Test Drive

pitotshock · Oct 5, 2006

Hey,

have been lurking

on the board for a little while, so I thought I would introduce myself.

My name is James and my wife and I have a 97 acre horse farm and we are very interested in picking up a CUT. We will be using it to do fence repairs, trail maintenance, bale handling, snow removal, etc. I like the idea of a smaller tractor to get into the barns and tighter bush trails. We have NO aspirations to do our own hay (~55 acres)

OK, I am going to look at a used TC45 on a dealer's lot and want to give it a good test drive.

What do you guys suggest for testing

Hydrostatic Trans
FEL
4WD
PTO

This machine has 775 hours on it, AG tires, hydrostat, FEL, non-super steer and was used in a small landscaping business. The dealer indicated that it had a worn out seat from being left outside, but has been replaced with a new one.

Thanks in advanced, James

LoneCowboy · Oct 5, 2006

CUT's are usually designed for people with 1 to 20 acres.
97 acres is a lot (i'm jealous)
I'd think of stepping up to a utility tractor, not a lot more money, not a lot more size, but a lot more possibilities.

Doc_Bob · Oct 5, 2006

Price? Sounds like it is a good choice. Will the dealer give you an extended warranty via NH for free? For a year? That shows cofidence in their statment the machine is good to go.

Size? I would guess a 45 HP tractor would do fine. Might take you a bit longer, but if you have the time, so what?

Now, I have a NH TN70A (bought it used, 170 hrs). Compared to a TC45, the TN70A is a beast, noisy, brutal. The TC is smooth, quiet and easy to use. I still love my TN and have no regrets.

Take it for a demo on your property. Most dealers will give you 3 hours of test drive (in my area). You sound serious, so they should be glad to let you demo it on your land doing what you will be doing with it if you bought it.
Bob

AndyMA · Oct 5, 2006

The TC45 is a nice machine, but I agree a little small for 97 acres. It will do but you may be looking for a TN soon. It is also small to handle large round bales if you have that in mind. I have 80 acres and have both a TN75D and a 2120 (one size up from a TC45) and sometimes wish I had more size.

Andy

pitotshock · Oct 6, 2006

Thanks for the input so far. So it sounds like you guys think the tc45 might be a bit small for us. I wanted something that the wife would be able to drive that was 1. hydrostatic (she is not much for standard shift) 2. not too large to be intimidating for her 3.small enough to drive inside.

We have quite a few hills and some of my work will be rotary cutting pasture/paddocks that are quite hilly, and a smaller size, I think, would be less intimidating even to me. Here is a quick pic of the property...

jinman · Oct 6, 2006

We will be using it to do fence repairs, trail maintenance, bale handling, snow removal, etc. I like the idea of a smaller tractor to get into the barns and tighter bush trails. We have NO aspirations to do our own hay (~55 acres)

I think the jobs you described will be ideal for the TC45D. If you want a hydrostatic transmission in a larger tractor, you'd have to go to another brand to find it. The TC45D is NH's largest hydro. I think you will find its operator comforts and ease of use to be superior.

Just be sure to raise the hood and look around the battery (behind it) for damage. The battery placed in front of the radiator is a formula for lots of acid damage on these tractors. Many of us have found add-on solutions to this problem. If there is extensive damage, make a deal with the dealer to fix it before buying this tractor.

You will need all the ballast you can get for handling rouind bales with the FEL. I do it with my TC45D and I have industrial tires filled plus a heavy boxblade on the rear. The 16LA FEL can handle a round bale, but you just need to be cautious and move slowly. Don't get it too high off the ground while moving. A 1500 lb round bale is at the maximum lift capacity of the FEL. If the bales weigh 1200 lb or less, it's a snap.

Go ahead and try out the TC and then tell us what you think and ask more questions.

Bird · Oct 6, 2006

If you were going to cut and bale your own hay, plow the whole 97 acres, or even brush hog the whole 97 acres, then I'd agree with the guys who say you need a bigger tractor. But for the uses you've mentioned, I think jinman has given the right answer, and of course he has personal experience with that model of tractor.

AndyG · Oct 6, 2006

Sounds like the TC45D is a good tractor for you. It will probably do everything that you need it to. Its hard to specify that "X" acres needs "Y" size tractor. Depends on how much of the land you are going to actively maintain. To big of a machine can be a real headache. Having come from a landscaping business I suggest that you be extra careful in your inspection of the machine. If they had the hired help driving the tractor you can be sure that they were not as careful with it as you or I would be. Nothing parties like a rental or a company car (tractor). The tractor may have been rode hard and put away wet. Pay special attention to the loader and all of the welds on it and its brackets. Look closely at any thing that you think may have been subject to abuse. What condition are the tires in? Check all of the fluids. Maintenance records? I'm not trying to discourage you, in fact, I prefer used equipment to save $$$. Just check it out thoroughly and price it according to what you find. Good luck and have fun!

LoneCowboy · Oct 6, 2006

I'm sorry, I don't see it.
97 acres is a good sized spread. Sure, there are some tasks that can be done just fine by a smaller compact tractor, but that's a lot of land.
So, 55 acres were hay and the OP doesn't want to do that.
so that leaves 45 acres.
a TC45 handles what, a 6' bush hog? You'll never be able to go up to a 8 or a 10', t hat's a lot of time bush hogging.
and 45 acres of work doing anything is a lot of work on a compact tractor.

a TN is 3 feet longer, 6 inches wider and the exact same height as a TC
With a MUCH bigger FEL, way more 3 point capacity and the ability to do about anything. It probably uses 2 gal/hour vs the 1gal/hr of the TC

You have way more options with the TN, you are limited on the TC and size or turnaround space or anything shouldn't be a huge problem on 97 acres.

BTW, nice spread, now I'm really jealous.

pitotshock · Oct 6, 2006

Last weekend my wife and I went to the local NH dealer and test drove a brand new, fully loaded TC45 and were really impressed. I thought the supersteer was neat, but I think I could live without it. My wife had never driven a real tractor before and was zooming around the lot within about 45 seconds of instruction. Big smiles on both of our faces. I have to say that this dealer/owner was probably one of the best salesman I have seen in a long time. Very practiced and smooth, definately not a 'used-car-salesman' style.

I like the idea of buying used to save the initial depreciation, and have a few options to buy used within a 3-4 hour driving radius from here. The one I am looking at is about 3 hours away so a 'on-farm' test is probably not possible.

Realistically, I will have about 20 acres to brush hog down, but most of that will be within the horses paddocks, which will be eaten down to a golf green with only the weeds and small trees sticking up. There is also some bush riding trails to maintain. Of the 97 Acres, about 15 is bush, so the smaller size tractor is also to facilitate the tighter turns in the bush.

I will definately pay attention to the weld conditions on the bucket as well as the battery area corrosion (I did notice the battery layout when we were at the dealer).

Anything specific for a vehicle that has lived outside its whole life?

LoneCowboy

BTW, nice spread, now I'm really jealous

did I happen to mention that we also have a creek and a couple of ponds too...

pitotshock · Oct 6, 2006

OK I couldn't help myself on this one. Here is a pic of the pond, about 150yd long and 35yd wide

jinman · Oct 6, 2006

Anything specific for a vehicle that has lived outside its whole life?

My tractor was bought in Feb of 2001 and has been outside in Texas for all of it's life. The paint and fiberglass has held up very well. Considering the jobs I do, I don't think there would be much difference if I kept the tractor inside except for maybe the condition of the back side of the seat. I keep it folded forward so the cushions don't get the full sun's blast and I also park the tractor so it's in the shade of trees about 70% of the time.

Oh! BTW: We have 55 acres with trees and small meadows. We also have two ponds and a large lake (big 15-acre pond really). Everyone here on TBN is sick of me showing pictures of them, so I'll just make the point that the hydro transmission is the ideal transmission for backing a rotary cutter repeatedly around a pond's perimeter and changing directions 100s of times to get that job done. You never have to touch the brake. I would not call it a "walk in the park," but it is sure easier than any gear tractor I've ever used. Your pond looks great! Does it become a nice ice rink in the winter?

Check out the operation of the tilt and extendible steering wheel on the tractor. Especially in cold climates, the steering wheel is prone to get water/ice inside the tilt steering cylinder and cause it to fail. My extension doesn't work because I never use it and it just finally became too tight to operate. I've had to disassemble and lube my tilt steering once and now I keep it covered so rain doesn't get in there.

In general, the finish on my tractor has see far more abuse from tree limbs, brush, and vine scratches than from the sun. On the older tractors like mine, there is a hood vent right above the battery, so guess what happens when it rains? Yep, the battery gets wet. When you start the engine, guess where that water goes? Yep, right into the radiator and HST cooler. This is by far the worst "outdoor issue" in my book. If my seat was ragged, that would probably be my second complaint, but my seat has held up very well.

One other thing... Crawl under the tractor and look at the condition of the operator platform. Mine is in terrible shape. It seems that the rubber mat over this platform just holds a lot of moisture and gunk. The paint job on the platform is not that good and it shows. I don't think my platform is going to fall apart anytime soon, but it irritates the heck out of me everytime I look up and see it rusting while I'm under the tractor. I find myself wishing it was made of fiberglass too.

kossetx · Oct 6, 2006

Pilotshock, I believe the 45 would be just fine for you and what you are planning. I have takes care of 161 acres for 14 years with a 25 hp tractor and the ONLY reason I bought a new tractor was to get a fel equipped tractor with rops, something my old tractor never had. If you were going to do heavy ground engaging or baling hay, yes get bigger. If your just mowing and moving stuff around, light discing and planting, you'll do just fine with the 45. My .02

daTeacha · Oct 10, 2006

Just a thought regarding your wife and stick shift -- with most tractors, it's not a matter of shifting, but more one of pick a gear and go. All she needs to do is learn the shift pattern and clutch operation. With a foot throttle, the driving experience can be quite a lot like a car or pickup with an automatic.

pitotshock · Oct 12, 2006

OK, back from my test drive

2003 TC45DA 775 hours non-S/S. It was mainly used at a tree farm moving black earth.

Reports... in no particular order

Overall the machine had a moderate amount of rust. The battery area had some surface rust all around it. Under the rubber foot mats, Seat frame, and grab rails were all rusty. You can see that someone had touched them up with paint, but after sitting dorment on the lot for a while it has started to oose out again.

Plastic fenders and hood in really good shape without scratch or chip or crack.

Sun bleached - after sitting outside for its whole life, the plastic knobs and lever handles all looked faded and weathered. The seat was cracked and dried out, with one large open tear. Dealer promised to replace the seat cover with new.

Bucket is non-quick attach in good shape without any cracks in the welds and the front edge still in good shape with lots of meat left. All motions from the joy-stick were as expected and the bucket float worked correctly.

Front tires completely shot, Dealer promised to replace with new

Tilt and telescopic not functional. Dealer promised to repair.

I showed up unannounced so that he wouldn't have a chance to warm the engine up. It started without problem and ran very smooth and consistent, no smoking. Mechanically, it was very sound and had no noticable problems.

I didn't start to negociate on this deal as I have a few other leads, but his asking price is $21,500CAD(~19,700USD).

Overall I think this is a very functional tractor and with the repairs made by the dealer would be a reasonable purchase. If I do try and pick this one up, I would start by offering a few thousand less and have them install the quick attach system.

dknarnd · Oct 12, 2006

I just had a chance to buy a 2005 TC45A with 135 hours, QA HD bucket, 1 rear remote for $19,000 at a Kubota dealer which took it in on trade for the M7040. He was holding it for 1 day until I got my deposit to him but being the curious person I am and after some calling around I found out that it slid down a bank into some water, didn't roll and supposedly didn't take in any water. They had to have it pulled out with another piece of equipment but after hearing that I decided to back out on the deal. I'm still doing some checking on the tractor through other sources and if I become satisified with what I hear and it is still available maybe I'll go for it. Otherwise I'll go new for a TC40A.

Doc_Bob · Oct 12, 2006

pitotshock said:
OK, back from my test drive

2003 TC45DA 775 hours non-S/S. It was mainly used at a tree farm moving black earth.

QA bucket is almost mandatory.
Free NH extended warranty would help.
Can you fix the rust?
Have them replace the seat.
Have them do a complete service or pay you the difference so you can do it.
Let them demo the tractor on your property for a day or two, then decide.
Bob

jinman · Oct 12, 2006

Pitotshock, I noticed a few things as shown below. The other things were as I expected.

Front tires completely shot...at 775? Wow! What do you mean? Was all the tread gone? Are they industrial tires? My tractor has nearly 1200 hours and the front tires look fine. If this tractor was used in the dirt, I'd expect the front tires to be very good shape. This would be very disturbing to me because it seems to indicate that the tractor has many more hours than the hour meter shows.

You say the bucket is non-quick attach, but is it the HD bucket? Did it have holes just behind the front cutting edge? If not, it's a standard duty bucket. Like DocBob said, I'd negotiate to get the quick attach plate and bucket.

pitotshock said:
2003 TC45DA 775 hours non-S/S.

Bucket is non-quick attach in good shape without any cracks in the welds and the front edge still in good shape with lots of meat left. All motions from the joy-stick were as expected and the bucket float worked correctly.

Front tires completely shot, Dealer promised to replace with new

I didn't start to negociate on this deal as I have a few other leads, but his asking price is $21,500CAD(~19,700USD).

Overall I think this is a very functional tractor and with the repairs made by the dealer would be a reasonable purchase. If I do try and pick this one up, I would start by offering a few thousand less and have them install the quick attach system.

schmism · Oct 12, 2006

i can see scrubbing the front tires clean in a short time if you spend much time on hard ground in 4wd at full lock. On my smaller TC33 the fronts scub big time in 4wd at full stearing lock.

a few things i "learned" when i bought mine used...

1) have them do the mantaince schedule thats about to come up.
2) check tires for plugs. turns out i have a front tire thats leaking with a plug in it.

i mistakenly thought they would have "100 point checked" mine before the sent it out... couldnt be farther from the truth. Even after you get it home check all the fluids and spend some time hunting down all the grease zerks. (or better yet have the dealer go over all that with you... mine didnt dispite my asking)

While a TC45 sounds like the right tractor, Its my understanding its still to small to bale (even small sq) with.

With that much ground id hate to find myself in the postion that the TC45 was to small to do some of the larger jobs... but to cumbersome for the smaller "around the barn" jobs.

without knowing more about your operation or intended use, id almost be inclined to recomend a smaller tractor like my TC33 for around the barn work, and a second AG size (TN series.... 70-100hp) tractor for the larger jobs out in the fields... (bailing, 15' batwing mowing, disking, seading etc) (from my limited understand it does take more work than you would expect to "maintain" good pasture.

Doc_Bob · Oct 12, 2006

jinman said:
Pitotshock, I noticed a few things as shown below. The other things were as I expected.

Front tires completely shot...at 775? Wow! What do you mean? Was all the tread gone? Are they industrial tires?

Tells me that the front tires were carrying a lot of weight (dirt) on very abrasive surfaces. So they wore out quickly. Makes me wonder what the front axles look like.
Bob