Price Check TC-18 Pricing & suitability

[TomOfTarsus]

Hi all!
Hope I'm not a 1-thread wonder! I have 5.75 acres that is quite steep in places, and hilly in general. No commercial stuff going on.

I'd like to be able to mow the mowable parts, do some light digging, carry or drag firewood and perhaps sled some saw logs downhill (10-20" dia), and tend the garden, which I assume will be larger if I have the equipment, and snow removal in extreme situations (driveway is asphalt and only 100' long). I may pull light trees over. Tying off high, axing some roots and pulling is, I think, easier than digging the stumps out later. (I also have a 1500/3000 lb. rope haul for this, and/or a Jeep).
A person who seems to be quite meticulous, and who is also known to my son's best friend as a good coworker, is selling a NH TC18, 1999, 580 hrs. It has a front loader, chains, ag tires, 4WD, 60 inch belly mower, a "harrow", the older 7160 FEL, and a back blade that swivels and tilts (the only non-NH accesory as I can see).

I don't know if it has the hydrostatic transmission or the power steering.
He's asking $9K. For $400 more I can get a titled trailer that will haul the thing. Wife is (as usual) less than enthusiastic. Plus, I've never even had a riding mower before, much less a machine like this. But if I survive(?!), I think I could put it to good use.

So is it (a) a steal, (b) about average, or (c) a rip.

My browsing thus far says its "b" w/o hydro and pwr. steering and "a" with those two. What say ye?

Thanks to all for your time. This thing is going away pretty quick, my son closes on the house Thursday (1/31/08) and unless an agreement is reached, he's taking the thing. But I'm not really sure it's the machine for me. My wife is "skeert" (scared) because it's used.

Tom

 

[MrJimi]

Welcome to TBN, I would say look at what others are selling for at places like fleabay, machinertrader and lots more
Jim

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Thanks for the new resources, I have checked other places online but hadn't seen all of those yet.

Tom

 

[Soundguy]

I looked at a tc18, 2wd, gear, no loader or mower in 2000.. it was 7700$

I'd say yours is a good deal.. especially if you are getting a decent trailer for 400$.

Do look around on machinery trader online.. and the local paper.. so you can get a feel for the prices of the implements.. etc.

I usually count use dimplements at no more than half$ of new.. unless they are truly very new, or NOS.. then then 75-90% of new price seems fair. The 4wd is a BIG plus for loader work and hills.. and the the FEL is a big expense.. at least a couple thou to consider.

I'd deffinately put that inthe running and compair it to others you see..

if it has been maintaned good, that further helps the deal..

soundguy

 

[TomOfTarsus]

What are the advantages or differences of hydro? As I said, I'ven never even had a riding mower before. Is it worth more? I'm getting the feeling that "purists" go with the gearbox. Hydro is like automatic, right?

 

[jbrumberg]

TomOfTarsus:

Welcome to TBN and the Blue Forum ! There have been many, many threads and posts about the relative merits of gear vs. HST tractors here on TBN . Everyone has an opinion (including myself ). I have owned both a gear driven and an HST driven tractor. IMHO for serious dirtwork highload bearing tasks you are probably better off with gears; for FEL work and lighter ground engaging tasks like tilling and/or mowing I would recommend HST. HST is kind of like automatic. The mistake most new HST owners make is when the tractor is starting to RPM down and/or lug the engine while under task they have a tendency to "floor" the treadle/peddle (which in effect puts you in a higher gear). One should back off the the treadle/peddle (lower gear). I will not go into a dialog about the relationship between throttle and treadle. Jay

PS: BTW I think the TC-18 is a pretty good deal. Try to find out if it is a D or DA series. That will tell you a lot about the features.

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Thanks, I guess I should search out the hydro thing. I'm on fairly limited time. & yes, flooring it would probably be my first thought as well, but to be forwarned... My guess is that it's a D, not DA.

Have a look!

 

[jbrumberg]

Tom:

Nice picture ! The tractor looks in pretty good shape from the picture . My eyes are not as good as they used to be good , but there does appear to be an HST treadle/peddle on the operator's platform. The difference between a D and a DA has nothing to do with performance just some amenities. Jay

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Drat, I only have one picture from that side. And I had to reduce the size because of upload restrictions. Any other way to tell?

BTW, the mower is a New Holland 914A.

 

[BigE_]

I just saw that same configuration for sale around here (PDX, Oregon) on Craigslist for $9k, so that seems to be in the right price range. Difference was a box blade instead of back blade.

I have about 5 acres, very hilly, and recently purchased a TC33. For some things, it has been about the right size (unloading logs from the trailer, hauling firewood, skidding logs uphill (30 degree slope)). For other things, it is a bit too big.

For my most recent project, I picked up a 66" box blade and proceeded to level an area for a mini-barn for the sheep. The footprint of the barn is only 7'x8' (only two sheep), but I ended up clearing out a place 10' wide by about 30' long, simply because I needed room to maneuver. A smaller tractor would have been nice there.

You'll definitely get more seat time with a smaller tractor, simply because some things will take you longer, but that's half the fun, right? You'll end up paying 2x as much for all of those implements (appropriately sized) on a TC33.

Hydro is definitely easier to learn to use, but people have been using geared tractors for *many* years.

That's a steal on the trailer. I just paid $2k for a custom built 7000lb 16' bed trailer, no tilt.

My $0.02.

Regards,
-Steve

 

[Inspector507]

In the picture it does appear that it is HST. But those do not look like AG tires, they're Industrials or R-4's, if I'm seeing right. The 1999 TC18 is strictly that, no D or DA.
Mine is a 2003 with HST/914 mower/LA12 loader and sold for $12,000. $400 for the trailer may be a great deal depending on its condition. If you're looking at pulling trees over and skidding 20" diameter logs, be careful as the tractor is only 1400 lbs plus loader weight.
I'd say 9K may be a decent deal if it has been maintained well.

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Ambivalence, ambivalence...

I wasn't really quite ready to ge a machine yet, but this seemed like a good opportunity. One thing I've thought of over the evening is that it has no bagger (which may be a hoot to some of you!) I'm really stuggling, some places I need MORE machine (logs), and some places less, like a little riiding mower.

My temptation is toward the "more" side, though, as much of the yard I mow can be done (or must be done) as I always have, with my trusty Sensation 19" graveyard mower. Best hand mower ever made, hands down. Bought it in 1980, I'm making drawings so that if the housing goes I can have someone make me another.

The mowing this thing would do really wouldn't need to be bagged- the road through the land, the rough area below the garden, the just-getting-started orchard, trails up on the hill, that sort of thing. Yeah, I just may have re-talked myself into it. Yah can't pull a brush hog behind a riding mower!

The only other thing I've looked at closely is a Simplicity 4wd sub-compact, 25 Hp roughly, Briggs & Stratton diesel. It had a rear 540 rpm PTO and 3 pt hitch, loader available, but configured this way and new would have been $15K or better. Wife had cardiac episode just thinking I'd go for that! Anyway, it seems a bit small for what I want as I think about it.

And you can see my ignorance. I thought they were ag tires 'cause they had a large diagonal tread. Turf tires I'd have recognized.

Thank you all, I really appreciate the help. This whole "land" thing has just happeend over the last couple of years. It's been a blessing, the only real chance of makeing a nice sellable property out of a poorly sited house that I biult when I was young and dumb(er).

Anyone have links to hydro vs. geared? I'm a mechanical engineer and so understand about throttle, torque, rpm and power. The info may help on the learning curve.

And please, if you think of anything, keep it coming. Maybe someday I can give it back.

Thanks again,

Tom

 

[jbrumberg]

In the picture it does appear that it is HST. But those do not look like AG tires, they're Industrials or R-4's, if I'm seeing right. The 1999 TC18 is strictly that, no D or DA.
Mine is a 2003 with HST/914 mower/LA12 loader and sold for $12,000. $400 for the trailer may be a great deal depending on its condition. If you're looking at pulling trees over and skidding 20" diameter logs, be careful as the tractor is only 1400 lbs plus loader weight.
I'd say 9K may be a decent deal if it has been maintained well.

Inspector507:

Good eyes and information. I also agree with your cautioning as to tractor task vs. tractor size. I definitely had to approach tasks differently when I had my old Ford 1100 (13/11+ HP) vs my new NH TC29DA (29/23+ HP). For mowing the "lawn" I have a White 1650 LT. The tractor is for rotary cutting (sometimes the "lawn") the field/trails and "tractor stuff" . Jay

PS: I do miss the old Ford in the woods as it was smaller and much more stable.

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Jay, Inspector, Steve & all,

Thanks again, esp. for the cautionary info. Yes, I knew the machine was pretty light, compared to a 20" log. Fortunately (if I can keep the log behind me- ) it's all downhill with the logs.

Due to the steepness I was anticipating weights, filled tires, etc. - like carrying a bucketful of wood downhill, may need rear counterweight - or maybe the filled tires would be enough - trouble is, you may not know it's not enough until it's not enough and you're head-over-tincups.

Do they publish weights, CG's, front/rear wheel weight distributions, etc? If I had good data on the empty tractor and implements to start with, it'd take me a long way down the road - the calculations aren't that difficult, and I could at least get a feel for what I'd need going downhill with a bucket, or skidding a log, etc. Pulling a tree over, if your tied up high I figure you're done when the rear wheels lift off! I've seen the warnings about being tied off low and it makes sense - it'll pull your front end up quick.

I think that's a lot of my wife's concern, she figures I'll end up on a slab... but then, I've never had to worry the entire time we've been married, nearly 33 years now, she's always worried more than enough for both of us.

That, and she wants to remodel the kitchen! (but so do I...)

Thanks again,

Tom

 

[jbrumberg]

Tom:

Just be careful skidding logs downhill. They can get away from you pretty quick ! I use my box blade/scraper as a 500 pound counterweight in addition to weighted tires and I will still get some "bounce" at times with FEL work. I have been looking for published CG's, "footprint" data, etc. for awhile now. There is not a lot of published material for SCUT's and CUT's out there. Pennsylvania State University (my old alma mater) did some interesting tractor rollover experiments years ago. Jay

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Well, for skidding saw logs, I was figuring on chaining around one end and dragging it behind me - like I said, as long as it stays behind me! But it should, I wouldn't drive on something THAT steep. But yeah, a load of logs in the FEL I can understand could bounce you. Keep the bucket low and ready to drop, eh?

Just a thought, would it be better to back down?

Nowadays, all that CG stuff would be easy, with solid modeling software and what not. Don't know if they had those lovely tools in 1997, but a company as big as NH/Ford sure should have. Criminiee, even with what we have here I can get CG's, mass moments of inertia, etc. in minutes on fairly large assembles, once the materials and geometry are in there.

Western MA - did a few jobs east of Northampton at a pumped storage station in the Berkshires. Pretty county. Bigger hills than mine!

Thanks again,

Tom

 

[Solo]

Did you buy it Tom?

Solo

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Ah, almost! My b'loved & I had some "discussions" - you wouldn't believe how many issues surround this thing - and I believe now she's at least on board with it, if I consider it to be the "right" machine. I'll add that he did throw in the trailer, and had forgotten about a lawn roller attachement (homemade, I think) that goes with it as well.

Everything you buy is a compromise of some sort, but the only one I see here is it's not really suitable for lawn mowing. If I get that 914a mower deck too close to the house, I'll be spraying grass clippings all over creation - or, more properly, our many flower beds, the sidewalk, the side of the house... The Simplicity SCUT I looked at did have bagging capability (for a price, of course - I was at $15K with that one and still didn't have the capabilites this one has.) Plus, of course, it's just too big for wheeling around detail areas.

My ground is really steep (young & dumb when I built there) and so the yard has evolved into these sort of countoured strips that I have been mowing by hand. Some of this will still be necessary, I can't get any sort of tractor into the yard on one side of the house. But the other side is more open, and bagging ability would save me valuable time.

I'm going to go give it a full inspection & test drive, I'll probably buy it - Shoot, if I get the ground cleared and countoured and find the thing isn't useful anymore, I sell it, right? But I think not. This is the function list I see now:

• Moving firewood
• Dragging logs
• Hauling fall yard debris further from the house.
• Helping with stumps and tree felling
• Light grading & shaping
• Enables us to have a bigger garden
• Keep paths mowed through the wooded parts (helps stop the vine & poison ivy from spreading), as well as 450' of lane, and about an acre of proposed garden/orchard area below the house.
• Snow removal (occasional - if we have one of those 3' blizzards)
• Spreading & moving mulch, gravel, etc.

And of course, with the PTO's, more attachements can add more functionality. A tiller would be my first thought.

So if any of y'all are praying types, I'd appreciate it. It's a pretty big decision for me. But it's looking smarter all the time.

Thanks for everyone's help, it's been great. I'll let you know in the next couple of days.

Tom

 

[jwstewar]

Tom, don't forget with the 914A you can get a rear-discharge deck as well. As long as you keep the grass mowed and don't mow when it is wet, it works pretty well. It will not through grass all over your flower beds. Best part about it is, you can "trim" with whatever side of the tractor happens to be there. You also don't have to worry about empty a bagger. Let the trimmings fertilize the lawn.

 

[TomOfTarsus]

Thanks, but the 914A is the one that comes with the tractor, so I'd have to trade it or something. However, whilst I should be working (shame on me!) I jumped onto New Hollandd's site and found that I can get a grass collection system for the 914A 60" side discharge deck!

Now if that one will fit a 1999 version, this fellow will be happy, happy, happy!

I know what you mean about being able to trip on both sides, though. My Sensation graveyard mower (now approaching 30 years old) can trim at the front and on both sides, with unbagged discharge going out the read at a 45 deg. angle. Since it has a mid-mounted handle that can swing over to the other direction, I can mow the steep hill behind the house by following the contour back and forth, without ever turning the mower around, and with the discharge always pointing away from the house. It's a stupendous detail mower except that I can't bag with it. So I have a separate wimpy little bagger for up next to the house, and the yard areas where people would likely track grass into the house. Like I said, one of those yards a tractor literally can't get to.

I don't know if the tractor will be able to handle that steep area behind the or not. What's the rule? If you can't back up in 2WD, don't drive on it, 4WD or not?

Thanks again all, I'll be a lot happier if that bagger attachemnt works and is affordable. I'm going to do some work now!

Tom