The age old.."what's the best land clearing technique" question again

[PatrickS2222]

Hi Good to know you're keeping track of the discussion. There's a considerable amount of experience in this site :thumbsup:

Iv been told a few times that a loader is the way to go. The bucket can go higher for more leverage on the trees. And it's big enough to start on my dirt work. Iv been watching a few videos on clearing land with a loader as well. Seems like it's well worth looking into.

That can be an advantage, or indeed a distinct disadvantage (see Post No 53) and it depends on the soil type and condition, and your machine. I recently had to push a few trees to clear my work area. They were a mixture of 6-8" gum and black wattle - nothing huge, but I found the gums difficult to move - even with a 50-odd-HP Komatsu drott (tracked loader). The ground is very dry and the trees would be 20 years old, but I had to push from high up the tree, but prevent the bucket from sliding up the tree-trunk. Some had to be pushed in several different directions before they went over. My loader pushed the wattles quite easily, again pushing high, although it's 2-wheel drive, it is quite heavy.
You're indeed 100% correct though, in that you'll find a loader so useful and versatile you wonder how difficult it would be to make do without it!

 

[N80]

Gum trees are hard to manage with a loader. They are too flexible so when you bend them over it does not pop the root ball up. Plus, their roots spread outward. In my experience the only trees that come out easily with a FEL are pines. This is because they have a tap root which is pretty much a big downward extension of the trunk. When the tap root gives way then the whole tree and root come out easily. With hardwoods and cedars you need to do a lot more digging around the roots and you often need to come from different sides. This is tedious, time consuming and even harder on the tractor. A tooth bar would probably help with these sorts of trees.

 

[Soggy Bottom Outdoors]

I'm not sure what the "best" land clearing technique is but I'll explain what we do and why. My experience is only in Ky, other areas are vastly different and out of my "jurisdiction". Starting back in the 1960's we have used everything from old IH cable lift dozers to Cat D8's, to Komatsu 65's, all dozers. Totaling several hundred acres over the years. So why a dozer and not a Hy-lift, (track loader), or track hoe? First consider the operators for each machine are of the same skill level. A dozer is made to "push", and has "cleats" on the tracks. I need to push the trees over and push it to the brush pile and push dirt back into hole it came out of. A Hy-lift is more of a lift and load machine and is normally equiped with "street pads" on the tracks which limits traction. A track hoe is a digging machine. They do have leverage to get trees over but if it needs to be move several yards to a brushpile they are at a disadvantage. Rarely is the land we've cleared been timberland that included 24" plus oaks, popular, hickory,ash, cherry, etc. If these trees are there we work around them and focus on the smaller stuff. Or the trees are harvested and we focus on the "laps" and small stuff. We don't dig out new stumps. To costly. By far most of the ground we've clearly has been overgrown/abandoned once farmed land. Overgrown with less than 12" sasafarras, cedar, locust, scrub oak, and wild cherry. We row all this up the the gulley that is the closest to the area we're working and rarely burn it.(I like to rabbit hunt out of them) Over the years as they rot down we use a dozer to tighten them up. They going rate for say a Cat Hi-track D6 with operator is $125 hour. Most times they will waive the haul bill if you have two days of work. If it takes a couple hours to clear an acre of ground it's just like buying an acre of open ground of $250. Cheap. Hire a reputable, experienced operator with a good machine and be sure they understand that if you're not happy with their work you can call the job and send them home. Have a blessed day.

 

[crackerjack222]

When I bought my place 25 years ago I also bought a JD 555 track loader with a 4n1 blade/bucket. I used it to clear about 150 acres of mixed mesquite regrowth, oak, elm and cactus. The large (24"+ dia) oaks pushed over easily with the bucket up high. The elms were the toughest. Push too high and they would break. I had to push from several sides to loosen them enough to get the root ball to go with the tree. Some of the larger mature mesquites would break off just above the ground and then I would have to dig the stump out. If the ground was wet enough I could lift the tree, roots and all out of the ground with the bucket. I am convinced that small machine, weight about 18k lbs did that job as well or better/faster than a D5. For the smaller stuff, mostly sapling type mesquite I built a 42" wide root plow to hang off the blade. With it, I could scoop up a mesquite (up to about 6" dia) roots and all, lift the blade high and dump it it in a pile. Trying to just blade the small mesquites, they would just bend over and go under the blade unless I dug up a lot of dirt.
I now have a JD 310G backhoe and it works well clearing trees/brush out of a fence line but it would be slow at clearing a large area.

 

[N80]

If and when I clear cut some acreage down in front of my cabin I will hire out a dozer with a root rake to get everything out, stumps and all. I'll have him grade it roughly and then do the rest with my little tractor. I'm talking about 4 or 5 acres max.

 

[Iguezz116]

You bring up some really good points soggy. Only about 2 acres will be completely cleared. And that's for house, pond and driveway. The other 3 acres will just be thinned and cleaned up. Anything big and healthy that would give me a problem pushing over will be left anyways. I can get a 90Hp Dozer enclosed cab for $1600 for 7 days + root rake and delivery. And the 7 days I have it, my bro in law will be there with his 410 helping out. Any "thinning" I can't finish in 7 days. I can chip away at little by little with my 30 horse or 410. Dozer rental, fuel, steaks and beer for 7 days even if it's $3000 seems pretty good. What Yall think?

 

[PatrickS2222]

I reckon that sounds like quite good value. Sounds like you're in a similar situation to me when we bought this 5 acres. House is good, but whole lot was run-down or overgrown. We thinned out about 1 acre of tall gums with a lot of saplings, wattle, lantana etc under them at the front of the house paddock with the drott, then tractor & chain, then tractor & slasher (bush-hog). I was happy to leave the taller trees, and the local authorities would then leave me alone as well! That was 6 years ago, now it's reasonably well-grassed and I mow it in summer with our ride-on.
What I was doing recently was removing a few trees to build a second dam - they needed to be out of the way. The drott is almost 6 tons, has cleats on its tracks, is low-geared and therefore is surprisingly strong - for its physical size its quite deceptive. Pushing gums was indeed difficult, as N80 has said the young ones break off, the older ones are too firmly attached to the ground, unless it's been wet weather. I could push the wattles over with my loader, but they would almost always break off.
Soggy, you're right in that a dozer qould be a better machine for that particular job. Where a dozer has an even bigger advantage is if it's equipped with a "tree-pusher" - a strong frame which mounts usually on the frame but some attach to the track assemblies, rests on top of the blade and reaches well forward as well as much higher than the blade. The result is the machine pushes larger trees much higher than the blade can otherwise reach, like us using loaders, drotts, tractors with front blades or similar machinery.
I recall watching contractors clearing scrub - up to 40 acres at a time - for my father when I was a young boy. They pushed out some huge gum, ironbark and various others with a D6-sized dozer. After they finished we would work it down with farm tractors (including the one I have here) and plant cow-peas to increase the soil's nitrogen content, then pasture, for dairy cattle. I still remember carrying irrigation pipes all over those paddocks ..... kept me fit!
Keep in mind if you need to remove anything more substantial than - including stumps - pine or mesquite etc, do it a couple weeks after substantial rain - the softer ground is a huge help.

 

[PRRoots]

He may never check back in, it happens all the time. However, years from now someone may do a search for this exact same thing, and hopefully will at least learn of different options and be slightly more educated than they were before searching.

It's still a good discussion regardless. Let's keep it going!

And here I am.... years later, learning from your collective wisdom as I decide how to best approach my land in northern Alberta, Canada. Thank you all. This has been the best and most practical advice I have come across in a couple of years of searching.

 

[eonblue]

Agreed. I have done quite a few searches on land clearing with a tractor and even came up with a few hits on this very site, but never saw this thread. Its been my favorite!