Submersible well pump went out, thoughts?

[priberc]

The water pressure dropped sometime last week so I finally looked into it today and the pressure tank is fine, pressure switch is fine but it would only get to 30psi and the pump was running constant so I went further up the line and found a piece of teflon in the flow restrictor, thought it was from the check valve, nope... I do have a sand problem (or did for a few years after I moved in) so the pump apparently can't make pressure anymore and lost a part of it... I bought the house in '14 and the well was put in the year before that so it isn't that old, the well is around 100' deep if memory serves. I lowered the pressure switch setpoint so it turns off at 30psi and on at 20 so it's at least not running constantly anymore...

So, I know I gotta get a new pump, current is a 3/4hp 4" 3 wire unit since it has a control box and I checked and it has 3 wires plus ground... Home Depot has a pump for $479, Lowes has one for $469, Amazon has them for $200 on up... Which way would you go?

If it was installed in '13 is it likely iron pipe or plastic? The roof panel on the pump house is easy to get off so I'm not worried about that. I didn't think of pulling the cap off the tube when I had the check valve off...

#1 consideration for cutting cost "you get what you pay for" and how often do you want to replace your well pump?
Do you need a 3/4hp pump for a 100' well? The old well here is 300' deep and it used a 3/4hp pump. You may be able to go to a 1/2h pump. The price difference may not be that great though.....might be worth looking into
That said the old pump in the well here looked after a family of 6 and a herd of 75+/- dairy cows chickens garden etc etc. The original brushed pump lasted +/- 3 decades before it was replaced the first time. Modern brushless pumps should last much much longer. So IMO it might be an idea to look at the brand of pump you pull out and make sure you don't buy another

 

[Carl_NH]

It's not the HP it's the GPM you need or can draw, and the depth of the well. The number of stages varies across the pumps too depending on the GPM needed and depth. A 1/2HP pump can easily manage a 100' well and the example Goulds 7GS (7 GPM) listed here the flow rate is around 8-9 GPM at 100'. Goulds 7GS05422C, 7GPM, 1/2HP, 230V, 2 Wire, 4" Stainless Steel Submersible Well Pump

 

[Bentrim]

Haven't read all the posts but here are my experiences. Put a sears (made by Jacuzzi) pump down about 200 feet in 84. 3 wire pump with control box, 1 inch black plastic pipe. Pulled the pump about 2 years later due to lightening. Installed new sears pump about 2 years later pulled pump due to no water, found one of the wires rubbed thru repaired and put it back down. About 1 1/2 years later pulled pump again. Yep another lightening strike. Replaced pump with a Goulds 2 wire no control box. At the same time replaced wire and zip tied wire to pipe so wire could not touch sides of well. About 6 years later pulled pump splines had worn off motor. replaced motor and shaft and reinstalled. That pump lasted until about 4 years ago when it died again. Found and installed a Sta Rite. No issues YET! Forgot one time had to pull the pump, the check valve had died. I'm sure I forgot a time or two. I'm glad I have 3 strong sons!
Not a water systems expect but have you checked the pipe in the well or the pipe from the well to the tank? Sometimes a leak will allow pressure to build so far but no more. Also you sand you have a sandy well. That can grind the impellers on the pump and they won't make enough pressure.
The horsepower of the pump is determined by the depth of the water in the well and how much lift is needed.
The number of pump elements determines the maximum depth a pump can be used. Size of elements determines GPM.
Unless you want exercise pulling the pump don't cheap out on the pump, talk to plumbers or those the sell pump and if they tell the truth get one recommended for a long life.
Oh yes don't use plastic fitting (or pipe adapters) in the well, they break from torque of the pump stopping and starting. No brass either, lead! Use stainless steel.
I speak from not only my personal experience but I worked at a mobile home park that used 5 wells for water the used pumps in the well house with 20 large pressure tanks.

 

[TT45]

The water pressure dropped sometime last week so I finally looked into it today and the pressure tank is fine, pressure switch is fine but it would only get to 30psi and the pump was running constant so I went further up the line and found a piece of teflon in the flow restrictor, thought it was from the check valve, nope... I do have a sand problem (or did for a few years after I moved in) so the pump apparently can't make pressure anymore and lost a part of it... I bought the house in '14 and the well was put in the year before that so it isn't that old, the well is around 100' deep if memory serves. I lowered the pressure switch setpoint so it turns off at 30psi and on at 20 so it's at least not running constantly anymore...

So, I know I gotta get a new pump, current is a 3/4hp 4" 3 wire unit since it has a control box and I checked and it has 3 wires plus ground... Home Depot has a pump for $479, Lowes has one for $469, Amazon has them for $200 on up... Which way would you go?

If it was installed in '13 is it likely iron pipe or plastic? The roof panel on the pump house is easy to get off so I'm not worried about that. I didn't think of pulling the cap off the tube when I had the check valve off...

I had more than a few water well pump problems. Have an 85' curbed well that is great, but through the years I have gone through 3 pumps.

You mention sand. If your pump is getting sand the first thing, after pulling the old pump to determine the actual problem, would be to raise your pump level several feet to get away from the sand. I had similar problem that knocked out my first pump . Raised it 6 feet and end of sandy water.

For anyone looking for good practical info on water wells, this YouTuber is good. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpraCm5vF0MVAyqgduhSCgQ/videos

Suspect that your pump, having been pumping sand, has impeller wear. When you replace with a new pump, first use a good USA made pump and replace the pressure switch with one that automatically shuts off if water pressure goes below 20 psi. This will save a pump. You have to manually restart the pump, but once back above 20 psi its again full auto.

Most likely the primary problem is the sand. Not only will the sand eat impellers, it erodes check valves and all other components. Once you get new pump above the sandy water level, pump should be OK.

 

[LD1]

Not a well expert, but my thoughts.

1. Agree that 3/4 HP is overkill.
2. I'm not betting a leak if it holds pressure (whatever it can get to).
3. Not guessing an issue with pressure switch feed tube either. Yes if the feed tube were plugged, the pump wouldn't cut off like it's supposed to.....but you would have max pressure the pump would be capable of.

Pop the cap to the well....listen down it. If you "hear" running water you likely have a leak.

Most old wells only have a check valve right above the pump. So a leak in the line somewhere would mean once well cut off....pressure would bleed down at tank rather quickly. But sounds like you have other check valves.

With regard to pump selection.....stick with name brand. Last time I replaced mine it was with a Myers/pentair. Franklin, Gould's, and grundfoss are also high end stuff.

Watch the Amazon stuff. I was looking at some of the "china" pumps.....and their numbers look good, like a 3/4hp 29gpm pump......but then you look at the flow chart.....and it's max is 207' of head and my well is 170 deep.....which would be like 4gpm.

So just make sure you compare apples to apples if you go the Chinese route

 

[rangerfredbob]

My brother and a friend are coming over on Saturday, we'll figure it out one way or another...

On the sand, it was pretty bad at first, the well was new just before I bought the house in '14, I used to have to clean the filters every couple weeks, now I just change the fine ones every few months and there's no sand out of the sand separator that I've seen in a long time so that is fixed...

3/4 hp might be overkill but better than the other way, I didn't hire the well driller and haven't seen them in person even, the bank hired everything (foreclosure, they were doing the minimum to sell it and try to make some money).

I'll fix the pressure tank pressure balance and pressure switch settings once we get the well working right again... I was just over it and made it work...

 

[Carl_NH]

Rangerfredbob - as TT45 said pick up a new pressure switch 30-50 or 40-60 with low pressure cutoff to protect the pump from an issue of well running dry, or a filter before the switch gets plugged up. HD or Lowes has these in stock usually.

Then set your pump a little higher in the well - maybe 5-8' from where it is now as sand could have settled in the bottom.

Then set your pressure tank precharge at 2PSI below the pump cut in pressure (38 if 40/60 and 28 if 30/50). You will need a 1" threaded pipe with a Tee handle to lift the pump off the Pitless adapter unless your pipe comes out the top of the well head?

Good luck this weekend.

 

[rangerfredbob]

No pitless in this setup, it's just coming out the top of the casing plug from the looks of it, maybe I'll post the pic I took of the top of the well last weekend later tonight, haven't gotten it off the phone yet... It's at least not a buried well like some of you have, there is no frost line requirement in Oregon and there's just a pump house (IE rubbermaid plastic shed in this case...) with a heat lamp on a temp switch...

Conveniently I think the sand took out the check valve on the pump or there's a break in the up pipe since it drains back some with the pump off so that should take the weight off some...

 

[JRH02]

Pulled and replaced many a pump over the years. Anyone else remember the 1 1/4" steel pipe in 20' sections?

Yup, on the Aeromotor windmill feeding a bottomless tank in the pasture.

 

[rangerfredbob]

Project is complete... Pump was set with Sch 80 PVC before which we decided to cut on the way up, was threaded at the junctions but didn't know that when we started... oh well, off to Lowes to get some 160psi rated black poly pipe and clamps and the pliers for that for like $130 more... They didn't put in a safety rope before so there's one in there now. Was definitely the pump as it cycles just fine now, even got the pressure switch set back where it was or close. We stirred up a bunch of junk so the water was kinda gross so it'll need to settle for a bit, but I have a bunch of filters so not worried...

I'm pretty sure I remember reading my well is 96' deep or something but apparently they set the well at 80' since there were 4 pieces of PVC, the wire was nice, basically like Romex, it was perfectly fine, we set the pump at the same depth for now.

If it was poly pipe the first time around we would have been done in like an hour, but being PVC there was some screwing around...