporates more water and increases soil salinity beyond the tolerance of the crops. Still, there are better places to grow these crops, and more profitable areas, if the actual water cost, rather than the state and federally subsidized cost of water prevailed.

I'm all for farming the right crops in the right place, like bees on goldenrod in Missouri or the driftless region of Wisconsin.

Las Vegas recycles an enormous fraction of its water. 40% of its water is used indoors, and 99% of that is recycled in a variety of ways. Las Vegas residents use less than 200gpd (GPCD), one of the absolute lowest in the US. It has been ratcheting up the pressure to reduce all outdoor uses of water that isn't rain fed.

Where Your Water Comes From

Colorado River water and local groundwater are the two primary supplies used to meet our community's current water resource needs.

www.snwa.com

All the best,

Peter

 

[bigtiller]

I visited Payson Az. several times 13+ years ago. The city recycled their water back then but the townsfolk were leery about drinking it so they decided to build a lake in a nice park for fishing. I don't know if things have changed by now or not.

 

[LouNY]

So reduce the hydro electric capacity and any flooding control and river flow stabilization so california can have more water.

 

[ponytug]

So reduce the hydro electric capacity and any flooding control and river flow stabilization so california can have more water.

It would be great if there was enough water to fill both reservoirs. I would love to have seen it.

The low rainfall has killed the hydroelectric power already. There isn't enough flow or head left. Current thinking actually favors less river stabilization and, yes less flood control, though in this particular case, I think it is largely theoretical. I can think of many other rivers that have extensive settlement in flood zones. That is a different story about the relative merits of flood control, and whether folks should occupy flood prone areas. But that is a different conversation.

But big picture, dams have a lifetime. They fill up with sediment and / or the reinforced concrete /earth degrades to the point of unsafe. When the time is up on a dam, excavation of the sediments is rarely a feasible option. That leaves letting the river go back to being a river, flooding the sediments downstream, without flood control, arguably better for the environment. Lots of dams were built in the 1800s and 1900s, and many of them are at or beyond their lifetime. Even if you wanted a dam in the same location, due to the accumulation of sediment, a new dam may not be feasible due to the cost of removing the prior century or so of sediment.

So, yes, I suspect that Lake Powell is end of life. Not from a sediment fill, and not from corrosion and lack of safety, but just because the water isn't there. It doesn't snow as much, there are fewer forests in the drainage basin so more of the water that does fall evaporates, and more humans take the water upstream for cities and farming. Net, net, there is no longer enough water and there is not a viable route to more water that I can see. I would love to be wrong on this, but I don't see the upstream lands going back to more forests, nor do i see large numbers of people abandoning those states.

Sad but true. This isn't one state vs another, just a different set of weather patterns compared to when the dam was planned and built. There are some good books on the dams and the changing rainfall/drainage, if you are interested.

All the best,

Peter

 

[Gator6x4]

So reduce the hydro electric capacity and any flooding control and river flow stabilization so california can have more water.

Nope, Nevada and Las Vegas.

 

[LouNY]

Start haunting the bigger equipment classified and auctions they do come up for sale at times, the pounders can be forund as trailer or truck mounted units. The worst part is getting 20 ft sticks of caseing lined up and threaded on straight.

 

[Valveman]

I think everyone should try their hand a drilling a well. it will teach you more about the laws of physics than you can ever learn in school. Lol! A large diameter well 100' deep is a pretty good undertaking. But it can be done. Normally you don't add pipe as you go with a spudder or cable tool rig. The cable and tool pound all the way to the bottom, then you pull out the tools and add the casing. It is not as easy as digging an extra deep post hole. Sealing and developing the well so it will make plenty of good and clean water can be an art of its own. Every area is different. it depends on what you drill into that decides how this goes. Best of Luck!

 

[Larry Caldwell]

It would be great if there was enough water to fill both reservoirs. I would love to have seen it.

The low rainfall has killed the hydroelectric power already. There isn't enough flow or head left. Current thinking actually favors less river stabilization and, yes less flood control, though in this particular case, I think it is largely theoretical. I can think of many other rivers that have extensive settlement in flood zones. That is a different story about the relative merits of flood control, and whether folks should occupy flood prone areas. But that is a different conversation.

But big picture, dams have a lifetime. They fill up with sediment and / or the reinforced concrete /earth degrades to the point of unsafe. When the time is up on a dam, excavation of the sediments is rarely a feasible option. That leaves letting the river go back to being a river, flooding the sediments downstream, without flood control, arguably better for the environment. Lots of dams were built in the 1800s and 1900s, and many of them are at or beyond their lifetime. Even if you wanted a dam in the same location, due to the accumulation of sediment, a new dam may not be feasible due to the cost of removing the prior century or so of sediment.

So, yes, I suspect that Lake Powell is end of life. Not from a sediment fill, and not from corrosion and lack of safety, but just because the water isn't there. It doesn't snow as much, there are fewer forests in the drainage basin so more of the water that does fall evaporates, and more humans take the water upstream for cities and farming. Net, net, there is no longer enough water and there is not a viable route to more water that I can see. I would love to be wrong on this, but I don't see the upstream lands going back to more forests, nor do i see large numbers of people abandoning those states.

Sad but true. This isn't one state vs another, just a different set of weather patterns compared to when the dam was planned and built. There are some good books on the dams and the changing rainfall/drainage, if you are interested.

All the best,

Peter

Grand Coulee has a design lifetime of 150 years. That seemed like forever 80 years ago. I don't know the design lifetime of Hoover, which was built a few years earlier.

 

[caver]

It's interesting this came up in suggestions. Amateur buys a cable tool rig and drills a well deeper. The Primary Water Well Locator folks tell them how deep to go in an exiting well. Things go south about the 40 minute mark. It's a long arse video so I had to skim quite a bit of it.

 

[Camofurever1]

Not a fan of the channel but Diesel Creek had a percussion rig drill his well at his shop in an episode last week.

1:25 minute mark.

Diesel Creek should be on this site. I enjoy watching him, if nothing else than for yelling at the TV "Why did you just do that, JR.?". "Pick up a real wrench and put that rattle wrench down", what in the heck are you gonna do with that POS" and the infamous "That ain't gonna work". He seems to ignore me.....